Recording Studios Are... Pointless / Essential !

[Forum Admin]

As we know there are plenty of SOS Forum members/guests who rarely ever explore other areas of the website, I think it is worth posting a link to Editor In Chief Sam Inglis' August issue video.

Watch Recording Studios Are... Pointless / Essential !

Enjoy!

[Martin Walker]

Brilliantly argued Sam!

Martin

[Kwackman]

The Nerdy question- those mics look like the old (early 80s) AKG451 range with VR1(or 2) extensions, but they seem too shiny and new to be them. So, what are they?

P.S. Surely we need an anorak emoji?

[Sam Inglis]

You're quite right -- C451 with VR1 and CK1 capsule. Oddly enough spoken word is about the only thing I actually like it on!

[Eddy Deegan]

That was a good watch, I'm enjoying the videos in the "Sam speaks" series

[Drew Stephenson]

World's longest magazine plug!

[MOF]

You're quite right -- C451 with VR1 and CK1 capsule. Oddly enough spoken word is about the only thing I actually like it on!

Still used a lot in studios!!

[Folderol]

All seemed a bit fishy to me

[Sam Spoons]

You're quite right -- C451 with VR1 and CK1 capsule. Oddly enough spoken word is about the only thing I actually like it on!

Still used a lot in studios!!

I have a couple, almost hobsons choice if I need a Cardioid SDC.....

[Hugh Robjohns]

Oddly enough spoken word is about the only thing I actually like it on!

They do work very well on voice. Back in my formative TV sound days we used CK1/451s as standby mics hidden on the presenter desks or by chairs for interviews etc. The mains mics were Sony ECM50s lavaliers at the time which the production people preferred aesthetically... But I almost always preferred the sound of the 451/CK1s and routinely used them for recordings/broadcasts with the ECM50s as the backup!

We later changed to Sennhesier MKE2s for the lavalier mics (often used in pairs) which were a lot better, and the idea of separate standby mics seemed to fade away...

But C451/CK1s on anything musical often sounded bright and 'fierce' to me...

[Zukan]

Great stuff! Thanks Sam and Knower.

[MOF]

But C451/CK1s on anything musical often sounded bright and 'fierce' to me...

I used mine for bench microphones at press calls, haven’t done one of those in years though.
We used them in booms for drama and sitcoms nearly all the time.
I read that they’re used a lot as hi hat and under snare mics and sometimes as overheads in studios.

[The Red Bladder]

I once attended a discussion in which Bruce Swedien explained how he recorded a drum kit. It was very revealing and after about a year of practice, I was able to copy his method and get a good drum sound with a small number of mics within five to ten minutes. Over the years I have refined that method and it served me well.

When I see amateurs (or semi-pros BS'ing it) faffing about for over an hour, I think of an old Chinese fable -

There was once a king who loved the graceful curves of the rooster. He asked the court artist to paint a picture of a rooster for him. For one year he waited and still this order was not fulfilled. In a rage, he stomped into the studio and demanded to see the artist.

Quickly the artist brought out paper, paint, and brush. In five minutes a perfect picture of a rooster emerged from his skillful brush. The king turned purple with anger, saying, "If you can paint a perfect picture of a rooster in five minutes, why did you keep me waiting for over a year?"

"Come with me," begged the artist. He led the king to his storage room. Paper was piled from the floor to the ceiling. On every sheet was a painting of a rooster.

"Your Majesty," explained the artist, "it took me more than one year to learn how to paint a perfect rooster in five minutes."

I loved that story so much that when I found a Chinese watercolor of a rooster in a junk shop I bought it. I have since been told that it is worth a good deal of money, but I shall keep it, as it reminds me to learn!

[Tim Gillett]

... They do work very well on voice...

But C451/CK1s on anything musical often sounded bright and 'fierce' to me...

Why would that be?

[Hugh Robjohns]

Absolutely no idea....

[James Perrett]

But C451/CK1s on anything musical often sounded bright and 'fierce' to me...

Which is often what is expected on rock hi hats and cymbals and probably explains why they're so popular. Certainly I've been happy with them for that application, although they sort out the men from the boys when it comes to mic preamps as they have a pretty high output.

[Tim Gillett]

Absolutely no idea....

I guess the "magic mics" phenomenon strikes again.

[RichardT]

. When I see amateurs (or semi-pros BS'ing it) faffing about for over an hour, I think of an old Chinese fable

I was doing a music course and the tutor was a highly trained classical pianist. During the course, he played piano pieces by sight that the students had written. Although I play piano to about grade 8 standard myself, I was just blown away by the control, intensity and power he brought to playing these pieces with absolutely no preparation. A world above us amateur pianists. Another example of the rooster principle.

[Tim Gillett]

When I see amateurs (or semi-pros BS'ing it) faffing about for over an hour, I think of an old Chinese fable -

Yes and the 5 minutes compared to the hour might be explained by one having no solid grasp of what they are doing and so have nothing at their disposal except trial and error. Whereas the skilled person already understands the characteristics of the mics and the drum kit, what will work and what wont.

I sometimes work with people who are paid to record or amplify sound. In some cases it's the same people over many years. It's sad to see people having "plateaued out", continuing to make the same mistakes as they did years ago, such as not knowing how to point the back end of a cardioid mic towards a monitor to avoid feedback. From where I am, it's such a basic skill. Many are lovely people, fine musicians often, who have to work the audio gear themselves because they cant afford to pay professionals to do it, which may be the unfortunate reality, but as Sam says, it can also be false economy.

[MOF]

such as not knowing how to point the back end of a cardioid mic towards a monitor to avoid feedback

Where are they putting them? The only place usually available on stage is behind the mic, or at 45 degrees to that for hypercardioid.
As I don’t go to gigs, a quick question, don’t they all use iem systems nowadays, much easier to get an uncoloured mic’ sound (apart from the PA spill) and more freedom of movement for the band on stage?

[James Perrett]

As I don’t go to gigs, a quick question, don’t they all use iem systems nowadays, much easier to get an uncoloured mic’ sound (apart from the PA spill) and more freedom of movement for the band on stage?

All the gigs I've been to over the last year have used old fashioned monitors. IEM's are great if you will be always using the same PA but if you are touring around small venues using the house PA's then IEM's don't seem to be popular.

[Tim Gillett]

Also it seems to work best when all band members use iems, and all monitors can be done away with.

[awjoe]

"I see where you're going with this. You won't catch me out that easily."

Actually, I didn't see exactly where he was going with it, and I appreciated how he got there when he did. Nice.

[The Red Bladder]

It's sad to see people having "plateaued out", continuing to make the same mistakes as they did years ago,

The 'student' needs guidance. Another story -

Many, many, many years ago when dinosaurs roamed the Earth and I had hair, a friend and I decided to design and build a mixing desk. "How hard can it be?" he said, little realising just how hard it was going to be!

Long story short - we cribbed big chunks of design from the old black Soundscraft 'Series II' desk that was in the studio and made various improvements (or so we thought) on that design. Our desk was not as good. The phase compensation on the EQ drifted more and the impulse response on the mic-pres was not as good. It was however OK and we sold it for a modest profit and came to the stunning realisation that there must be more to designing a desk than we thought.

We spent several months building that thing and, driven by more urgent pecuniary needs, went back to repairing home organs and PA rigs.

About 30 years later I was chatting to Graham Langley of Amek fame and mentioned our failed attempt all those years ago - and in a few short sentences, he explained where we went wrong! It was so obvious and so clear - but it involved a knowledge of capacitors and how they behave (amongst other things!) that we just did not have back in the late 70s. A few words of instruction from a guru would have set us straight!

[The Elf]

All the gigs I've been to over the last year have used old fashioned monitors. IEM's are great if you will be always using the same PA but if you are touring around small venues using the house PA's then IEM's don't seem to be popular.

I can only speak for myself, but the fact I never know what the PA will be like is the very reason I take my own IEMs with me everywhere!