The 16" Macbook Pro is out

[muzines]

More here:
https://www.apple.com/uk/macbook-pro-16/

A fully specced up machine weighs in a nearly 6 grand...

(In case you're fretting about what to buy me for Christmas this year, that's the one... )

The Mac Pro has also been announced for December...

[Agharta]

The Mac Pro has also been announced for December...

Did they give a year also?

[ConcertinaChap]

I like the way they say "Boundaries are meant to be pushed". Obviously Apple regards price as a boundary.

CC

[muzines]

I like the way they say "Boundaries are meant to be pushed". Obviously Apple regards price as a boundary.

I think most people were expecting these to be even more expensive, but they are the same price as the previous versions - but better machines, by the look. And with, like, keyboards that are (hopefully) reliable...

I think my first Mac laptop, a Powerbook G4, was over 2 grand, so getting on for the base price of these. And that was already pretty slow by the standards of other machines...

[Rich Hanson]

Is the bit about improved cooling leading to better performance a tacit admission that they ballsed it up on the previous generation?

[muzines]

Is the bit about improved cooling leading to better performance a tacit admission that they ballsed it up on the previous generation?

Sure, that's how Apple do it.
Same with the keyboard situation.

The marketing language is really clear when you're at all familiar with how Apple roll - they will never say the old one was not great, they'll just say the new one is the "best one ever" and "we think customers are really going to love it" etc etc.

Some of the interviews with the MBP product manager are fun - they *clearly* understand the problems, and they invested a *ton* of effort researching and investigating the keyboard situation for this iteration (also designed in conjunction with the Pro Workflow team.)

[Rich Hanson]

That's an issue I have with Apple these days, it seems that increasingly they can't just put their hand up and say "ok, we got it wrong".

[ConcertinaChap]

Did they ever? Remember the phones with aerials that didn't work because, apparently, the users were holding them the wrong way?

CC

[Arpangel]

That's an issue I have with Apple these days, it seems that increasingly they can't just put their hand up and say "ok, we got it wrong".

I got that attitude when my i Mac had to be repaired, Mac's never go wrong sir, they never get viruses, they just make your life perfect sir, in every way...our way.

[Rich Hanson]

When my current MacBook dies (a piddly little 2012 i5 base model but it does the job more than adequately for the way I work) I am giving serious consideration to going back to PC, possibly even Linux.

[johnny h]

When my current MacBook dies (a piddly little 2012 i5 base model but it does the job more than adequately for the way I work) I am giving serious consideration to going back to PC, possibly even Linux.

It’s shame that PC laptops are still all awful. Either underpowered, badly built crap or weighty, gamer focused tanks with absurdly overpowered graphics cards and adolescent flashing lights.

[johnny h]

Looks like they’ve sorted out a few glaring issues - keyboard, battery life, ram etc.

Shame that Catalina is absolutely crap and you can’t put a decent OS on it.

[Howdy Doody Time]

Are they taking the pash? The previous one doesn't work.

I'm typing this on the previous one, logged in to the internet, and in a different tab I have Nuendo 10 running, which is telling me it is not connected to the internet, and explaining the benefits of being attached to the internet.

Meanwhile it doesn't see my Reason 11 Suite dongle, and that normally doesn't matter because you can log into your account on the internet

Only it doesn't see the internet

Seriously are they freeking kidding or what?

I wanted to see if Nuendo will see the Reason Suite as a standalone VST plugin.

[Howdy Doody Time]

Desmond, Fide Defensor, writes

"I think most people were expecting these to be even more expensive, but they are the same price as the previous versions - but better machines, by the look. And with, like, keyboards that are (hopefully) reliable...'

Asd far as the previous model is concerned - I confirm the keyboard is not up to ZX81 standard, although it appears to have been developed with the same fiscal magnastritude employed by Sir Clive whilst failing to achieve the same level of reliability.

Better machines? They couldn't be much worse actually. I'm beginning to think Catalina was deliberately sabotaged as a smoke screen to blur the disaster of the ultra terrible 2019 MBP.

The fan noise alone precludes its use as a DAW host when it (frequently) gets hot. The dongle tangle required to allow the use of USB C or whatever it is is clumsy, unattractive and positively annoying. Then certain dongles are not seen at all through the maze of cables boxes and plugs. Catalina is the icing on the rancid cake.

The unfortunate user of this over hyped, overly expensive trash is left not knowing which faults are the result of the hardware or the OS, and as usual Apple is singularly disinterested.

I long ago gave up on Apple blogs to find answers - they are populated by fanbois who never see any wrong in Apple, and spend their long tedious hours longing for the next release.

And now they released a new and improved model?

Time to survey the PC listings I think.

[Humble Bee]

Desmond, Fide Defensor, writes

"I think most people were expecting these to be even more expensive, but they are the same price as the previous versions - but better machines, by the look. And with, like, keyboards that are (hopefully) reliable...'

Asd far as the previous model is concerned - I confirm the keyboard is not up to ZX81 standard, although it appears to have been developed with the same fiscal magnastritude employed by Sir Clive whilst failing to achieve the same level of reliability.

Better machines? They couldn't be much worse actually. I'm beginning to think Catalina was deliberately sabotaged as a smoke screen to blur the disaster of the ultra terrible 2019 MBP.

The fan noise alone precludes its use as a DAW host when it (frequently) gets hot. The dongle tangle required to allow the use of USB C or whatever it is is clumsy, unattractive and positively annoying. Then certain dongles are not seen at all through the maze of cables boxes and plugs. Catalina is the icing on the rancid cake.

The unfortunate user of this over hyped, overly expensive trash is left not knowing which faults are the result of the hardware or the OS, and as usual Apple is singularly disinterested.

I long ago gave up on Apple blogs to find answers - they are populated by fanbois who never see any wrong in Apple, and spend their long tedious hours longing for the next release.

And now they released a new and improved model?

Time to survey the PC listings I think.

Yes Howdy Doody Time, I think it is time for you to switch from Apple to something else and move on from there.

[Arpangel]

When my current MacBook dies (a piddly little 2012 i5 base model but it does the job more than adequately for the way I work) I am giving serious consideration to going back to PC, possibly even Linux.

As an example, I put Reaper on my Linux machine, I wouldn't be worried about using that OS at all for music, it's a viable option.

[Rich Hanson]

I have a Tracktion license, and that host has a native Linux version, so it's definitely an option. Anyway, not jumping ship until this laptop turns its toes up!

[CS70]

Asd far as the previous model is concerned - I confirm the keyboard is not up to ZX81 standard, although it appears to have been developed with the same fiscal magnastritude employed by Sir Clive whilst failing to achieve the same level of reliability.

60K?

Is there really people willing to spend that much for a laptop?

Even at a third of that price, the value for money achieved by Sir Clive is incomparably superior

[Urthlupe]

I use a trashcan MacPro here whose comparative silence after the previous jet engine-esque MacPro was a massive relief (although it catastrophically failed within four months and had to be replaced.....).

Looks as if the new chassis has returned to multi-fan hell unfortunately, but just for fun I fully loaded one on the Apple site.....

£14,000.........!!!!! I was a bit stunned I must say.......

Our daughter and partner have just bought their first house.... that equals her half of the deposit - for a desktop computer - it really is a kind of lunacy I’m afraid.

Loopy

[johnny h]

I use a trashcan MacPro here whose comparative silence after the previous jet engine-esque MacPro was a massive relief (although it catastrophically failed within four months and had to be replaced.....).

Looks as if the new chassis has returned to multi-fan hell unfortunately, but just for fun I fully loaded one on the Apple site.....

£14,000.........!!!!! I was a bit stunned I must say.......

Our daughter and partner have just bought their first house.... that equals her half of the deposit - for a desktop computer - it really is a kind of lunacy I’m afraid.

A top spec Mac Pro is not really a “desktop computer”. It’s a super high end professional workstation with a huge power supply and thirsty, expensive graphics. The $1000 monitor stand is an absolute joke though. Even die hard Mac worshippers wince at that.

The Mac mini is a desktop computer and it’s fine for most tasks.

[Agharta]

A top spec Mac Pro is not really a “desktop computer”. It’s a super high end professional workstation with a huge power supply and thirsty, expensive graphics.

Yes and these can generally easily go above £10K in price.
I imagine the disappointment with the next gen Mac Pro for audio users is more that the starting price is so high rather than how much a high end configuration costs.
The higher end versions are disappointing for another reason in that in some core ways the specs are already trounced by the competition.
AMD's 3rd generation Threadripper platform is released this month and it kicks the Intel platform into touch.
More and higher performing cores giving better performance and power efficiency and at a much lower cost.
PCIe 4.0 which doubles the bandwidth for SSDs.

I'm sure the Mac Pro has some unique features but the timing could hardly be worse.

[Urthlupe]

A top spec Mac Pro is not really a “desktop computer”. It’s a super high end professional workstation with a huge power supply.

Here we go....

Whatever you say Johnny boy - I’m way past debating terms like ‘super high end’ (giggle), and whose PSU might be bigger.....

At my ‘augmented’ age I’m able to reflect on too many decades of computer use in a greater variety of settings than I can remember (I was out of my teens even before Jobs took the company public - 1980 I think). We clearly think different. Apologies if my view was presented as ‘a truth’, simply my view m8. I’ll get back to my current addiction - PUBG on iPad......

And just to demonstrate how dysfunctional and conflicted our gorgeous human world is - think I’m about to spend on one of the new 16” MacBook Pro’s.... maybe it’s more than just a lappie - Apple tell me it’s ‘The Best For The Brightest’. Maybe right in one sense at least ?

Xx

Loopy

[zenguitar]

Four sockets to plug into +3

At the same price point as the previous generation +1

Catalina -1, but a flawed OS at worst can be fixed and at best can be upgraded.

As I was about to invest in a MacBook Pro with a single Thunderbolt connector, the new machine offers me another 3 connectors for free and saves me the cost of a Thunderbolt hub as well. My iMac can carry the load until Catalina is fixed.

Andy

[Howdy Doody Time]

Zenguitar writes "Four sockets to plug into +3"

If they are the same as those on the 2019 (15") MBP they aren't much use. What I mean is if they are all USB C (Thunderbolt?) sockets. Most of what I want to plug in is USB vanilla, so a hub or two is still needed.

I advise getting hubs with long leads otherwise it's cumbersome and untidy.

My 2019 MBP should be a fabulous computer - 8 core Intel i9, 16 Gb, big solid state drive, but it isn't and wasn't before Catalina - it's worse since. But maybe Apple will sort something out.

I strongly advisw waiting before buying the latest MBP, it's too much money to throw away.

[T3Dflo]

Honestly, all of you people who upgraded to Catalina when you had to have known it was having problems (specifically with audio) & are are all down on mac complaining about it, are a little ridiculous. What did expect was going to happen? I still havent upgraded & ive had 0 problems with my hardware or software...even new software. The new features on Catalina that they were advertising about were nonsense anyway. New 16" looks amazing. & I'm sure like most other mbps it'll be better than anything hp or acer etc etc have going on. Imo.