My Top 5 DAW Features & Functions

[muzines]

Logic Pro X

So, let's have a look at a few of my favourite workflow features in Logic.
(There are plenty of others, of course, but these are the ones I choose to highlight here - in no particular order.)

1: Track Assignment

Logic has an unusually flexible track assignment concept, which differs from most other DAWs, and even many Logic users don't quite get the concept.

In most DAWs, when you add a track, say an audio track, the track appears in the arrangement view, and a channel strip for that track appears in the mixer.

Logic isn't limited to this fixed 1:1 relationship. When you create a new audio track, usually it's assigned to the next free audio object, which is also displayed as a channel strip in the mixer - so far, so normal.

But you can have multiple arrange tracks, all with the *same* object assigned. So you can have ten tracks, all playing to your audio channel 1 object, which is very flexible when in comes to editing. Or five different tracks, all feeding the *same* software instrument, maybe with some tracks on different MIDI channels.

In fact, "tracks" in the arrange window are themselves dumb, and it's the playback object assigned to them that gives them their identity (audio track, MIDI track, software instrument track etc), and this can be *any environment object* (which is how you connect the arrange page to the environment if required.)

This also is why some people get confused with the difference between the two "duplicate track" commands - "Create track with same object" (which creates a new track, assigned to the same channel strip object as the selected track) vs "Create track with next object" (which creates a new track, and duplicates the existing object - eg a software instrument channel, with a second independent instance of all the plugins.)

2: Window Handling

Ever since Logic 1.x, Logic has the concept of Screensets, which let you position and save any combination of windows, and switch between them. While many people just use a single screen environment, and open, move and close windows constantly while working, this is really slow, inefficient and clunky.

(I used to watch people in horror as they'd double click a MIDI region to open up an editor, reposition and size the window on the screen to not overlap some important content, set the zoom to where they wanted it to be, edit a few notes, close the window, then select the next region and go through the whole thing again...)

The newer consolidated/integrated window approach added in Logic 8+ was an attempt to help streamline window handling for typical users - so you have one Main window, and can make the bottom section be various different editing windows, pop in other panels on the left and right side etc, which works for many people and can be convenient - but misses some of the power of Logic's window handling approach.

When using Logic, I'm usually in one of a few different "modes' of working - I might be recording/playing, or doing detailed audio editing, or detailed MIDI editing, or doing mixing/automation etc. Of course, we all flit between things as required. But rather than constantly opening, positioning windows or panels to fit the task I'm doing, I have different Screensets set up for just those tasks, which I switch to (top row of the number keys, eg 1-9).

And this means I can use *multiple windows* on those tasks. My MIDI editing screenshot for example opens up multiple editing windows, floating panels and so, in the arrangement I like, so I can use the most appropriate tools from any of the windows to most efficiently make the necessary edits - and this can include multiple windows with the same editor open, with different setings - say zoom settings (having two arrangement windows open, one zoomed out for overview, and one zoomed in for detail, is useful).

To edit, I just select the region I want to edit, press "2", and Logic gives me my complete personalised multi-window editing environment. When done, "1" and I'm back to my default working screen.

Using multiple windows, Screensets, Link modes (which determines what content windows display) and various related features makes Logic a really flexible working enviornment, which can be configured in the way that works best for your needs - without you having to worry about tedious window maintenance.

3: Mackie Control Support

The Logic Control debuted with Logic 5, and it was remarkably well designed, and is still the only fairly universally supported controller standard that offers the majority of things you need to do with a controller, that requires *no mapping*, and just works.

Controller handling is a bugbear of mine. Generic controllers, that require mapping, are so unwieldy to use no one really bothers, and in this regard Logic is generally less good than other DAWs that handle generic controllers a little better (Live does a fairly good job with this, for example.)

Logic added "Smart Controls" to help, but this is only pre-mapped with factory content, and for your own uses, you're back to manual mapping. I don't use them at all (and generally they look pretty cheesy too)

(Ok, in some cases, the ability to manually map a set of controls on an important sound or plugin can be useful, but no one wants to have to map on a regular basis - it's just tedious busy work that interferes with creative work.)

Despite having an MCU+XT system, it's large, and in some ways isn't ideal for my uses (eg a portable laptop system), so I developed a custom controller scheme, based around the MCU standard, as all the MIDI mappings for the MCU are completely open and editable - so you can change how it works if necessary. So I have a little controller that's portable, set up to my (specific) requirements that can do mixing, synth editing, and plugin editing in a really simple and accessible way.

You can even tell Logic to generate parameter listing text files for each plugin, and then go and change the order those parameters are called up on the controls, letting you define consistant handling for all your plugins.

So, the MCU is a great controller, the spec is supported by many hardware boxes and DAWs, it requires no mapping from the user, is well integrated into Logic, but it also sufficiently editable to change the behaviour enough to develop custom controller schemes to help you connect your hardware to your software in a way that's empowering, not frustrating.

4: Plugin Management

With a hardware studio, it's common sense to put the instruments and effects you use all the time within easy reach, the things you use a bit less frequently maybe off to the side, and the things you break out only occasionally can go back in the cupboard out of view.

For a long time (*years*!), Logic made all plugins only accessible with a trawl through large, long-winded multi-level menus, organised by manufacturer only (which doesn't make sense when you want to maybe try out a few compressor choices), and it used to drive me nuts.

After many years, I decided to start developing my own solution to this, as it seemed it would never change within Logic. My app was coming along nicely - and then Apple of course released a Logic update with the Plugin Manager.

But at last you can organise plugins how you like - put in top level menus of "Compressors", "Reverbs", "Delays", and so on, create folders, even rename plugins.

I have categories for selected virtual instrument plugins for example, like:
Synths -> Classic Analog
Synths -> Classic Digital
Synths -> Modern Digital
Classic Instruments
Drums -> Acoustic
Drums -> Beats

I can put my most used/favourite tools at the top level, and then put in some less commonly used items a level down, and keep the stuff I rarely use out of eyesight and not clutter up my choices.

This was a feature I was waiting a very long time for, and it's *most* welcome.

(You still can't select plugins via the keyboard though. Maybe if I restart development on my app, they'll add it in the meantime...)

5: Region/MIDI Thru Parameters

Last up, another long time feature that originated with C-Lab's Creator/Notator, but was good enough to make it through to Logic too.

In Logic, when you have a MIDI region selected, there are a bunch of parameters displayed in the region Inspector panel that let you adjust, non-destructively (they are calculated in real-time on playback), parameters such as quantisation, transposition, velocity modification and so on.

When you don't have a region selected, this panel instead displays the MIDI Thru parameters, which are applied in realtime to the incoming MIDI data as you play. This lets you transpose, shift and compress velocities, compensate for keyboard limitations, limit the keyboard, change MIDI channel all on the fly.

Any recordings you make with those parameters have those same parameters copied to the MIDI regions, so the original played data is still intact, and any modifications to the MIDI data are again just applied on playback.

This is a really fast, flexible approach to making typical MIDI data modifications in a transparent, non-destructive and easily managed way.

[CS70]

as this thread shows, the differences are minimal, and mostly cosmetic.

Perhaps I didn't phrase my post about Reaper very well, then. While I agree to an extent when it comes to most DAWs — they've all largely converged on the same basic model, with a few different frills around the edges, and GUI differences — some of Reaper's functionality and approach is very different from that of other DAWs.

Hehe, I said I may have missed some! Mouse modifiers seem interesting, even if probably you can achieve the same efficiency with other ways in other apps (Sonar has smart tools for example which change what click do depending on where in the clip you are).

I simply noticed that 90% of the stuff is plain vanilla - and certainly the top 5 functions are the same for everyone: can record, can edit, can overdub, can add effects etc. Basically what a DAW does.

[Kwackman]

having a range of the core DAWs each issue allowed folks to peruse how things are done in a different DAW.

Yup, I read the shimmer reverb article that was shown in Logic's Notes a month or so back , and copied the workflow in Cubase.

[Drew Stephenson]

having a range of the core DAWs each issue allowed folks to peruse how things are done in a different DAW.

Yup, I read the shimmer reverb article that was shown in Logic's Notes a month or so back , and copied the workflow in Cubase.

Likewise I have a quick scan at each DAW notes article, some of them are very product-specific, in which case I'll probably move on, but some are more concept-based (e.g. the shimmer article Kwackman mentions) and translate easily to other DAWs.

[Studio Support Gnome]

1) it records from single to high track count multi-track , through a vast range of interfaces with no stupid restrictions on I/O
2) it plays back reliably
3) it doesn't sound horrid
4) it can do real time processing with sensible latency
5) it'll run on my Laptop

anything else is fairy dust icing on the cake

[Dynamic Mike]

This thread has turned out to be quite enlightening. It appears quite a few of us are buying 'full fat' versions of DAW's for one or two features that aren't included in the lite versions. In my case with Cubase there are complex audio options and effects I require, whereas in contrast my midi needs probably wouldn't tax a 48k Spectrum. One basic synth with a few decent pads & a simple grid would suffice for me. On the other side of the coin I'm sure many here would trade a guitar amp simulator they never intend using for an extra synth. Others might never record audio at all & would prefer additional midi features.

I know you don't have to use any features you don't need, but they all add to the clutter & complexity of the layout, making it harder for beginners to find anything. There's also a nagging doubt that maybe you should be using them because you've paid for them. A bit like that Mandolin you bought, used on one intro & then never bothered to learn how to play properly?

Maybe an alternative business model would be a DAW whereby you purchased a basic framework with an audio & midi engine and then just included those features you wanted, with the option to add stuff as you went along. I mean something like those car manufacturers that now allow you to personalise the spec of a new car bit by bit rather than opting for a complete package of extras.

[Drew Stephenson]

A bit like that Mandolin you bought, used on one intro & then never bothered to learn how to play properly?

I feel personally attacked here!

Maybe an alternative business model would be a DAW whereby you purchased a basic framework with an audio & midi engine and then just included those features you wanted, with the option to add stuff as you went along.

Sounds a bit like how a guitar or synth selection gets started...
I guess the flaw with the modular proposition is that you can get a fully featured DAW like cakewalk for free, or Reaper for not much. I totally recognise the advantages of not getting distracted by features that you don't (yet) need, but I think you're fighting a hard battle against human nature.

[ManFromGlass]

I don’t want to quote the Full Desmond above but he is bang on with my thoughts except -

6 - freely assignable key commands. When the deadline clock is ticking mousing around slows me down and encourages the carpal tunnel.

7 - 1 pass stem bouncing. (Recording multiple tracks with their own outs + fx at once) The flexibility of Logic saves me hours now that I have that figured out. I always have to deliver stems for cues and if a show is wall-to-wall music then I’m not up pulling an all-nighter bouncing and checking stems.

[C.LYDE]

I did a top 5 for Cubase, and now I why I use Reason...

1.Combinators
Simply the most powerful synth creation tool built-in into a DAW... except possibly MAX for Ableton Live. Anything I or others imagine can be created..layered, analogue, sampler, FM mixed and stirred in any way possible with MIDI CC and then some

2. Players
So much fun! Love the way noodling can turn into real musical ideas...

3. The Rack
The environment after all these years without equal ... to able to patch & link ...like a kid in a audio toy store...

4, The limited mixer
This may be seen as a "limitation" but sometimes not having too many options is a relief

5. The instruments!
Simply love THOR and EUROPA... truly amazing (somewhat underrated) synths ...

Passing thought ... most of us have more than 1 guitar, synth, mic etc - why not more than 1 DAW... ?

[ConcertinaChap]

Passing thought ... most of us have more than 1 guitar, synth, mic etc - why not more than 1 DAW... ?

Brainpower undersupply, quite simply.

CC

[Drew Stephenson]

Also tools for the job. I have a number of guitars that all make slightly different (or wildly different) sounds. You pick the one that's appropriate and sometimes you need something that one of them won't do.
I.e the range of jobs is wider than the practical breadth of the tool.
For DAWs it's the other way round for most folks - Most DAWs can do far more than they are regularly used for, so why use more than one?
Though I did think heavily about getting Harrison Mix-bus just for stem-mixing / mastering when they had that huge discount a while back.
But in the end I decided that my time was better spent learning to get the best out of Reaper rather than learning another DAW.
Hence CC's comment above...

[Sam Spoons]

[muzines]

Most DAWs can do far more than they are regularly used for, so why use more than one?

There are of course some reasons for this - perhaps you like to work in DAW A, but also need to work in DAW B for compatibility / collaboration purposes (ie, some people you work with use a different DAW and it makes more sense to work in that DAW for those sessions, or perhaps you need to deliver a project in a different DAW format).

For me, although my main DAW is Logic, I also use Live as a secondary DAW because it has a workflow and set of tools that's unique and not covered that well by Logic (eg, all the actual live jamming stuff), so there's less overlap there in those features.

[Drew Stephenson]

Good points well made. Whilst i'm at i shall further undermine my own argument by bringing in the work vs home scenario; i use Reaper at home but Cubase at work.

[Terrible.dee]

I understand the question

and I'll give you the answer...THE RIGHT ANSWER,

because this bizarre "feature implementation" affects each and every person who works with digital audio (I'm pleased to say, now that I've gone "tape" this isn't as much of a thing for me, but its impossible to completely avoid digital, so..)

What's more, I don't even USE the DAW with my "Fav feature" for work anymore. When I quit making myself available for engineering/producing/mixing jobs, because I was MISERABLE, and made the decision I was only going to offer my services as a Composer/Songwriter to pay the bills, part of making that break was changing DAW's, The Library I went to work for wanted all composers standardized using Logic so cues could be shuffled about between composers, and play to everyone's strengths, but this was before that, I just NEEDED to look at something that didn't remind me of Producing/Engineering.

I hate the work that this feature makes so easy, but the feature its self should be the bar thta all DAW's measure up to, but bizarre as it is, after all these years.....not a SINGLE other DAW has brought their specs up to the gold standard of the...

AUDIO EDITING IN PROTOOLS

Yep, only ONE DAW has acceptably implemented the editing of digital audio....ONLY ONE!!

I have NO IDEA why this is still the case, it makes ZERO sense (Just like the Audio editing on other DAW'ss) I can't fathom how something so basic, so intrinsic, so important can be so completely f%$k'd up by all but ONE.

For this reason, it's better to go from another DAW to Protools, when you go the other way...WOW...let me tell you...It is INFURIATING.

How these other software designers so completely BOTCH this, I can't understand. But I'll never forget learning Logic, checking out where and how all the basic stuff is. I was like "You gotta be F&%k'n KIDDING ME!?!? IT'S NOT THAT HARD! WHY DO YOU MAKES THINGS WORSE THAN THEY NEED TO BE!?!?"

It's like you have all these hotels, they are all great, have pools, nightclubs, casinos ect ect, and in most respects they are all pretty much the same thing...............

.......except only ONE hotel has indoor toilets, at all the others you have to use an outhouse or chamber pot.

[Terrible.dee]

I'm sure other DAWs do these as well. I'm struggling a bit, but things that I find ultra useful are :

1. The take management for overdubs. Brilliant. Just brilliant.

2. Drum replacer. Basically, it's a 'spike to midi' translator and it's very useful to me for a variety of jobs. The obvious one is beefing up recorded drums, but there are other uses I can think of (and sometimes try). It's not particularly clever, but it's a very handy thing to have

3. Tempo detection. Again, not world changing or the one killer feature, but it's a useful tool for me when importing recorded audio.

4. The sheer volume of content. Bit of a double edged sword here - on the one hand, it's all great content but it does take ages to download and a shedload of hard drive space

5. The environment. I've only scratched the surface of this, but already found interesting ways of doing things and solved one issue I have

The Environment?

Yeaaah......I think your choice of words shines a light on the nature of the "environment"

You've found "Interesting ways of doing things" and "Solved an Issue"

I maintain to this day that the environment is the very symbol of Logic...

Over-complication for its own sake, taking something simple and adding unnecessary levels of complexity thereby becoming a distraction from the "reason de etre'

You open a DAW why? Either because you have some creative inclination, or someone else is paying you to assist them with theirs. I'm a firm believer in that tools should only assist, they should never try to become the star of the show, one doesn't open Logic with the idea of "I'm going to do some LOGIC'ING" But that is exactly what things like "The environment" lead to.

I am no novice when it comes to MIDI, I can program a DX7, work with hexadecimal sysex strings, I program a battalion of synths, drum machines and samplers from hardware sequencers, as a composer, I program nuanced orchestral performances using any and all parameters (And for this, I actually REALLY LIKE Logic, I can access dozens of automation lanes with ease)....I even know how to use a f'n Octatrack... (Although the manufacturer imposed restrictions, that bring it BELOW acceptable MIDI specs for 1985, disqualify it as a sequencer for me....A QY70 blows the Octatrack out of the water when it comes to MIDI, that's not good, one is $1400 the other is $100, someone needs to ask Elektron why it is they can't top a budget sequencer released in 1995)...

...but to this day, I have NEVER found a practical use for the environment, the only times I've HAD to venture in was when Logic's inability to work with hardware MIDI units led me there on a wild goose chase.

While there, I see stuff....but what I see are things that DO NOT NEED TO BE THAT COMPLICATED. THIS is how Logic, as a tool, always seems to be trying to take over the job, and make it about the tools, not about the muse.

If someone could justify the existence of the "Environment" I'd LOVE to hear it.

[Terrible.dee]

I use Cubase and Reaper. There are too many features to list, and we can take the basics for granted. So instead of my 'top' five, here are 'five of the best' features of each...

Reaper
1. Parameter modulation. Wow. Every DAW should have this.
2. Mouse modifiers — way more powerful than keystrokes alone. Every DAW should have this.
3. Scripting support — there's a whole community of people who will adapt this DAW to meet your needs! Every DAW... ah, you get the picture.
4. The routing flexibility. Drag and drop sends. Sends and receives on every track. Folder-busses. Up to 64 channels inside every stereo track. Routing matrix for each and every plug-in.
5. Prolific updates, with new features and bug fixes pretty much every month or two.

I've not even talked about the tiny download size, the stability, the CPU efficiency, the various grouping/linking options, the ability to run it off a pen drive... etc etc.

Cubase
1. The Chord Track, and its integration with both Variaudio and MIDI. Elegant and helpful.
2. Quadrafuzz V2. Utterly brilliant plug-in (even if the default presets aren't!)
3. Groove Agent's Acoustic Agent, the drum editor and drum maps.
4. The Control Room.
5. Automatic vocal alignment (even if Revoice Pro is better, it's good, and this is bloody brilliant to have inside your DAW).

Hmm......I think I may have to give Reaper another go

[Panas1]

damn. I wrote a wish list and then re-read the thread title...

[Eddy Deegan]

I love Reaper for many reasons and all of them are covered by previous posters.

- Fast Startup and zappy performance
- Scripting - write your own plugins in script ... just wow!
- Handles anything you drop into it
- Customisable
- Sensible Licensing

However, in respectful if direct contravention of the spirit of this thread... (sorry Ian, I'm spitting teeth right now!)

... Reaper's MIDI functionality is in some ways abysmal. It's non-intuitive, awkward, obscure and downright frustating compared to other DAWs.

I'm still using Reaper, it's incredibly powerful and flexible. Audio-wise it's everything you could wish for but when it comes to MIDI ... just ... AAAAARRRGGGHHHH!

Example. Go into the MIDI editor. Now select and delete a section of the take you don't want, leaving the rest. Default cursor is an "insert content" pen. Select a timeline and hit 'delete' ... nothing happens. Where is the rubber band to intuitively drag around the notes so you can hit 'delete' to remove them? Oh, there isn't one. WHY NOT?!

Right click - you have select all, select previous note, select next note, select previous note with same pitch, select next note with same pitch and select all notes with same pitch.

There is no option to select "slap Cockos in the face with a wet haddock because I want to select all notes in a give time range". Frankly, there should be.

Seriously it's infuriating. I get you can delete things in various ways but really, as a modern app it's terrible at sensible MIDI operations. Don't get me wrong, I think Reaper is awesome in pretty much every way other than MIDI editing. I just wish it was more intuitive.

-sigh- I now have to get back to figuring out how to do something MIDI-wise in Reaper that in Logic was trivial. I've been using DAWs for years and if it takes me 20 minutes+ to find a way to do something that should flipping obvious there is something wrong with the picture.

Rant over (Edit: Not quite!) - I'm sure I'l have figured it out before most people read this but for the love of the spaghetti monster... why is it so difficult?

PS: Yep. It's there. You drag with the right mouse button to select an arbitrary range of notes. Exactly the same as ... wait, no other sane piece of software on the planet. Why not a rubber band icon? I am now heading back to the session because I've got things to accomplish and if I continue I'm going to explode!

Not being funny, I really do like Reaper but I seriously don't like the way it breaks normal expectations of how things should work. It's almost as if it's doing it just to be different, and there are well established user patterns that really should't be deviated from.

Don't get me started on the hideously broken window view in the MIDI editor when you start copying and pasting sections of notes. Or the fact that it sometimes introduces a spurious ghost note into the end of the section you just pasted if it's the last section of the track. No, really... don't...

AAARGGGH

[Eddy Deegan]

PPS: As I'm on a roll.

Boot up Reaper. Do some stuff. Now power up a new MIDI source such as a Prophet-6, Kronos or OB-6. Reaper sees that new MIDI interface, adds it to the known list and helpfully defaults to ignoring it, going so far as to mark it 'disabled' in the device list in the options until you hunt that thing down and confirm that, uh, you really turned that device on for a reason.

And if that wasn't enough - having recorded a MIDI part in perfect sync with a recorded audio bass riff, when repeatedly copy/pasting the MIDI part in the track view using the convenient automatic 'paste the next MIDI part exactly at the end of the last one you pasted' feature ... it keeps perfect time from for the first few copies then drifts out of time subsequently. And no, before anyone asks, it's not because of a missing 1/16th note on the MIDI pattern or anything, it's bang on the right length and it still loses sync. I've done this dozens of times in Logic with no issues whatsoever.

Words fail me.

Sorry all it's been a long night and I'm still at it. Right now Reaper has given me so much pain tonight with things MIDI that I can only assume some mischievous deity imposed it on the Universe despite Cockos's best efforts to argue otherwise.

One can only scream "WHY?" so many times before you go insane or adopt a silly mood as a last ditch self-defence mechanism.

Don't let me derail a lovely thread with my petty rants. I feel guilty enough already. In the unlikely (and why should you?) event that anyone feels the need to respond, let's take that one to the Lounge. MIDI is badly broken in Reaper.

Sorry Ian - my original 5 good points remain nonetheless.

[Eddy Deegan]

Yep .. bug confirmed:

Here's the section that fails to align:



And here it is in context:



Only the first section (sections being indicated by the white semi-triangular indents on the bottom end of the track timeline) was recorded. The others were cut and pasted repeatedly. At the point indicated, Reaper decided to offset the paste by a negative amount.

Going to find the correct means to report this as a bug but I'm still grrrr... this has taken me time I can't afford to track down

[Matt Houghton]

You drag with the right mouse button to select an arbitrary range of notes. Exactly the same as ... wait, no other sane piece of software on the planet. Why not a rubber band icon?

I know what you mean about the Reaper defaults— some are frustrating at first if you're migrating from another DAW. But for me, this default works really, really well. Perhaps it's because I'm using a trackpad? A one-finger tap moves the playhead, a one-finger click/drag creates a note or selects a single note (with the usual Shift and Cmd modifiers to increase that selection, as with pretty much every piece of software ever...) and a two-finger click-drag marquee-selects multiple notes. It seems pretty logical to me, but as with everything in Reaper, it's really easy to change — the Mouse Modifiers in Preferences, like the Actions, are searchable...

[muzines]

The Environment?

So, I guess I'm claiming this one...

You've found "Interesting ways of doing things" and "Solved an Issue"

Yep - Logic is pretty good at letting you do some things that some power users need, without it getting the way for the people that don't need those things.

I maintain to this day that the environment is the very symbol of Logic...
Over-complication for its own sake, taking something simple and adding unnecessary levels of complexity thereby becoming a distraction from the "reason de etre'

Well I couldn't disagree more. I'd say probably 90% or more people never even open the environment window, nor have a reason to do so, so it certainly isn't a "distraction" to most folks - and Logic's development has focused on repackaging up some of the stuff you used it for into "friendlier" and more accessible ways - eg MIDI plugins, or the "External Instrument" software instrument and many more ways - and pushing the environment features away from the casual users who don't want to go there.

The Environment has a reputation for being "over-complicated" but it is no more complicated than connecting MIDI devices together - indeed, that was entirely the paradigm the environment uses. Of course, back in the days when Logic was a MIDI-only sequencer, and all users had a bunch of MIDI gear, the paradigms were more familiar to most - many people these days don't have much of a concept of MIDI, even though they're using it, so it's perhaps less obvious to the youngfolk.

I actually think the biggest barrier to the environment for those folks who shy away for it is that they just have no use for it - and thus they kind of look at it blankly, shrug, and close it again.

I'm a firm believer in that tools should only assist, they should never try to become the star of the show, one doesn't open Logic with the idea of "I'm going to do some LOGIC'ING" But that is exactly what things like "The environment" lead to.

I love the fact that I can, should I want to, build extra functionality in my DAW to assist me *more* than it would otherwise do. But I don't have to. it's the same as scripting in Reaper - don't care about it, then ignore it, and it doesn't get in the way. However, for a small subset of power users, it's a godsend that lets them improve their workflow significantly.

In fact, the environment, and it's possibilities, was probably *the* key reason I moved from Notator to Logic 1.x back in the day. Things I couldn't do but wanted to in Notator could now be handled easily.

...but to this day, I have NEVER found a practical use for the environment

That's fine. Not everybody needs every tool. I can't say I spend a lot of time in the score editor either, but that doesn't mean I don't think it should be there... And the score editor is certainly complicated, and requires understanding of the principles of notation, and layout, and what makes a good readable score. But again, it's not like the score system is a distraction for the people that don't need it - they just don't open that window. It's the same principle as the Environment.

While there, I see stuff....but what I see are things that DO NOT NEED TO BE THAT COMPLICATED

So, firstly, it really isn't complicated. You can demonstrate the principles, and the key concepts, in a couple of minutes. However, people (being as we are) *are* complicated, and often have complicated needs. And in this manner, if the environment has a weakness, it is if anything (imo) *too simple*.

The fact that the tools in the environment are inherently very simple (something to output MIDI messages, something to transform MIDI messages, something to monitor MIDI messages etc - there's only a handful of types of object) means that *if* you need to do something complicated, it can become a bit of a mess to implement. For example, let's say you want to store the value of a note played for some reason - there is no concept of a store, or "variable", so you have to create faders to "hold" that value. This is where stuff gets unintuitive, and over-complex. With some work, some new objects, including getting the MIDI Scripter plugin into the environment, then developing solutions to needs would result in much *simpler* environment setups. But I digress...

If someone could justify the existence of the "Environment" I'd LOVE to hear it.

The thing is, if you need it, you know you need it. It's a bit like talking about workflow and automation tools to people who are happy using their Mac with the mouse. I can hardly bear to use a "plain" Mac, it feels slow and constrained and annoying - I use all kinds of enhancements to make my experience better, faster, more efficient, less frustrating. I use LaunchBar, Keyboard Maestro and all kinds of other tools, and they are a necessity to me in a myriad of ways. But talking about how cool these automation tools are to another person doesn't take into account that that person just might not be interested, or need it, or even want to change a known workflow, even if the new workflow would be much better. Some folks are happy enough just to do things the way they know works.

So if you have no use for the environment, there is no point me going on about why it's important for *me*, because those things are clearly not important to you. You'll find the comments unconvincing.

Lastly - because of the fact that since Apple's acquisition of Logic, they have been working to simplify and streamline, and most of their development choices you can understand, even if some of them were a little annoying to long-term power users. And many of those things which were once environment-only solutions can now be done in other ways (the MIDI plugins and MIDI Scripter are some examples, and there are plenty more).

But also times have changed, and gone are the days when Logic for me sat in the middle of a roomful of MIDI gear. Probably 90% of the time now, I'm not even firing up my hardware MIDI interfaces or gear, and Logic is being an audio workstation, a software synth, sampler and so on - and as such, my environment use is much less these days, compared to my Logic 1-5 days.

The Environment is still there. It still underpins Logic, tracks still have Environment objects assigned to them, an Audio Track 1 object is an environment object, and so everyone is using the Environment, even if they have no need to do anything custom or even open up the environment window. But it has been neglected and under-developed, so Apple's treatment of it seems to indicate how they feel about it - it has to stay for project compatibility, removing or changing it would be a significant amount of foundational work on a large legacy codebase, and it's a set of tools that are less relevant to the userbase than ever before. So, it stays, it gets hidden away as much as possible, and we make every effort to not require a typical user to need to go there to do anything they regularly need to do, while still being there for those that *do* have a use for it, or have developed custom solutions in the past that still work for them, and would be painful to lose.

It's old, it's under-developed, it's over-simple, it's paradigm is probably out-dated, and it's not important to most users.

But it's helped me out tremendously over the years, and I love software where you can develop custom solutions for things that would otherwise get in the way of my creativity, should you need to.

If it's not important to you - that's Ok too.

[ManFromGlass]

A practical example of why I needed Logics environment -
Back in the day I had a fully loaded JV 1080. Some kind soul, (or anal-retentive person ) took the time to enter every single patch name in a multi instrument in Logics environment, actually a few multi instruments. I downloaded it and copied and pasted it (them) into my master template. I could now pull up any of the tons of patches in Logic and it would be the correct one. A small but very useful, to me, feature that saved me lots of time and frustration over the years.
I’m no code head but is wasn’t brain surgery to figure out how to implement the multi instrument.