Zoom H3-VR

[ConcertinaChap]

Here's the link to the audio from CC's quick test: https://www.dropbox.com/s/x00d4v7qbhxttm2/1st%20H3-VR%20test.wav?dl=0

This has been processed to binaural so best listened to on headphones.

CC

[The Elf]

In the same way that some poeple don't see 3D, I don't hear front/back. I can hear the L/R movement, but beyond that I would need a visual cue.

That recording sounds nice and clean, and I do think it would be ideal for my purpose as an audience/ambience mic for live gigs, but without an output to my main mixer/recorder to ensure synced recording I'm afraid it's a dead end for me. As a stand-alone I'd like one, but I can't really justify it for the number of times it would be suitable.

[Hugh Robjohns]

In the same way that some poeple don't see 3D, I don't hear front/back. I can hear the L/R movement, but beyond that I would need a visual cue.

Very few people perceive accurate front-back (or up-down) positional cues with binaural -- at least, not without the binaural processor working from an accurately derived personal HRTF.

However, if the sound incorporates implied positional information the brain is quite happy to make assumptions -- a moving plane sound will be perceived as being overhead, for example.

But as you say, with unfamiliar source material its almost inevitable that there will be a lot of positional ambiguity.

H

[Wonks]

It's behind you!

[Rich Hanson]

Oh no it isn't!

(Sorry, Pavlovian response there. Just hit me with a banjo.)

[Drew Stephenson]

Can assist...

[ConcertinaChap]

Before you do there's this recorder I wonder if you'll hold it for me ...

CC

[ConcertinaChap]

I've been listening to binaural quite a lot lately for one reason or another and what I've found is that while I can't say definitively that a sound is coming from in front or behind me I can say with some certainty it's not in the middle of my head. In fact the sense of actually being there can be quite startling. Binaural can sound far more like being in a space than any stereo recording I've ever listened to. That's the real gain for me.

Of course this may be all psychoacoustics and I'm just fantasising this by virtue of knowing it's a binaural recording, but I don't think so (maybe cue some double-blind testing somewhere downstream). Either way, of course, YMMV.

CC

[Hugh Robjohns]

I've been listening to binaural quite a lot lately for one reason or another and what I've found is that while I can't say definitively that a sound is coming from in front or behind me I can say with some certainty it's not in the middle of my head. In fact the sense of actually being there can be quite startling. Binaural can sound far more like being in a space than any stereo recording I've ever listened to. That's the real gain for me.

Yes, I'll definitely go with that as a major benefit of binaural.

The Beeb went through a phase of making lots of binaural recordings in the early 80s and again in the late 90s... it seems to be an idea that gets recycled every couple of decades or so.

It can certainly produce some very involving listening experiences... and I've seen listeners quite literally jump off their chairs to avoid the source of a sound in the recording but which they thought was really in the room with them!

Sometimes, though, that sense of involvement can be too much and people seem to become weary of it after a while -- much like the exaggerated ping-pong stereo of the 1960s.

Binaural recording is certainly fun, though! I have a Sennheiser dummy head for the purpose which always attracts very strange looks when I set it up!

H

[ConcertinaChap]

The Beeb did an episode of Dr Hugh, sorry, Who back in 2017 in binaural. Not available online now but you can find a slightly condescending trailer for it here.

CC

[Hugh Robjohns]

BBC Wales got very excited about immersive media for a while...

[The Elf]

Disney do (did? Still there?) an amazing headphone audio experience in 'Conservation Station' where you are aurally set down in a rainforest to hear the sounds all around you. That's the best I've heard beyond that amazing old 'garage door' demo that caused a few spilled teas and coffees over the years.

[Hugh Robjohns]

Disney do (did? Still there?) an amazing headphone audio experience in 'Conservation Station' where you are aurally set down in a rainforest to hear the sounds all around you.

That kind of thing works really well in binaural because the individual sounds don't need to be perceived with accurate spatial positions, and it doesn't matter if different people perceive different locations.

[The Elf]

The tiger breathing down your neck definitely seems to be right behind you!

[Drew Stephenson]

Listening to CC's recording I was initially convinced that I could tell that he was walking round the back of the mic, then I jumped to another point and jumped back and realised that actually I could only identify distance not location. A triumph of brain over hearing!

[MOF]

In the same way that some poeple don't see 3D, I don't hear front/back. I can hear the L/R movement, but beyond that I would need a visual cue.

I listened to some binaural material recently with a view to buying an ambisonic microphone and couldn’t get any sense of sound image in front of me. Left, right, behind me, no problem.

[ConcertinaChap]

The reason I bought an ambisonic mic (and more recently the H3-VR) had little to do with surround sound in any format. Instead it was about the way you can create virtual mics in the ambient space for use in normal stereo recordings. I have to say I'm well pleased with how this worked out, but the whole binaural thing came along later and turns out to be a rather "nice to have" additional feature.

CC

[Stratman57]

OK, you guys have got me really intrigued by this. I've gone back and searched Ambisonics on the SOS site and read up on the subject, especially the Zoom device.

Now I'm thinking of a specific application, and that is, I did a preproduction theatre piece set in the Lake District Fells, and I had sound effects that I could play in in stereo, but I'm wondering if I recorded some ambient sounds in the field, would I be able to realistically reproduce it with 4 separate feeds to powered speakers. I have a Behringer XR18, and 2 X Maui G11 MK2 and 2 X Studiospares 15A active cabs.

Regards, Simon.

[Hugh Robjohns]

I'm wondering if I recorded some ambient sounds in the field, would I be able to realistically reproduce it with 4 separate feeds to powered speakers.

Yes. Ambisonic recordings can be decoded to any desired number of outputs, depending on the capabilities of the decoding software. Four cardinal outputs shouldn't be a problem.

H

[Drew Stephenson]

Four cardinal outputs shouldn't be a problem.

There's some kind of Richelieu / rich lows joke here but I've not had enough coffee yet.

[Wonks]

"Nobody expects the ambisonics inquisition!"............"Nobody expects the ambisonics inquisition!"

"Nobody expects the ambisonics inquisition!"............"Nobody expects the ambisonics inquisition!"

[Hugh Robjohns]

[Dan LB]

[ConcertinaChap]

Well, that was certainly unexpected.

CC

[MOF]

Yes. Ambisonic recordings can be decoded to any desired number of outputs, depending on the capabilities of the decoding software. Four cardinal outputs shouldn't be a problem.

I went to an ambisonic demonstration many years ago and I seem to remember that the placement of speakers was proscribed. The two front speakers were at (L-R) 315º and 45º and the rear speakers were at 135º and 225º they were all above your head pointing down at you, I seem to remember. I can't find anything on the web to confirm this.