Question on mixing virtual instruments

[wuubb]

So I have a movement of an orchestral piece I composed I'm rendering using the East West Hollywood libraries in Pro Tools. I've taken the MIDI data from Sibelius and separated it based on articulations/the types of patches (staccato, slur, trill, etc.). As a result, I now have something like 100 instrument tracks for 33 staves.

I'm kind of overwhelmed when it comes to how to mix everything so it doesn't sound like crap, especially considering that some patches, like the sustain, are really loud compared to the staccato patches. My current plan was to mix the levels for each instrument so that the overall level of the instrument (all patches) was relatively consistent. Then, I was going to convert hem all onto audio tracks and mix the whole ensemble that way. Is this a good approach, or is there a better way to do this?

[The Elf]

It's a horribly painstaking process. My basic approach (though I've not yet found an end-to-end system I feel able to stick with) is to handle all of the basic short-term dynamics for each articulation using MIDI control data/velocity, keep it this way for as long as possible (using track freeze if things get glitchy), maybe using temporary automation on the virtual instrument tracks, then render it to audio to automate the sweeps, fades and cross-overs between the articulations. Of course this is complicated when you have articulations that themselves have dynamic variations within them, such as crecendos.

Name everything carefully, group source tracks, group groups, group groups of groups(!), make notes... it's all going to help. Use VCAs if you have them and you feel it helps.

I group my audio into such as 'Shorts', 'Longs', 'Sord', 'Stacc', or anything else that helps me to get my head around it. I'm beginning to tremble just thinking about it - I too am also about to embark on another complex string arrangement!

I will bet that you find as many approaches as there are people undertaking this process. I would also be interested to hear of other methods!

[DC-Choppah]

I like to set Protools up with a single instrument track with the sampler on it. Then create other MIDI tracks for each of the articulation parts, and send this MIDI data to the instrument track. That way you only have one VI running to cover all the articulations for that instrument. But each articulation is just a MIDI track. That way you can show/hide MIDI tracks and get to that level of detail when you want.

Then, I also set the instrument track to bus record into an audio track and put Protools into punch record mode. That way it is recording all the time that the transport moves. What that does is it creates a new audio track every time you play. So any change you make to the articulations is always being burned into audio all the time. Once you like the part you've made, you just hide/make inactive everything except the final audio tracks from each part.

If you ever have to make a change to the MIDI, you just reactivate the underlying tracks and make the change. And if you just change one spot, PT will automatically write the new audio region over that spot, so no need to bounce, etc. Just re-hide the underlying tracks when done.

And don't forget to make yourself template sessions that are setup with all this for you so you can just bring it in when you need it. So you say, 'hey I want to add a full string section' and then you just import your string session template and all of the above is set up for you.

[wuubb]

I like to set Protools up with a single instrument track with the sampler on it. Then create other MIDI tracks for each of the articulation parts, and send this MIDI data to the instrument track. That way you only have one VI running to cover all the articulations for that instrument. But each articulation is just a MIDI track. That way you can show/hide MIDI tracks and get to that level of detail when you want.

Then, I also set the instrument track to bus record into an audio track and put Protools into punch record mode. That way it is recording all the time that the transport moves. What that does is it creates a new audio track every time you play. So any change you make to the articulations is always being burned into audio all the time. Once you like the part you've made, you just hide/make inactive everything except the final audio tracks from each part.

If you ever have to make a change to the MIDI, you just reactivate the underlying tracks and make the change. And if you just change one spot, PT will automatically write the new audio region over that spot, so no need to bounce, etc. Just re-hide the underlying tracks when done.

And don't forget to make yourself template sessions that are setup with all this for you so you can just bring it in when you need it. So you say, 'hey I want to add a full string section' and then you just import your string session template and all of the above is set up for you.

Hey, thanks for the tips! I'll definitely need to set up the templates, as setting up the tracks does take awhile. I actually don't have all 100 something tracks loaded with a VI, like I make all 4 horns run off 1 instance, etc., but I guess I don't even need instrument tracks, I can just put the non-VI instanced ones as regular MIDI? I can still send that MIDI data to the track with the VI though correct?

[DC-Choppah]

but I guess I don't even need instrument tracks, I can just put the non-VI instanced ones as regular MIDI? I can still send that MIDI data to the track with the VI though correct?

You just need one instrument track for your VI so that it will produce audio. I like to set that track to the basic articulation. Set up the other articulations as a separate MIDI channel in the VI.

Then make the other MIDI tracks for each other available articulation. For those MIDI tracks, set their output to the input of the VI, and for the MIDI channel of the articulation.

When you select the output of your MIDI channel you will see a menu that includes all the possible inputs and MIDI channels of the VIs you have going, so it can get big, but you'll find it.

[Zukan]

Wuub (btw, a very cool name. we will be friends for life), I suggest a mix day with the Elf as he is good at these kinds of projects.

He is also one of my dearest friends and we never compete, actually, we always help each other but if it comes down to some weird mixing techniques by someone who is both short and hairy but with a modicum of handsomeness then I'm your man. If you like your tutor to be an upstanding kind of man and would prefer that he drink drinks made for 'men' then the Elf is not your man.

However, if you want a tutor who does know his [ ****** ] and is one of the most adorable people you'll ever meet then Elf's your man.

Basically, what I'm saying is:....er....Elf's your man. BTW, you can you can substitute Elf for 'I'm' in the George Michael song and it works.

try it.

[The Elf]

I have no idea who Zukan is and I have signed documents to prove it...

[Zukan]

Oh yeah?

What about the 'whispered offer' when the P6 came out? Wanna talk about that...tart?

[wuubb]

Wuub (btw, a very cool name. we will be friends for life)

haha thanks!

I suggest a mix day with the Elf as he is good at these kinds of projects.
try it.

Do you mean like a skype session or something? I'm confused... Like how would that work since it says he's in UK? I can't exactly fly over there right now...

[Zukan]

Make him come to you. He'll do anything for a midi sport 4x4.

[wuubb]

Make him come to you. He'll do anything for a midi sport 4x4.

I'm all the way in the US lol

[The Elf]

Make him come to you. He'll do anything for a midi sport 4x4.

I'm all the way in the US lol

Well, anything for a MIDISport and an air fare!

[Zukan]

Make him come to you. He'll do anything for a midi sport 4x4.

I'm all the way in the US lol

Throw in a USB charger. Dude's not fussy.

Actually Wuub (I love this name and this man is now my new best friend. Sorry Zen), have a chat with Elf on Skype and he'll do more for you in that conversation than any youtube damn video. He's helped countless people here with mixing etc.

Just don't go to a bar with him. Trust me.

[Pete Kaine]

Make him come to you. He'll do anything for a midi sport 4x4.

Interesting information, I think I've still got a few of these in storage...

[Zukan]

Oi, need to talk to you today Pete. When's a good time?