Inspiration and Music Composition

[John Egan]

Inspiration and composition only come into play if you’re actually "creating" something based on your own personal experiences, if you have something to say.
If you are involved in any other type of musical activity you don’t need inspiration, and you’re not actually composing anything, you’re just doing it parrot fashion, and you can do that anytime, it’s like a nine to five job.

That's pretty harsh and seems to rule out most of the work of the creators of the Great American Songbook. And a lot of the output of The Beatles, Bob Dylan and Paul Simon, etc.Regards, John
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Yes, it was a bit harsh, on reflection, maybe a bad choice of words on my part.
Don’t know why it should rule out the output of those you mention though?

I think that many great songwriters are shrewd readers and observers of the world around them with a good eye for a story line . They often show their personalities/beliefs in their writing and they certainly demonstrate empathy in bucketloads but don't necessarily write from experience.
Just as as an example, Rodgers and Hammerstein were New York based Jewish musicians and I'm not sure how much their backgrounds and experience could have helped them with Oklahoma, Carousel or indeed The King and I. Plenty of Bob Dylan's work draws on his reading and musical influences, rather than direct experience.
I do agree, however that who you are undoubtedly has an influence on your writing and certainly on the perspective you bring to the table.
Regards, John

[Arpangel]

I think that many great songwriters are shrewd readers and observers of the world around them with a good eye for a story line . They often show their personalities/beliefs in their writing and they certainly demonstrate empathy in bucketloads but don't necessarily write from experience.
Just as as an example, Rodgers and Hammerstein were New York based Jewish musicians and I'm not sure how much their backgrounds and experience could have helped them with Oklahoma, Carousel or indeed The King and I. Plenty of Bob Dylan's work draws on his reading and musical influences, rather than direct experience.
I do agree, however that who you are undoubtedly has an influence on your writing and certainly on the perspective you bring to the table.
Regards, John

All true, I heard Stevie Wonder make some interesting comments on this subject, they weren’t a million miles away from what I said, and he was very firm about it, you can hear the interview here.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=fIXU5ExruI0

[MOF]

Do you ever find yourself singing one of your own songs? If so, that’s a sign that you’re a composer and in theory that those songs are catchy.

[John Egan]

Do you ever find yourself singing one of your own songs? If so, that’s a sign that you’re a composer and in theory that those songs are catchy.

If only that were true!
Regards, John

[Arpangel]

Do you ever find yourself singing one of your own songs? If so, that’s a sign that you’re a composer and in theory that those songs are catchy.

I often hear a piece at a friends house, either by me, or by me and him, and I say, who’s that? that’s interesting, then he says, it’s us! So I must be doing something right.

[Tomás Mulcahy]

This is a really great book on creativity in any art-form, and I've found it hugely helpful:
https://www.amazon.co.uk/Art-Fear-Obser ... 714&sr=8-1

I think "focus on melody" is an attempt to solve a common problem by doing the exact opposite, which then creates more problems. In popular composition there's often an over-emphasis on chords. Block chords. This is probably because the guitar facilitates that. Previously we would have worked with harmony, but in the form of counter-point, which is rooted in singing and therefore melody.

There's plenty of good stuff out there with little or no "melody". Writing melodies has been done very well for hundreds of years, it's gonna be hard to be original or better previous art. So don't even try to be original or better! As has been pointed out- imitation is valid.

So I think better advice would be- don't get too hung up on chords, but don't get hung up on melody either. Quite literally, don't get hung up on ANYTHING. Because anything can be the germ of an idea.

What type of music do you want to compose, is it the catchy melody/theme tune or supportive mood music for a film?

In direct opposition to this idea: Brian Eno's "Music for Films" and "Music for Airports" and all of the subsequent ambient music genre. You probably don't like it, but people make careers out of that kind of music.

Writing for a non-existent film is a perfectly good catalyst for composition.

That burning need to tell the world something is the foundation upon which art can be built.

I genuinely think you make a good point, and I'm not trying to knock it, but there is a caveat. It's A foundation. Not THE foundation. I think creative concepts in painting and sculpture are much further ahead than most music in this regard. Anything presented as art IS art, a concept first proposed (successfully) by Marcel Duchamp with his urinal in 1917. Frank Zappa was of the same "frame" of mind and he was among the most productive composers ever. So it's not gonna be pop, but it can be a successful approach. There doesn't need to be any message or ideal implied. That's the classical concept.

[Arpangel]

I’m not interested in what other people have to say in their music, or their experiences, music I like reminds me of my experiences and that’s why I like it, I always see something that I can adapt to fit my own life, that’s the secret of good writing, making it flexible enough to apply to a lot of different scenarios.

[Tomás Mulcahy]

I’m not interested in what other people have to say in their music, or their experiences, music I like reminds me of my experiences and that’s why I like it, I always see something that I can adapt to fit my own life, that’s the secret of good writing, making it flexible enough to apply to a lot of different scenarios.

I agree. Music goes beyond regular communication, it's on another level. It is its own message. Consciously trying to put a message or a meaning in is a great way to create writer's block. But if you're writing pop songs, or musicals, or operas, then yes go for it if that is where your skill/ love is.

[Drew Stephenson]

Chap I know really likes instrumental music, "It doesn't tell you what to think."
This has made me think about the stuff I write - muting the vocals can be very revealing of when I really haven't made the whole composition/arrangement work as hard as it could.

[MOF]

Chap I know really likes instrumental music, "It doesn't tell you what to think."
This has made me think about the stuff I write - muting the vocals can be very revealing of when I really haven't made the whole composition/arrangement work as hard as it could.

Do you put in the vocal line as an instrumental top line or do you just listen to the track without vocals?

[Arpangel]

Chap I know really likes instrumental music, "It doesn't tell you what to think."
This has made me think about the stuff I write - muting the vocals can be very revealing of when I really haven't made the whole composition/arrangement work as hard as it could.

Music is like radio, it encourages me to use my imagination more, and create my own worlds, unlike television.
I was listening to Sibelius Karelia Suite at 6am this morning, I saw marching armies, and oppressive 1984 style bureaucracy. Really depressing.

[IAA]

I was listening to Sibelius Karelia Suite at 6am this morning, I saw marching armies, and oppressive 1984 style bureaucracy. Really depressing.

.....which is not what motivated the composer, I hear uplifting and fervent belief, but that’s the nature of art, we rarely all share the same reaction.

[Drew Stephenson]

Chap I know really likes instrumental music, "It doesn't tell you what to think."
This has made me think about the stuff I write - muting the vocals can be very revealing of when I really haven't made the whole composition/arrangement work as hard as it could.

Do you put in the vocal line as an instrumental top line or do you just listen to the track without vocals?

Just mute the main vocals. I'm not expecting it to grab me like a full song, but it shouldn't bore me.
It doesn't always mean it's wrong of course, sometimes it's all about the words. But it's a good thing to check - for me.

[IAA]

doesn't always mean it's wrong of course, sometimes it's all about the words. But it's a good thing to check - for me.

I’ve never written words! When I wrote in a band I did the music and the singer the lyrics. It was interesting, I felt, what words actually ended up over the music, sometimes over passages that I intended to be instrumental! Nowadays I still just do music, although I’m collaborating with a singer who I want to let write lyrics over a short passage. I said to him, this is what the music is intending to convey, write with your voice knowing that. Looking forward to what pops out.

[Drew Stephenson]

I know what you mean. When we moved from a three piece to a four piece we had to quite heavily rework a lot of the songs to make space for the new content to breathe. There's no point in having a very handy guitarist in the line up if I'm just going to moan over the top of him.
But I'm not much of a musician so I need the words to lean on.

[Sam Spoons]

Just don't lean on them when they're on that barbed wire fence

[Drew Stephenson]

Now THAT is an in joke!

[CS70]

doesn't always mean it's wrong of course, sometimes it's all about the words. But it's a good thing to check - for me.

I’ve never written words! When I wrote in a band I did the music and the singer the lyrics. It was interesting, I felt, what words actually ended up over the music, sometimes over passages that I intended to be instrumental! Nowadays I still just do music, although I’m collaborating with a singer who I want to let write lyrics over a short passage. I said to him, this is what the music is intending to convey, write with your voice knowing that. Looking forward to what pops out.

Fun. Since I play and sing, I tend to make songs where music and lyrics kind of respond to each other. Learned a lot in the long past when I started playing the blues, and the guitar often responds to the lyrics during the little breaks between sentences.