Sound Devices expand MixPre M-Series with 3M and 6M models

[Guest]

Dear SoS - If I post you my credit card, will you promise not to give it back for at least 6 months...no matter how much I plead and beg. Mr Robjohns - they really are that good, aren't they?

[Bob Bickerton]

They really are that good.........

I’ve had the Mixpre-10m for less than a month and have already recorded 8 concerts with it. The quality is astonishing and workflow easy. Preamps are great and of particular note is the quality of the headphone amp. I used to have to use a nice external headphone amp with the Zoom F8 - no longer necessary.

You know you want one...... don’t you..........

Bob

[Guest]

I ask if they are "good", Bob says they are "astonishing". Oh how that has dampened my GAS. You're not being very helpful, Bob

[garrettendi]

I don't think you can expect anybody on here to dampen GAS!

[Hugh Robjohns]

Yes Darren... if you send me your credit card I promise not to return it to you for six months. I'll need your PIN as well of course, just so I can stop the card becoming rusty through lack of use...

Yes, the MixPreX-M models really are very attractive indeed -- and I have a full review of the 10M in the next issue of SOS out later this month.

The only thing that slightly puts me off the 10M is its lack of word-clock connectivity, which means it can't be used as part of a larger digital system... but that really is being a bit picky given what its designed to do and its retail price.

As a standalone digital multi-tracker of the portastudio ethos, it is superbly designed, and its quality is just outstanding in every way. I've not laid hands on the 3M and 6M models yet, but they are basically the same apart from the reduced preamp count -- they still manage full 12-track multitrack recording so are ideal for the home musician wanting to build up recordings away from the computer.

H

[Guest]

I don't think you can expect anybody on here to dampen GAS!

But don't most of use tell GAS'ing prospective microphone buyers and everyone else to save their money because gear choice will not meaningfully affect the music made and sales achieved? I know we've told you on a couple of occassions Material-Arrangement-Performance-Recording Space-Mic Placement-Mic Selection (Insert GAS-inspired forum question here)-Mix Balance-Mix Treatment is our credo. Still, your praise for the Senn 835 caused me to buy one. I love it.

[Guest]

Yes, the MixPreX-M models really are very attractive indeed -- and I have a full review of the 10M in the next issue of SOS out later this month.

[garrettendi]

But don't most of use tell GAS'ing prospective microphone buyers and everyone else to save their money because gear choice will not meaningfully affect the music made and sales achieved? I know we've told you on a couple of occassions Material-Arrangement-Performance-Recording Space-Mic Placement-Mic Selection (Insert GAS-inspired forum question here)-Mix Balance-Mix Treatment is our credo.

Ah yes good point, I have often been warned away from wasting money!

Still, your praise for the Senn 835 caused me to buy one. I love it.

Glad you love it. It's amazing!

[Drew Stephenson]

But don't most of use tell GAS'ing prospective microphone buyers and everyone else to save their money because gear choice will not meaningfully affect the music made and sales achieved? I know we've told you on a couple of occassions Material-Arrangement-Performance-Recording Space-Mic Placement-Mic Selection (Insert GAS-inspired forum question here)-Mix Balance-Mix Treatment is our credo.

I believe the appropriate maxim at this point is, "Do as I say, not as I do."

[Guest]

I believe the appropriate maxim at this point is, "Do as I say, not as I do."

Certainly I have a *few* more bits of gear than I need. I won't even start on the guitars. I consider it my duty to inform the young people that the acquisition of stuff won't make them more productive. Except of course those new Sound Devices multitrackers. They are about to revive the whole 'If Sgt Pepper was made on four-track...' argument. And they have 12 tracks. That's eight more. Count 'em.

[Drew Stephenson]

And they have 12 tracks. That's eight more. Count 'em.

But do they go up to 11?

[Paul Isaacs]

And they have 12 tracks. That's eight more. Count 'em.

But do they go up to 11?

11+ 1 = 12 !!

[Bob Bickerton]

And just to balance things up..........

Would I use one as as a stand-alone device for multitrack/multitake/multipass recording as per the old portastudios? Absolutely not!

The workflow would be Jurassic as compared to using any DAW.

There, that’s just saved you lots of money, your credit card will be feeling better already......

Bob

[Hugh Robjohns]

Would I use one as as a stand-alone device for multitrack/multitake/multipass recording as per the old portastudios? Absolutely not!

I would -- and did!

Horses for courses, obviously, but for small to medium-sized projects and scratch-pad recordings I found it a very appealing tool. There are some significant benefits of not using a DAW. It's much quicker to get up and running, much simpler and more direct to use, much less distracting, etc etc... And you can record anywhere the muse strikes you. I genuinely found myself thinking much more about the music and my performances than about the technology -- and that's got to be a good thing, surely?

The workflow would be Jurassic as compared to using any DAW.[/quote

Of course, and I'd prefer to mix in the DAW, too... but it's perfectly possible to mix in the MixPre if necessary, to at least a very good demo standard. Handy if you want to listen to a rough mix on the way home...

H

[Bob Bickerton]

Maybe my criticism was unjustified because it’s to do with what workflow best suits the project at hand, which of course is personal choice. In a sense the MixPre gives you all options; to be a straight tracking recorder, to use as a portastudio, or to be an audio interface.

I personally would find the portastudio workflow far more distracting to creative output than using a DAW. But that’s just me

Bob

[Guest]

I'll tone it down for moment - The mixpre m series is interesting because of where it places the portastudio concept in relation to the ubiquitous DAW. Current models from Zoom and Tascam have thrown in the towel where audio quality - and even MIDI - are concerned and are definitely the second-rate option only to be considered where total portability or a non-computer workflow are desired. Most comments from Tascam DP24 users usually start with 'I can't be ar**d with all that computer nonsense and I'll take the lo-fi hit'.

I mostly work with Logic, but whenever I get out my creaking Tascam DP02 (16-bit and sounds like it), a certain swagger creeps into my recordings, which sound inferior to my Duet/iMac rig, but have a more urgent feel.

The mixpre m's look like they'll match a DAW in terms of sound quality - likely they will exceed many a budget DAW set up. I would expect people who record a lot of real instruments and mix them as such, especially jazzers and folkies, to be intrigued by what this unexpected reassertion of the portable multitracker has to offer.

Now, where was I? Hugh says it's more fun than a DAW and sounds just as good! Sweet Lord take me now!

[IronFilm]

I'll tone it down for moment - The mixpre m series is interesting because of where it places the portastudio concept in relation to the ubiquitous DAW. Current models from Zoom and Tascam have thrown in the towel where audio quality - and even MIDI - are concerned and are definitely the second-rate option only to be considered where total portability or a non-computer workflow are desired.

I highly disagree, with the Zoom F8n (and the older F4 and original F8 as well) then Zoom truly has thrown the kitchen sink at them and these are recorders punching well above their weight.

Even Tascam, who seem to be sadly MIA at the $1K price point (or even above. Their Tascam HS-P82 dearly needs an update), at least in other niches such as sub $300 and sub $200 recorders are at the top of their game for those sub niches.

[Bob Bickerton]

I highly disagree, with the Zoom F8n (and the older F4 and original F8 as well) then Zoom truly has thrown the kitchen sink at them and these are recorders punching well above their weight.

Perhaps to add some balance and being an owner of both the F8 and the MixPre-10m, I would have to say the Zoom models do represent excellent value for money, but having used the MixPre I have been surprised at how much better that unit is. The headphone amp makes an enormous difference (I used to have to use an external headphone amp for the Zoom) and I do believe the preamps are up there with some of the best. I also prefer the workflow for my own purposes.

The Zoom is not shabby by any means, and the comparison is very much dependent on application, but for location classical music recording, I am more comfortable and confident in what I'm hearing from the MixPre.

The Zoom F8n sounds most interesting....... even though I'm not in the market for one

Bob

[Hugh Robjohns]

I've just had the F8n for review, and Zoom have applied some useful tweaks fixing the originals most obvious flaws. The external DC input voltage range has been expanded to make it more compatible with Li-ion battery packs, the headphone amp is vastly improved, and the limiters are a lot better with the option for a look-ahead mode. They've also improved the default operating screens and paradigm (the knobs now default to being mix faders and the input gain trip is set with the encoder knob, which is a lot more sensible), have added a useful auto-mix function, changed the Main output level options to include a +24dBu mode, and done away with the silly battery caddy. All worthwhile improvements... But they've also stopped including the TA3 output adapter cables, which is a frustration, and inevitably hiked the price a little.

I'm not sure the F8n really compares directly with the Sound Devices MixPre-10M because they do such very different things and are significantly different in price... But the F8n is a good upgrade over the original model, and makes an even more cost-effective ultra-compact location recorder.

We are very lucky to have such phenomenal gear available to us at such (relatively) affordable prices

[IronFilm]

The headphone amp makes an enormous difference

Headphone amp seems to be the biggest criticism of the F8 (that and the limiters, which often came from a misunderstand of how Zoom's are working).

And I feel it says a lot if that is the #1 problem of the F8, then it must be pretty good!

Am happy to live with that if I means I get to enjoy all the many more advantages the F8 has over the MixPre recorders such as the flexibility of the F Control Panel, pre-roll, dual SD slots, and more.

Plus Zoom has taken all these criticisms to heart and resolved this with the F8n!

and done away with the silly battery caddy.

Personally I preferred the battery caddy of the F8/F4 than this new approach of Zoom's.

Ah well, if that is the biggest complaint I have about my F8n then I'll be very happy indeed!

[Guest]

I highly disagree, with the Zoom F8n (and the older F4 and original F8 as well) then Zoom truly has thrown the kitchen sink at them and these are recorders punching well above their weight.

My comments only concern multitrack recorders with overdubbing. I'm sure the Zoom field recorders perform very well.

[Dan LB]

.......the headphone amp is vastly improved......

Hi Hugh,

how much better is the headphone amp in the F8n compared to its predecessor?
I’ve not used the F8 so can’t comment from personal experience but I’ve read reports that it was quite coloured and not true to the audio actually being laid down. How does the F8n score in this regard?

Dan

[Hugh Robjohns]

I'm not sure I'd say it was 'quite coloured'. It certainly wasn't entirely transparent and was too noisy. It's 'colouration' also reacted to different headphone impedances which made it a little unpredictable. It was usable, but disappointing...

The F8n has -- as far as I can tell without an A/B comparison -- fixed all those issues, and added in some additional gain to boot.

H

[Dan LB]

Thanks Hugh

[tef]

I'm considering the 3M as a replacement for my old Focusrite Saffire LE. I have a nice Golden Age Projects external preamp. Will I be able to use this with the Sound Devices 3M unit?