UPC/EAN - Tunecode - ISWC - ISRC - anymore numbers?

[VOLOVIA]

Dear all, a quick one. Yes, I spent the afternoon trying to figure this out on the web, but failed. The mastering software is asking for ISRC numbers, which I have, and then UPC/EAN ones. A quick search tells me that it is referring to the standard ISWC code, which I also have BUT lately I got issued with a Tunecode for my songs by PRS. Which one should I embed, the ISWC or Tunecode one?
Thanks

[VOLOVIA]

Dear all, a quick one. Yes, I spent the afternoon trying to figure this out on the web, but failed. The mastering software is asking for ISRC numbers, which I have, and then UPC/EAN ones. A quick search tells me that it is referring to the standard ISWC code, which I also have BUT lately I got issued with a Tunecode for my songs by PRS. Which one should I embed, the ISWC or Tunecode one?
Thanks

So, no one knows. I will try to contact PRS, but last time it took them five weeks to answer and they gave me the most telegraphic and worthless answers. Off I go again...

[zenguitar]

No, you forget that it's the weekend.

You have been here long enough to know that it is ALWAYS quiet here at the weekend. All the Pros take time off with the family and all the amateurs are making the best use of their spare time.

Give it a day or two and I am sure you will get some useful and informed replies.

Andy

[James Perrett]

Whenever I've heard about Tunecodes it has been in conjunction with Tunecore - it is what they call their version of ISRC (which bears little relation to real ISRC's).

The UPC/EAN code is the barcode that you have on your physical product. Most of the time I just leave it blank. The ISRC is the most important one to have as that's what download services use to track your work.

[Pete Becker]

We've been writing and recording our own songs and producing our own CD's of our own material for years (Ambivalent Scale / A-Scale). We've also been working with the same mastering engineer for that period - a guy I trust and somebody that know how to work a Neumann lathe and not just choose presets in some mastering software . In my experience, I only ever supply an ISRC code for each track that is going to be mastered (along with the track names and times, etc). When we supply our artwork for the CD disc and CD sleeve to the company that is actually going to manufacture the CD's, we additionally ask for a barcode (UPC/EAN) to be generated so that this can printed on the disc and the sleeve artwork. We've never been asked to supply the UPC/EAN barcode to the guy who does our audio mastering, but then we are mainly concerned with selling our CD's direct. As UPC/EAN barcodes are a point-of-sale thing this is not so relevant to us unless we are going to try to get our CD's sold via retail outlets. I'm not sure what the situation is regarding streaming, on-line distribution, etc.

Just my three halfpence worth - Hope this helps.

[VOLOVIA]

Thank you guys. Sure, the important number is the ISRC number when pressing the CD, which I have. However I am curious by this triplet of codes for each song. For instance my song "I am invincible" has these codes (from PRS and PLL):

Tunecode (PRS) - 189904BM
ISWC - T-917.297.270-2
ISRC - UK48F1700002

Now, which one can I give to the pressing plan along with my tracks?

The mastering company told me that they are going to produce a 'DDP', what is that? I only knew the 'redbook' standard, is this it? Is it different from an .iso file?

Last, I remember seeing sometime ago a way to get a 'barcode' off the web for 'free'. Is this a viable option, and if so, from where?

Sorry about my ignorance here, but it's the first time that I press something on my own.
Cheers.

[James Perrett]

The UPC/EAN code is the barcode that you have on your physical product. Most of the time I just leave it blank.

Just wanted to clarify that it is possible to embed the UPC/EAN code on the CD so that it can be read automatically - it is this embedded code that I usually leave blank as very few people, if any, actually use it. I leave the printed code to the sleeve designer...

[James Perrett]

Nowadays DDP is the preferred method of sending the CD master information to the pressing plant - usually via a direct file transfer. DDP stands for Disc Description Protocol and it was created by Doug Carson Associates. It is different from an .iso file as it normally contains more than one file - a disc image file, a couple of disc description files, a CD Text file and finally a checksum file to ensure that all the files have been transferred correctly. Usually the mastering engineer will put everything into a single .zip file.

[Pete Becker]

I'd agree with James . We've always designed our own artwork and then sent it via the internet (e.g. WeTransfer, etc.) to the company that is handling the CD manufacturing (in our case; Breed Media). We ask them to generate the barcode for us and they normally charge something like an additional 30 quid for this service. Other companies may charge differently of course. When they finalise and check our artwork before finally sending it off to the plant for printing they will add this barcode graphic on to the sleeve and the CD disc itself if required. I've searched on the web and seen people offering to create a barcode for you - and I was tempted by some of these 'free' or 'cheap' offerings in order to save a few quid but we decided to use Breed Media in the end. As for whoever is doing the audio mastering for you, (we use separate companies for audio mastering and CD manufacturing) as a minimum I guess you only need send them your ISRC codes along with your audio files (plus the track titles & times, etc).

Hope this helps? - just my three halfpence worth.

[VOLOVIA]

Thank you Peter! I think I have a good idea what to do now.
However, my original part of the query about song embedded code remains:

the (PPL handled in the UK) ISRC code is apparently added. But what about the ISWC one? And what about this PRS Tunecode: does it replace ISWC?

In the most unlikely even the song is played on a radio (!), what code number will be used, ISRC or the ISWC (Tunecode?).

Thanks again

[Pete Becker]

No probs So if you’ve already registered your works with PRS and they have issued you with a Tunecode for each song then they can effectively track the work and collect royalties on your behalf (for radio plays, etc.)

Personally I’ve never been asked for, or had to use PRS Tunecodes for any reason when getting CD’s mastered and/or manufactured. I’ve always assumed that Tunecodes were just something created and used by PRS to uniquely identify your works. I might be incorrect about this of course!

ISWC codes can only be issued by organisations authorised to do so – and in the UK I think that is mainly PRS. I think PRS give you both the ISWC code and a Tunecode for each of your works? When PRS issue you with a Royalty Statement you can download a PDF and this will quote the ISWC against each of your songs earning royalties. However, you can also download a detailed CSV file of your royalty statement that lists both the ISWC and the PRS Tunecode for each of your royalty earning songs.

If additionally you’ve registered with PPL, they will need the ISRC for each of your works along with the barcode from the CD which the tracks are on. I wouldn’t fixate too much on all these codes – so long as you’ve registered your works with PRS and have ISRC codes for your stuff, then eventually royalties due should appear.

So, summarising – I guess the important bits IME are; for your physical product - each track has an ISRC and these should be encoded as metadata on your CD’s when they are made. Having barcodes printed on your CD sleeves makes it easier for retail sales. Registering your songs with PRS makes it easier to collect royalties.

Yes, it’s enough to drive all us poor musicians up the wall. If only there was just ONE agency that you had to register your stuff with and then wait for the £millions to roll in, it would all be a lot simpler!

Just my 1.5 pence worth – hope it helps!

[VOLOVIA]

Thank you Pete! Indeed I don't understand why PRS had to come up with another code for a song (Tunecode) when the ISWC is the more universally used (and requested, for instance SoundCloud). Besides, my 'nerdy questioning' started from my latest song that I registered with PRS (one of the finalists of the SOS-sponsored remix project...) and they allocated a Tunecode but NOT an ISWC number, making me think it has become 'obsolete'.

Sorry to keep asking questions, but the last one: the barcode is necessary of course if the CD hits physical shelves. But if it is available only online both as physical format and download?
Of course, this is all theoretical since it is mostly unlikely that my next output will bother any charts (an Italian pop-rock collection of original songs... with a jazz accordion thrown in...), still, this discussion could be useful to anyone dealing with these codes...

[Pete Becker]

Apologies if I've got this wrong! I think the ISRC is for registering a particular RECORDING. e.g. if you write and record a song yourself, you register that recording when you register the ISRC for that song. You can create the ISRC yourself. Whereas ISWC's are only issued by an authorised society, e.g. PRS. Yes, ISWC's are internationally recognised (a bit like a musical equivalent of ISBN for books). For musical works ISWC's start with a letter T

An ISWC identifies WORKS. It doesn't identify particular recordings. Nor does it identify individual publications (e.g. issues of a recording on physical media, sheet music, broadcast at a particular frequency/modulation/time/location...) Its primary purpose is in collecting society administration, and to clearly identify works in legal contracts. It would also be useful in library cataloguing. If you have an on-line account with PRS you can see both the ISWC and the PRS Tunecode for each of your works. Your PRS royalty statement will list the ISWC's against each song that is earning royalties for you. ISWC's are NOT obsolete!

Regarding the BARCODE - having a barcode makes it easier for a high street retailer to deal with your product and manage their inventory/sales. I guess it's more or less universal these days as everything seems to get scanned through at the checkout/point-of-sale. I guess some on-line retailers (where they physically hold stock of your CD's and sell them for you) will also require a barcode for the same reasons offered previously.

As to how ISRC/ISWC/Barcodes relate to downloads/streaming, I might be wrong but I assume is a whole different can of worms! I'm afraid I've shied away from all that side of things as it still scares me! I guess I'm just old-fashioned Sorry I can't help there. Maybe someone else can? The important thing I guess is that you have registered your ownership/copyright of the songs and your recordings.

Good luck!

[VOLOVIA]

Thanks again Peter. Ok, I looked at the SoundCloud metadata info for instance and they require the ISRC code number (the one starting with UK... in UK) for the 'listening' part and the ISWC for the 'purchase' part (that one with T-), which I take is linked to some kind of commerce side of SC (I need to explore this further).

BTW, from what I gather, it's not just a matter of applying your own ISRC number (which you can and must), but then you need to submit it with further information to the PPL website, clearly (how would they know which song refers to which code otherwise)?

No mention of the mysterious 'Tunecode'.
Cheers

[James Perrett]

I've just noticed that this thread comes almost at the top of a Google search for information about ISWCs and Tunecodes so I thought I'd add a little extra information...

Firstly, I was searching because I had just read this story

https://completemusicupdate.com/prs-exp ... -matching/

and I was wondering how this might affect a publishing database that I help look after.

While PRS look after Tunecodes it seems that they don't actually allocate ISWCs themselves but leave it to an international body called CISNET. There is more information about ISWCs at

https://help.prsformusic.com/s/article/ ... -ISWC-code

What is more confusing is that PRS also allocate even more codes to each work at some point in their journey through their system which are very briefly explained at

https://help.prsformusic.com/s/article/ ... ical-works

The whole process seems amazingly complex to me but fortunately I don't get involved in the registration of works. I also wonder, given that news story, whether there is much point in the Tunecode when the ISWC serves the same purpose. However, the demise of the Tunecode would mean a big change to our database as everything currently is matched to it.

[Spells]

Each item you've listed is just another fingerprint by which to identify your music.

The barcode / UPC thing... if you do it officially, like I did for a while, then you go and get an account with GS1 who issue a bank of barcodes that you use on your product / release. But you can buy banks of barcodes on eBay.

For digital distribution, the distributor will almost always just auto assign a barcode from their own bank.

Link to GS1: https://www.gs1uk.org/about-us/membership/get-a-barcode