Small Condenser for Acoustic Guitar

[Minwah]

I am looking for a small condenser mic for acoustic guitar recording, for no more than ~£200. I want the option for cardioid or omni patterns, and have come up with the following options:

Sontronics STC-1
SE Electronics sE2a
Oktava MK012
Rode NT55

I currently have a Samson C02 so I would think any of these would be a decent upgrade. The only mic I have heard (not used myself though) is the Oktava, which I have been quite impressed with.

Not sure if it matters but eventually I will want to use this with a (probably large condenser) figure 8 mic for mid-side recordings.

If anyone has used any of these mics for acoustic guitar (particularly fingerpicking) I would be appreciate your thoughts. At the moment I am probably leaning towards the Oktava as a fairly safe bet...

Thanks!

[Bob Bickerton]

Only familiar with the NT55, but would heartily recommend it. The cardioid capsule rates well and the omni capsule is excellent.

Bob

[ProximityProduction]

+ 1 for the NT55

[Mike Stranks]

I upgraded from the Samson C02 to the Rode NT5 - a VERY marked improvement!

[Minwah]

Thanks for the replies...I will go for the Rode then!

[tacitus]

Hold on! Just before you rush out for your NT55:
I have NT55s and the Oktava 012, and while I don't think you'll go wrong with either, my personal preference in cardioid mode is the Oktava. I love them both as omnis but if you can get to compare them I'd recommend that you do. You can also use a wider range of capsules on the Oktava, including, IIRC, a fig 8 via an adapter. You could end up with a pair of 012s with cardioid and omni caps - great for stereo - plus a fig 8 for mid/side.

That said, if you've already ordered the Rode, you won't be sorry.

[Billum]

+1 for the NT55 with its omni head on for acoustic gtr quite close up, with possibly a LDC a bit further back to pick up more body (but watch for phase issues).

[Mike Stranks]

... and I've heard good reports of these:

Nohype CM3

for their open and neutral sound...

... anyone here have direct experience?

[Minwah]

+1 for the NT55 with its omni head on for acoustic gtr quite close up, with possibly a LDC a bit further back to pick up more body (but watch for phase issues).

I will give this a go, but I would also like to be able to get a decent sound from just the one small condenser...I'm thinking omni would work better for this than cardioid?

With my Samson C02's I have got a reasonable sound using a spaced pair, but struggle with just one mic to find a good balance. I am hoping the use of an omni pattern will make this a bit easier.

[Minwah]

You can also use a wider range of capsules on the Oktava, including, IIRC, a fig 8 via an adapter. You could end up with a pair of 012s with cardioid and omni caps - great for stereo - plus a fig 8 for mid/side.

Not a bad idea...I was thinking of buying a large condenser in the future but this would be a more versatile way to do it, for what I want to record.

[Billum]

+1 for the NT55 with its omni head on for acoustic gtr quite close up, with possibly a LDC a bit further back to pick up more body (but watch for phase issues).

I will give this a go, but I would also like to be able to get a decent sound from just the one small condenser...I'm thinking omni would work better for this than cardioid?

Yes, an omni definitely works better than cardioid for a one-mic option, and the NT55 does this very well. An omni picks up much more of the complex multi-source radiation of a guitar's strings and body than you would get from a cardioid when it's reasonably close to the instrument.

In my recommendation the LDC at a distance was really an 'optional extra' according to taste!

[grab]

At the risk of dirtying things up with cross-posting, there's a thread running about a group buy of Karma mics...

[LRS]

I have both the NT5's and Oktava's. Personally I would pump for the Oktava's as they are are a better "all round" mic IMO. I also use them for drum overheads and I think they are streets ahead of the Rodes for that purpose. On acoustic guitar the Oktava's are a bit "woodier" and the Rodes a bit brighter. It all comes down to preference. Both good mics.

There is (or has been) an issue with quality control with the Oktava's though. Not sure how they are these days. I was lucky with mine.

Cheers
Graham

[Jeraldo]

I have both the NT5's and Oktava's. Personally I would pump for the Oktava's as they are are a better "all round" mic IMO. I also use them for drum overheads and I think they are streets ahead of the Rodes for that purpose. On acoustic guitar the Oktava's are a bit "woodier" and the Rodes a bit brighter. It all comes down to preference. Both good mics.

There is (or has been) an issue with quality control with the Oktava's though. Not sure how they are these days. I was lucky with mine.

Cheers
Graham

A minority opinion, for sure, but the Rode mic's have always sounded "plasticky" or "transistorish" to me, though this is more apparent on some sources more than another. It's always very apparent to my ears on a piano from an octave above middle c on up. Even on sources such as a metal flute, there is this amp signature. To be fair, though, more people than not like the Rode mic's.

The Octava's are excellent, full and nicely balanced sounding mic's, but quality control has been and seemingly always will be an issue. I know as I have several. Any potential buyer will have to accept the probability that they'll fail and have to be worked on at some point. Both of my older ones failed and had to be repaired. A newer one, probably 2 or 3 years old is still working without repair. But a year ago or so when I tried to buy another new body, I received two with widely spaced serial numbers from the "national distributor" (that means almost nothing with Octava) with miswired pins. Back they went. The parts used in the Oktava mic's change at whim, and the mic amp characteristics-particularly phantom current required and noise-may vary widely over time. (I have to give full marks to the national distributor for taking the mic's back without problem.)

If the Rode mic's work for the OP, then great. If not, the STC's might be considered-or Oktava, or else something more upmarket, and there are many different directions to go in terms of timbre.

BTW, the Oktava cardioid is really a wide cardioid, with the appropriate pattern at the rear. The hypercardioid vaguely resembles a hypercardioid and has a consistent off axis response, but without the deep nulls.

(Since someone inevitably comes along whenever Oktava mic's are mentioned to caution against the "Chinese fakes," know that those "fakes" aren't, and those Chinese versions will likely sound better, perform better and are more reliable than the ones from Russia. It's a long story and the Chinese mic's are no longer being manufactured, to my knowledge.)

[Minwah]

Thanks for the further replies...

I am still not 100% sure but think I will try the Rode mic. The potential reliability issue puts me off the Oktava's slightly, although I will only be using the mic occasionally so possibly not an issue (?)

I don't have the money yet anyway, so I have plenty of time to think about it. Maybe I will be able to find somewhere I can try the mic out first before I buy...

[Len]

I am a big fan of the Rode NT4 (stereo mic) and the NT6. You can hear the NT4 in action at www.youtube.com/user/leonardngmusic - all 3 videos were recorded into Cubase through a NT4, dbx 386 into Cubase 6.

[DAGGILARR]

I got a pair of NT55's on ebay for £300, I purchased them as used and was delighted to find them as new.

I made my choice based on the recommendations on here and other research.

[ef37a]

http://www.sontronics.com/stc1.htm

Just a fort?

Dave.

[Tomás Mulcahy]

A minority opinion, for sure, but the Rode mic's have always sounded "plasticky" or "transistorish" to me, though this is more apparent on some sources more than another. It's always very apparent to my ears on a piano from an octave above middle c on up. Even on sources such as a metal flute, there is this amp signature.

100% agree. All Rodes have that signature that I personally (and a couple of other engineers I know) really dislike. Although there was one time where it worked great on a metal flute! But for drums, piano, and acoustic guitar... no.

I think the little Beyerdynamic MCE530 sound super on acoustic guitar. Better than Neumann KM184, which is another very over rated mic.

[petev3.1]

Geraldo ... A minority opinion, for sure, but the Rode mic's have always sounded "plasticky" or "transistorish" to me, though this is more apparent on some sources more than another. It's always very apparent to my ears on a piano from an octave above middle c on up. Even on sources such as a metal flute, there is this amp signature. To be fair, though, more people than not like the Rode mic's.

Agreed. I have two old NT5s and find them very unpleasant on (classical) acoustic gtr. They're for sale if anyone wants to pay to confirm this.

[Mike Stranks]

Geraldo ... A minority opinion, for sure, but the Rode mic's have always sounded "plasticky" or "transistorish" to me, though this is more apparent on some sources more than another. It's always very apparent to my ears on a piano from an octave above middle c on up. Even on sources such as a metal flute, there is this amp signature. To be fair, though, more people than not like the Rode mic's.

Agreed. I have two old NT5s and find them very unpleasant on (classical) acoustic gtr. They're for sale if anyone wants to pay to confirm this.

... OK; but the application is key...

A week or two ago I was running live-sound for an acoustic guitar duo - one classical guitar and one steel-string amplified through good-quality pick-ups.

The classical guitarist brought his AKG414 which he uses all the time for classical recording and we've used succesfully before for live work. But on this occasion and in this room the sound was the pits - irrespective of mic position and desk EQ. Fortunately I had my box of mics with me so decided to see what a different mic might do. I tried an NT5 first, but needed to experiment no further... everything just came together and smiles replaced worried looks.

Would I use the NT5 to record him? Probably not, but in this context it was the right mic.

So how much for your NT5s?

[chew_rocket]

i also own a pair of NT5s and love them to bits. I think they're great on acoustic guitar more than anything.

[Zukan]

The NTs are good and the Octavias will add some top end but the STC-1s are not that great. I tested them for my book and did eventually use them but only for budget tutorial purposes. I found them to be too brittle and narrow banded.

There are some great mics out there that will do the job equally but if you can access the NTs then give them a run and check the results. They work fine.

[The Elf]

I only ever had great results with my NT5s, leading me to purchase the even better NT55s. It sounds like someone should snap up a bargain from you quickly!

[Mike Stranks]

I only ever had great results with my NT5s, leading me to purchase the even better NT55s. It sounds like someone should snap up a bargain from you quickly!

Oi! I'm first in the queue!