Toms - Sennheiser e604/e904, Audix D2 and Beyer TG D57c

[dickiefunk]

Hi guys,

Sorry to post another thread about tom mics but this is regarding these four mics specifically.
Originally I was considering going the budget route but I've been listening to to various online a/b's and I simply think these mics sound much better than the budget options I have been considering. As a result I'm probably going to save longer and probably go with one of these options! At the moment I can only source the e604's to try so have a few specific questions :-

How do these mics compare regarding rejecting bleed from other drums?
Is there a big difference in the output of these mics?
How do they compare regarding reliability and build quality?
Will the Beyer TG D57c condenser have more bleed from the rest of the drums compared to the various dynamics I've mentioned?

I've got some K&M 24030 drum mic clips as these are generally preferred over the plastic clips that come on a lot of drum mics.

http://products.k-m.de/us/product?info=1077&xe455a=9051d739e49639caf0c1e039c4c9f37c

I will be doing some comparisons of various budget mics and the e604's out of curiosity just to hear how they compare out of curiosity.

[Bob Bickerton]

I'm not familiar with the Beyer, so can't comment there.

I have one e604, two D2s and a D4 (which I generally assign to Floor Tom duties).

It may answer your question when I say I can't remember the last time I used the e604.

But to answer your questions specifically.

I've never noticed a problem with bleed from the D2s, but then my approach is one of not being too paranoid about bleed anyway.

With out doing an A/B I'd guess the outputs are similar, maybe the D2 is a little hotter, but I've never had an issue where it's anywhere near too hot for my consoles.

Both are built well, the D2 has a metal casing versus the e604s plastic.

The D2 is my go to mic on toms, cahon and bodhran and gives me a produced sound from the get go. Having said that I also have a couple of Beyer M201s which are in a different class again but they tend to get reserved for one her stuff like snare and sax in a live scenario.

Bob

[Wonks]

You can only look at the polar patterns for the mics with respect to potential bleed levels. Positioning of the mics with respect to cymbals and other toms is going to play just a big a part in the amount of bleed you get than the mics' polar patterns.

On single headed toms you've always got the option of micing up within the shell and so reducing bleed levels significantly - but that depends on the drummer.

As most of your tom sound is probably going to come from your overheads anyway, the tom mics are going to be relatively low down in the mix, so bleed isn't really an issue.

[Dave B]

As most of your tom sound is probably going to come from your overheads anyway

Good point - it has to be a large gig for me to want to do that. For most pubs, clubs, halls, etc a good pair of overheads, kick and snare are all that's needed. More mics = more headaches imho.

[dickiefunk]

Hi guys. I had the opportunity to do a drum mic shootout today at the local Uni in their theatre. We did the shootout through their in house flown EV line array system. The mics we had available were :-

T.Bone CD55 (budget e604 copies)
EV PL35
AKG D40
Shure PG56
Sennheiser e604
Audix D2
Audix D4
Audix D6
Shure Beta 98

This is a pic from the session though the mics changed position quite a bit



I did the shootout with the main in house engineer and another very experienced engineer who has mixed a lot of the top UK artistes over the past 20-30 years!

Our favourites on rack toms was the Sennheiser e604 which sounded really great. It had impressive low end extension but still had excellent clarity. Surprisingly our second choice was the Shure PGA56. This mic sounded surprisingly natural and full but lacked a little of the low frequencies of the 604. The Audix D2/D4's were our next favourites but we all found these to sound quite coloured compared to the natural sound of the drum. We were quite disappointed by the Shure Beta 98 and were expecting to like this mic a lot more. As for the remaining mics they were all quite underwhelming and to be honest I would have probably gone for the £15 Thomann CD55.
As for floor tom our clear favourite was the Audix D6 by quite a long way! This mic sounded simply stunning on floor tom. Our next favourites were either the Audix D4 or Sennheiser e604 with once again the Shure PG56 close behind. We liked the D4 and e604 for different reasons but the D4 possibly had the edge. As for the others they sounded even less appealing on floor tom than they did on rack toms!!
Finally we put a few mics on snare (SM57, Audix i5, e604 and AKG D40). I've always been a fan of the Audix i5 but was surprised we all preferred a couple of the other mics. The mic that we all preferred was the Shure SM57 followed by the AKG D40! The i5 was our third favourite followed by the e604!

Whilst this test was far from perfect it did give us all an idea of how these mics sounded and we could hear the general characteristics of these mics.

At the moment it looks like I'm going to be doing some serious saving for an Audix D6 and some Sennheiser e604's. I'll probably stick with the AKG D40 on snare though as this performed very respectably for this.

I would still like to compare the e904's with the e604's but I certainly wouldn't be disappointed with the 604's! I also really like how small and compact they are and they were the easiest to put on and take off the drums!!

[Dave Rowles]

Interesting!

Though I suppose it'll be dependant on a few factors. I've always liked the sound the Beta98s produce, so I'm surprised they did not do better in the test. Did you test them all in context of the whole kit or just in individual drums separate from the kit?

I've got e904s, and I prefer them by far over the e604, though it's a little more bulky which might be an issue.

[dickiefunk]

Yes the resident engineer was surprised that the beta 98's didn't do better as he regularly uses them.

I'm really keen to try the e904's and do a comparison with the e604's.

[ben howes]

Great news, as I have a couple of 604. They score for convenience, but I found the clip was not as versatile as a Proel model which allows positioning of the mic a little further away. This enables a little more 'drum' sound vs 'head' sound. I may buy another 604.

[James Perrett]

Great news, as I have a couple of 604. They score for convenience, but I found the clip was not as versatile as a Proel model which allows positioning of the mic a little further away.

Many years ago MarkPAMan showed me a neat trick with the 604 clips - just attach the mic to the back of the clip and have it facing round the side. However, I usually use them on short stands anyway.

[Drew Stephenson]

Many years ago MarkPAMan showed me a neat trick with the 604 clips - just attach the mic to the back of the clip and have it facing round the side. However, I usually use them on short stands anyway.

Simple, but brilliant!

[chris...]

Which version of Shure Beta 98 was tried ? As I understand it there are several, and I don't see any in the pic.

[MarkPAman]

Many years ago MarkPAMan showed me a neat trick with the 604 clips - just attach the mic to the back of the clip and have it facing round the side. However, I usually use them on short stands anyway.

Simple, but brilliant!

That just about sums me up!

[Stef Andrews]

Many years ago MarkPAMan showed me a neat trick with the 604 clips - just attach the mic to the back of the clip and have it facing round the side. However, I usually use them on short stands anyway.

Simple, but brilliant!

That just about sums me up!

Apologies if I'm being thick, but I can't picture this at all. Have you got a pic of one or something?