HELP BUILDING A 40.000 EUR SET-UP

[vkonyofficial]

So guys, i saved a lot ... I'm building a set-up for my new studio but i wanna ask somebody with my desicions about the products that i'm gonna buy for it . I worked on a windows so far , Cubase for production and also mastering but i'm gonna switch to Logic X Pro with the ocasion of buying the iMac Pro (2,3 Ghz ,18 core ,128 GB DDR4 , 4TB SSD ,Radeon Pro Vega 64) . I'm not used to Mac , at all .I Don't know if anything on my list is compatibile with the iMac , There's the part where i need HUGE help from you guys . This is my list . If something does not belong here ,give me some advice about what should i do .

-Brauner Phantom Classic
-Avalon VT-737SP
-Presonus StudioLive 16 Series III ( I really don't know how to connect it to the imac)
-Presonus HP60
-AKG K-872
-Beyerdynamic Amiron Home
-Avid Pro Tools
-Avid Sync HD IO ( I'm not so sure about this one )
-Marshall JVM410H Bundle 3
-Gibson Les Paul Standard HP 2018 BOF
-Korg Kronos 61
-Sennheiser 600 Drum Set
-Clearsonic A2466x6 (A5-6) Drum Shield
-DW PDP CM5 Standard Silver/Black
-the t.bone Micscreen
-Shure KSM 137 Stereoset

I am a live performer , I play all the instruments above, and I have already set up the place for the studio with isolation . I am focused to record live instruments and mastering more than VST , i saw that Logic already has a necessary of instruments and Plug-ins for mastering , i don't know if it's enough and i don't know if you can crack anything on iMac , that's why I'm asking for your help .

[CS70]

Is is stuff you're gonna buy, or stuff you have already?
If you plan on using Logic (or were using Cubase), what's the point of ProTools?

For sure the Avalon is a great strip, and the Brauner a good mic so long you like the sound, but isn't it only cardioid? Do you plan the combo only for vocals? If you have to have one big mic, a multi-pattern might come more handy in a variety of situations. I've never tried the KSM137s so know nothing more than you.

On the Gibson+Marshall, sure, why not - a good guitar sound is way more in the fingers and skills than in the gear anyway. Tough I would seriously look at the used market for that kind of stuff, guitarists are notorious compulsive gear acquirers (and often the less they play, the more they buy) so you can find tremendous bargains if you have a little patience.

Why two closed-back earphones? You might want a closed one with good isolation for tracking and an open-back for mixing instead?

Can't comment on the synth part as I know nothing on the matter.

If you're treated your vocal space well, there should be a limited need for a mic screen, but then it's not like a big expenditure anyways. And of course, you have treated your space well, haven't you? That mention of "isolation" is a big chilling..

Last question - just curiosity - why the imac? Nothing wrong with it for sure but what's the point of re-learning an operating system if you already have a perfectly good Cubase+PC combo?

[James Perrett]

I'd suggest you don't buy it all at once as many of the people that I know who have done that have ended up regretting it and selling much of the gear they bought. Take things in gentle steps and build up your studio as you go. If you buy lots of gear at the same time you probably won't really learn how to get the best out of each item.

What do you actually need for the next session? Is this studio for yourself or will you be hiring it out?

Why change to Mac, Logic and Protools if Cubase is working for you. If it isn't working then have you looked at other alternatives? What about monitors?

[Dave B]

i don't know if you can crack anything on iMac , that's why I'm asking for your help .

Quick note here : round these parts we take a very dim view of people using cracked software. It's wrong and should not be done - there are people who we know who have been ruined by piracy. It's a big no no - you can't afford proper software? If you can afford to splash out on an expensive Mac, you can afford to pay for your software.

If you already have a valid version of Cubase, and you are comfortable with using it, you can just install it on your new Mac. I'm sure that Steinberg support can help out with any problems you may have doing that. The only problem might be the version of software may need to be upgraded to meet the current mac OS.

Oh, and the Kronos is definitely a good buy. I have other units that I prefer, but I really can't knock my Kronos and if you only left me with that one, I wouldn't be heartbroken.

[Dave Rowles]

That's a lot to spend on a new iMac. €15k on a computer. Do you do video as well? If not, do you really need all that power? If you halved the memory and the processor, you'd save yourself 3k, and I'm not convinced you'd notice the difference unless you really max out the virtual soundsets

I have to agree, why pro-tools? If you don't already use it, what features does it have that you want? I'm a Logic Pro fan, but if you already know cubase and are happy with it, I'd stick to it. It's cross platform, so there's no reason to switch.

Given that you're going for the Brauner and the Avalon, the StudioLive seems a bit of a low end purchase to plug it into. Not knocking the desk, but I'd probably be looking at something along the lines of 2 Audient ASP880, and an ID44 or similar to plug it all into. Far better as the converter/pres in concert with the Avalon. Then look at getting a control surface of some description if you want physical faders, especially look at something that's motorised, or the Slate Digital Raven surface.

As to the instruments, I can't knock it, but on the guitar amp front, I'd probably look for something a little more boutique, and less powerful. I'm totally into smaller wattage valve types, because you can crank them up more without getting the ear bleeding factor. I run an old tiny terror into a 2x12, and I get more out of that than I could ever want at a gig. Kronos is a good all round keyboard, and the Kit is good too.

I'd seriously look into getting individual drum/instrument mics. If I was looking for a live sound set-up then the 600 series are great for touring/durability, but I'd be looking for more versatile mics for a studio. Mics you can put on anything, like a MD421, or some C414s, or similar. Don't think about what you want to record now, think about what you might want to record in the future. I'd probably suggest getting a Royer R121 as well if you're into your guitar tone.

Just suggestions mind. It'd difficult to know exactly what's best without knowing a lot more about what you already have.

I can also agree that you should buy bit by bit. Learning a lot of new gear at once is a daunting task!

[vkonyofficial]

Is is stuff you're gonna buy, or stuff you have already?
If you plan on using Logic (or were using Cubase), what's the point of ProTools?

For sure the Avalon is a great strip, and the Brauner a good mic so long you like the sound, but isn't it only cardioid? Do you plan the combo only for vocals? If you have to have one big mic, a multi-pattern might come more handy in a variety of situations. I've never tried the KSM137s so know nothing more than you.

On the Gibson+Marshall, sure, why not - a good guitar sound is way more in the fingers and skills than in the gear anyway. Tough I would seriously look at the used market for that kind of stuff, guitarists are notorious compulsive gear acquirers (and often the less they play, the more they buy) so you can find tremendous bargains if you have a little patience.

Why two closed-back earphones? You might want a closed one with good isolation for tracking and an open-back for mixing instead?

Can't comment on the synth part as I know nothing on the matter.

If you're treated your vocal space well, there should be a limited need for a mic screen, but then it's not like a big expenditure anyways. And of course, you have treated your space well, haven't you? That mention of "isolation" is a big chilling..

Last question - just curiosity - why the imac? Nothing wrong with it for sure but what's the point of re-learning an operating system if you already have a perfectly good Cubase+PC combo?

I am a Win User , but i'm aware that Logic and Mac are way more stable than Windows. I convinced myself working also on a Mac in some studios so ...i seen some awesome things about the workflow that a iMac gives you . The point of ProTools is the external Export Engine . It's the best for mastering, I'm gonna use ProTools just for mastering .

[vkonyofficial]

I'd suggest you don't buy it all at once as many of the people that I know who have done that have ended up regretting it and selling much of the gear they bought. Take things in gentle steps and build up your studio as you go. If you buy lots of gear at the same time you probably won't really learn how to get the best out of each item.

What do you actually need for the next session? Is this studio for yourself or will you be hiring it out?

Why change to Mac, Logic and Protools if Cubase is working for you. If it isn't working then have you looked at other alternatives? What about monitors?

I have to buy them all together, i choose the Mac over the Windows because I've seen that is way more stable than a Windows .

[vkonyofficial]

i don't know if you can crack anything on iMac , that's why I'm asking for your help .

Quick note here : round these parts we take a very dim view of people using cracked software. It's wrong and should not be done - there are people who we know who have been ruined by piracy. It's a big no no - you can't afford proper software? If you can afford to splash out on an expensive Mac, you can afford to pay for your software.

If you already have a valid version of Cubase, and you are comfortable with using it, you can just install it on your new Mac. I'm sure that Steinberg support can help out with any problems you may have doing that. The only problem might be the version of software may need to be upgraded to meet the current mac OS.

Oh, and the Kronos is definitely a good buy. I have other units that I prefer, but I really can't knock my Kronos and if you only left me with that one, I wouldn't be heartbroken.

Actually i'm gonna get the Kronos to live performances because right now i'm using a Fantom G in studio and Live , and want to keep the Fantom in Studio because is wonderful and powerful. And of course i'm gonna still keep the cubase a while ... but i'm aware that it's time is kinda done. It has an awful eq . Awful Export Engine ....it's just not right , the mixdown just does not sound right , that's why the Pro Tools is on my list , and the HD Omni

[vkonyofficial]

That's a lot to spend on a new iMac. €15k on a computer. Do you do video as well? If not, do you really need all that power? If you halved the memory and the processor, you'd save yourself 3k, and I'm not convinced you'd notice the difference unless you really max out the virtual soundsets

I have to agree, why pro-tools? If you don't already use it, what features does it have that you want? I'm a Logic Pro fan, but if you already know cubase and are happy with it, I'd stick to it. It's cross platform, so there's no reason to switch.

Given that you're going for the Brauner and the Avalon, the StudioLive seems a bit of a low end purchase to plug it into. Not knocking the desk, but I'd probably be looking at something along the lines of 2 Audient ASP880, and an ID44 or similar to plug it all into. Far better as the converter/pres in concert with the Avalon. Then look at getting a control surface of some description if you want physical faders, especially look at something that's motorised, or the Slate Digital Raven surface.

As to the instruments, I can't knock it, but on the guitar amp front, I'd probably look for something a little more boutique, and less powerful. I'm totally into smaller wattage valve types, because you can crank them up more without getting the ear bleeding factor. I run an old tiny terror into a 2x12, and I get more out of that than I could ever want at a gig. Kronos is a good all round keyboard, and the Kit is good too.

I'd seriously look into getting individual drum/instrument mics. If I was looking for a live sound set-up then the 600 series are great for touring/durability, but I'd be looking for more versatile mics for a studio. Mics you can put on anything, like a MD421, or some C414s, or similar. Don't think about what you want to record now, think about what you might want to record in the future. I'd probably suggest getting a Royer R121 as well if you're into your guitar tone.

Just suggestions mind. It'd difficult to know exactly what's best without knowing a lot more about what you already have.

I can also agree that you should buy bit by bit. Learning a lot of new gear at once is a daunting task!

Yes, I also do video in the studio . The mac is a must . The Marshall is also for live performances on stage, that's why i choose it . By now , i switched the brauner to a Neumann.

[CS70]

I am a Win User , but i'm aware that Logic and Mac are way more stable than Windows. I convinced myself working also on a Mac in some studios so ...i seen some awesome things about the workflow that a iMac gives you . The point of ProTools is the external Export Engine . It's the best for mastering, I'm gonna use ProTools just for mastering .

By all means it's your money, but I've been running Windows (first 7, now 10) on two machines over the last 5 years with very few problems (some BSODs specifically due to the old AVID audio interface I was using) and zero since I swapped interface and installed Win10. Don't know what you get your awareness from, but I'd double check if that was the only reason.

For ProTools, where do you get that idea from?

[vkonyofficial]

I am a Win User , but i'm aware that Logic and Mac are way more stable than Windows. I convinced myself working also on a Mac in some studios so ...i seen some awesome things about the workflow that a iMac gives you . The point of ProTools is the external Export Engine . It's the best for mastering, I'm gonna use ProTools just for mastering .

By all means it's your money, but I've been running Windows (first 7, now 10) on two machines over the last 5 years with very few problems (some BSODs specifically due to the old AVID audio interface I was using) and zero since I swapped interface and installed Win10. Don't know what you get your awareness from, but I'd double check if that was the only reason.

For ProTools, where do you get that idea from?

I attended at some mastering classes , and they discussed about it

[Urthlupe]

......amazed at how much money folks become determined to spend on hype and hearsay....

Loopy

[Dave Rowles]

Yes, I also do video in the studio . The mac is a must . The Marshall is also for live performances on stage, that's why i choose it . By now , i switched the brauner to a Neumann.

Being a live sound engineer as well, I dislike 100w stacks, or fender twins for that matter. But if it makes the sound you want then go for it Just be prepared for the sound guy to tell you to turn it down....

I'm gonna use ProTools just for mastering

Awful Export Engine ....it's just not right , the mixdown just does not sound right , that's why the Pro Tools is on my list , and the HD Omni

That's not my experience of Cubase, and I assure you that there are a number of hit records produced using solely Cubase, and mastered in it too. If you don't like the export engine, but like the mix you get in it, mixdown the old fashioned way. Play the song in real time to an external recorder, or loop the output from cubase back into itself.

As to ProTools being best for mastering, I simply don't agree. I think it's no better or worse than the alternatives. There are valid reasons for using ProTools, specifically the workflow for some editing tasks, but mastering is not one of them. If your heart is set on ProTools then buy it, and make it your sole recording/mixing platform. It's not worth the money for just one task.

[James Perrett]

I'm wondering whether you might have an old version of Cubase. Older versions of Cubase are notoriously unreliable but newer versions are supposed to be much better. Protools has the biggest marketing budget but that doesn't mean that it is the best - there are plenty of other alternatives that are used professionally to get the job done.

I would also suggest that you stop reading all the hype and actually hire in some of the gear that you are thinking of for a few sessions. Some places will deduct the hire cost if you decide to buy. That way you can make your own informed decisions rather than trusting some famous producer/engineer to actually know what they are talking about (there are quite a few that actually don't have much idea of what they are doing technically, but get the job because they know what sounds good).

[Sam Spoons]

Just to back up Dave's comment re 100 watt stacks, I'm both a sound guy and a guitarist and gig regularly with an 18 watt combo. The days of the 100 watt stack are long past, many big name bands use a row of dummy stacks live with a small combo miked up behind it in the wings. The only thing your onstage amp has to do is match the level of the drummer (and not even that with decent foldback or IEMs) and the PA does the rest. Now to be fair, my 18 watt combo would not compete with a HM drummer without a little help (it is bl00dy loud if you can live with a little break up mind you) but I don't play metal so not a problem. In the studio you'll never get a big amp into it's sweet spot (actually, not often live either) so a small amp will often sound 'bigger' when recorded.

My bass player is a video graphics professional and uses a fully pimped iMac for his work, I bought his old (2008) Mac Pro a couple of years ago and, for my audio needs it is way beyond good enough. The recording I do is fairly much all live instruments and I attempt to recreate live performance in the studio so I'm not loading it up with VSTis and suchlike.

Anyway, good luck and I'm sure I'm not the only one here who envies your budget

[ore_terra]

Since it seems budget is not an issue here, I’d recommend you to stick to the 100w stack if that is what you want, but add a good attenuator to the pack. There are amazing attenuators these days such as the bad cat unleash, or the fryette something...

They give you flexibility and will keep sound guys happy

[Andy McBain]

I am a Win User , but i'm aware that Logic and Mac are way more stable than Windows. I convinced myself working also on a Mac in some studios so ...i seen some awesome things about the workflow that a iMac gives you . The point of ProTools is the external Export Engine . It's the best for mastering, I'm gonna use ProTools just for mastering .

I'm afraid to say that my Mac / Logic Pro X setup crashes quite frequently

i saw that Logic already has a necessary of instruments and Plug-ins for mastering , i don't know if it's enough and i don't know if you can crack anything on iMac , that's why I'm asking for your help

There's no reason you couldn't do a master using Logic's built in plugins and if there's no budget left for software, there's a lot of fantastic low price and even free plugins these days for that very purpose. Don't crack

[Dave Rowles]

I'm afraid to say that my Mac / Logic Pro X setup crashes quite frequently

Mine doesn't

There's no reason you couldn't do a master using Logic's built in plugins and if there's no budget left for software, there's a lot of fantastic low price and even free plugins these days for that very purpose. Don't crack

Totally agree, though even if you wanted to buy some third party plugs, there are loads of good options out there that do a great job and won't hurt your budget at all!

[Sam Spoons]

With a full personal/small business licence for Reaper costing only $60/£40 there is absolutely no excuse for pirating DAW software.

[job]

I think you should take a knee on spending for at least 3 months and do more research. Cripes, i'm almost nervous for you...

[Zukan]

With a full personal/small business licence for Reaper costing only $60/£40 there is absolutely no excuse for pirating DAW software.

Who is pirating in this thread Sam?

[Music Wolf]

The subject of pirating began with this

and i don't know if you can crack anything on iMac .

But, with a 40k€ budget burning a hole, I'm a little concerned by statements like this

-Presonus StudioLive 16 Series III ( I really don't know how to connect it to the imac)
.

It would be helpful to get a little more information as to what equipment / experience the OP has today. Having money to spend on toys is all well and good but these are only tools, it's the skills that matter.

I'm with the poster who suggested building up slowly, learning about the gear as you go.

[Sam Spoons]

I don't know if anybody is but several mentions of cracking prompted by the OP comment "and i don't know if you can crack anything on iMac , that's why I'm asking for your help" led me to post as I did.

I wouldn't suggest that any of the regulars on here would do such a thing.....

[CS70]

For ProTools, where do you get that idea from?

I attended at some mastering classes , and they discussed about it

Well, be aware that discussion (including this) is useless for these things. The only way to know is by repeated, blind test. Have a friend quickly master a number of pieces (possibly using the same plugins and settings and final levels) on different DAWs, give them back to you without telling what's what, and see if you spot any difference, or can reliably tell which one is which. I bet a dollar and a horse that you won't.

(Btw, I did the experiment, with only mono tracks, on Sonar , Cubase and Reaper, together with another audio-interested friend a few years back, and most definitely couldn't).

The real-numbers math underlying digital signal summation is, by definition, the same everywhere. What can be different in DAWs are the numerical recipes used to implement it, but by definition any good recipes is good in the sense that it produces a know and controllable error magnitude, which the algorithms take into consideration, hence making the difference in the final result as small as one wants. The other difference can be the default pan law - which can indeed produce noticeably different sounding mixes from different DAWs (if your mix use stereo panning, of course). But they will be different, not necessary worse from one another.

There may be some reason to buy ProTools, but a "better export engine" is definitely not one.

[Guest]

Is this a real question or is the OP simply completing an ill conceived school assignment based around setting up a studio with a pre-determined fictitious budget. I actually hope that that is the case otherwise I am also nervous for him/her.