Tips for someone terrible at singing

[garrettendi]

I'm starting a punk project... A kind of "one-man band". Mixture of 70s UK and 80s US hardcore. I can't sing to save my life and I HIGHLY doubt I'll find a singer when it's a "just for fun" project at my own leisure.

Does anyone have any tips? Are there any well-known punk singers who "couldn't" sing? I can think of Johnny Rotten but I haven't heard much.

P.S. I wasn't sure which forum is right for this.

[Sam Spoons]

There are many successful 'singers' who don't have a conventional voice. I would experiment with singing and try to find a register where you sound your best and can stay in tune (if you play an instrument to any reasonable standard you aren't 'tone deaf' so can learn to sing in tune over a certain range).

Punk is a genre where unconventional voices are acceptable so you should be able to achieve something worthwhile with some practice. Or, just go to a singing teacher, explain what you want to do and let them help you.

[garrettendi]

Thanks Sam. Good advice.

I'm slightly off-key most of the time, but only by a bit, however noticeably. I'm also Deaf, having worn a hearing aid since about 5 years old, so I have a kind of "Deaf accent" to my voice. It's not too low or too high... just not very "toneful".

A singing teacher may be a good idea, but I'll try your idea of practice first

[Sam Spoons]

Substitute "very characterful" for "not very toneful" in your mind and go for it, you have nothing to lose and when you get something interesting happening singing is very fulfilling.

Singing in tune just comes from practice........

[shufflebeat]

Speaking as someone who was there at the scene of the crime I can say with some confidence that Punk (for many lost souls) had not a lot in common with how it has since been characterised. It was about self expression which can take an infinite number of forms.

You are perfectly equipped for whatever it is you come up with, so long as the rest of us don't have to listen to it you can hammer away til catharsis hits.

[CS70]

Are there any well-known punk singers who "couldn't" sing? I can think of Johnny Rotten but I haven't heard much.

The beauty of music is that there's no canon to compare to. You sing, you are a singer.
Then of course you will meet other people's judgement, but a punk act wouldn't care less about that I suppose!

[The Bunk]

I often feel in the same situation. I remember once speaking with a singing teacher, who had quite an impressive CV, and she said "anybody can sing...you just need to be taught". So, maybe singing lessons? (edit: just re-read, it's also suggested above)
Another thing I've tried to work on is the conviction. Even when recording solo in my spare bedroom with the neighbours out and no-one else in, I sometimes just have that nagging thought in my mind that "I'm no good at this", and that comes out in the recording. I've obviously not heard you sing but every now and then I just lose the shackles ("sing like no-one can hear you") and it comes out ok...the lack of self-belief/conviction can sometimes make things worse than they maybe are? And as somebody has mentioned above, a lot of punk-based music is about the energy and, for want of a better word, "balls" behind it.
For what it's worth...I'll just say "Bob Dylan".

[Sam Spoons]

I'll just say "Bob Dylan".

Great example, Dylan can't sing in the conventional sense (or possibly chooses not to ) but he sure as hell can deliver a song....

[alexis]

I used to be a laughably horrible singer. Now I'm just a bad singer, "pitchy" on my best days. Believe it or not, I'm really happy with the improvement, and I see continued improvement ahead also.

If I can improve, I think anyone can! The way I did it was:

Record >> listen >> weep >> evaluate >> sing in shower and car incessantly, adjusting to fix the most egregious sounding parts >> repeat ...

FWIW!

[Drew Stephenson]

When I was at school our music teacher told me that I was the only person he'd ever met who genuinely couldn't sing.
And he was entirely right. I couldn't carry a tune in a bucket. I loved singing but couldn't hear that what was coming out of my mouth wasn't what I was hearing in my head.
I think it was learning to play (and tune) the guitar that really taught me to listen and from there to my current warbling.
Not having any hearing impairment (other than the usual gradual loss of high frequencies) I have no idea how your deafness affects your singing, and I have next to no knowledge of punk (either musically or in ethos) but I would echo The Bunk's point above; if you put your heart into what you do, and sing with conviction then it will resonate with someone, somewhere. And that's what it's all about.

[shufflebeat]

I've only known one person who really couldn't sing despite being, on the face of it, equipped for the job. He would sit in a pub (Ireland, 1970s) listening to the band and, as each new song started he would ask, "is that the Galway Shawl?". At some point in the evening it would indeed be the Galway Shawl, at which point he would perk up and say, "I like this one".

I heard him sing once and was surprised that it could contain neither musical sense or self expression. Even a scream shows emotion.

[Mark Knutson]

Some years ago, on a whim, I took voice lessons. It made a dramatic improvement in my singing voice. In fact, I had formed the impression prior to that that I could not sing at all.

I have a nice tenor voice. Well, many years ago, I wanted a Robert Plant voice--but whenever I got a mike, my bandmates would object to what they were hearing.

Moral of the story--I imagine all folks can receive an improvement in their singing voice with some lessons (and there are exercises to develop the proper technique). I don't imagine many people have a voice that can do any sort of singing, or perhaps emulate their favorite star. The voice is based to some degree on immutable physical characteristics.

For me, when singing I need to hear my voice along with some sort of accompaniment. When I hear I am off key, I adjust my pitch. With practice, I am on pitch right off the bat. So, I believe singing on key can be learned as long as one can hear when something is off key.

As far as the screaming/shouting type of singing, I don't know if voice lessons improve that or have any impact, as the lessons I took were aimed at improving tone for a sinatra type delivery, not a sex pistols type.

[Dynamic Mike]

Does anyone have any tips? Are there any well-known punk singers who "couldn't" sing? I can think of Johnny Rotten but I haven't heard much.

Ian Dury didn't really sing on many of his tracks. It was more a sort of intonated snarl with attitude. Not punk, but Tom Waits can sing in tune yet often chooses not to.

I watched a documentary yesterday about lip-synching musicals throughout the golden years of Hollywood. Virtually everything was dubbed by half a dozen session singers, a sort of Wrecking Crew of it's day. But one person who couldn't sing a note yet wasn't dubbed was Rex Harrison in Dr Doolittle, never really noticed before but he actually just talks in the key of the songs. Mark Lester's voice as the young Oliver was actually dubbed by a 17 year old girl.

[petev3.1]

I watched a documentary yesterday about lip-synching musicals throughout the golden years of Hollywood. Virtually everything was dubbed by half a dozen session singers, a sort of Wrecking Crew of it's day. But one person who couldn't sing a note yet wasn't dubbed was Rex Harrison in Dr Doolittle, never really noticed before but he actually just talks in the key of the songs.

Yeah I saw that. Mostly the dubbing worked and was a good decision, but what a shame they dubbed Audrey Hepburn. That didn't work at all well, and I noticed this even about the film before I'd even heard of dubbing. Much too sweet and trained for a barrow-girl. Reduces the songs to sentimental twaddle.

I once had a friend who believed she couldn't sing. She was right. I kept pestering and eventually she had a few lessons. Next thing you know she was singing with a small group and even did a London gig on the South Bank for some charity or other.

I've known a few singers who were too proud for lessons. Damn silly.

[Exalted Wombat]

The beauty of music is that there's no canon to compare to. You sing, you are a singer.
Then of course you will meet other people's judgement, but a punk act wouldn't care less about that I suppose!

What a strange thing to say! There's an enormous canon of written, recorded and performed music, and people constantly compare their and everyone's work with it, right down to the common obsession with "what genre does my music fit into?"

You have this urge to make music. You have certain musical resources. Use them, and see how it goes. It might be bloody awful - most bedroom projects are. Never mind - enjoy!

[Guest]

I'll just say "Bob Dylan".

Great example, Dylan can't sing in the conventional sense (or possibly chooses not to ) but he sure as hell can deliver a song....

Far too many moons past I was reluctantly singing through me schnozzle on one of my songs, the engineer looked up and said "You sound like Mark Knopfler," I corrected 'im, Bob Dylan maybe.

Got a good few Dylan albums, so i guess Mark 'as well.

As a songwriter you are wot you lissen to innit, so better makes sure it's good or even better, great like my man Dylan, nice guitarist too.

[damoore]

It will certainly help if you work on your singing. But don't wait till you perfect your singing to start playing. Rather choose your material based on what you can do at any given point. So you can start with Ian Drury covers (say) and move up to David Byrne (for example) covers eventually.

Being off pitch can be part of the form in punk (X-ray specs for example) but to cover them you really need to be able to reproduce their characteristic off-pitchiness, which is hard. So covering this material convincingly is harder than playing it originally or doing your own material.

[garrettendi]

Thanks everyone for all the encouragement (for some reason I became unsubscribed to this topic...!). I've done a lot of practice both on my own and in my band (which now has a bassist!!! ...Still no drummer though) and everyone who has heard me has noted the difference! I've been recording and playing it back as well and I'm noticing where I'm coming "off" and I know how to improve.

I'm currently on a shoestring due to a possible future wedding, but I'm definitely considering getting lessons to try and nail the subtleties once I've freed up a bit of cash.

[Rich Hanson]

I used to think I was a lousy singer (but I did it anyway, being rather bloody minded).

I never actually took any lessons, but I read up on technique, particularly with respect to listening to myself as well as what I was singing to, and on breathing technique. I managed to come up with this:

https://soundcloud.com/richardphanson/w ... ange-cover

It's a comp, but no resort to pitch or timing corrections. I'm quite proud of what I achieved there. Haven't managed to repeat it yet, but there's still time.

For me, the biggest thing was just building the confidence to do it.