The All-New Behringer Keyboards 'n' Stuff Thread

[ajay_m]

The discussion I believe was over a cable tester Behringer made that could only be described as uncannily similar to another manufacturer's product, to say the least (and we've seen some recent form on this haven't we, Arturia not entirely impressed right now).

As such the comments seemed reasonable and indeed the case was thrown out, so, no, I'm afraid I don't agree. Have a look on the internet and you can find the details. Very interesting reading.

[Eddy Deegan]

The discussion I believe was over a cable tester Behringer made that could only be described as uncannily similar to another manufacturer's product

The Ebtech Swizz Army:



The Behringer CT100:



Shocking isn't it?

[John Stafford]

Behringer trying to silence Gearslutz posters using the courts was the last straw for me. I'm not interested in anything they make. There are plenty of alternatives that I want more anyway, so it's an easy decision for me. Except for the VC340...

[Hugh Robjohns]

There's always an ...except...

[ManFromGlass]

yup that’s the problem.
In my perfect world there would be a law that says the bigger your company, the more accountable you are to the planet and your fellow humans. Plus legally your asshat factor must decrease proportionally to the number of zeros on your year end balance.
Total fantasy.

[Eddy Deegan]

I see it more as a "personal threshold" thing.

If Behringer is a company you don't want to buy stuff from (and at present that's how I feel about them) then you'll avoid their products up to the point that your desire for one exceeds your distaste for the company.

In my case I disapprove of their activities more than I want a 2600 clone, so I've skipped that (and may well end up getting one of the new Korg ones if I'm so inclined later; I really like the look of them).

If they were to bring out a spanking good Jupiter 8 or CS-80 clone in the near future then I would almost certainly buy it despite my current distaste for them because my desire for one exceeds that disapproval. That said, I could also see myself skipping it and getting a Kurzweil K2700 as a consolation prize instead and perhaps coming back to the Behringer clone at a later date once they've improved their behaviour.

However even if I did buy the DS-80 my threshold would remain, so I'd continue to avoid them for other things. The net effect is still a vote with the wallet. I bought a little Mackie mixer for use with my Eurorack + Moog stack yesterday. I wasn't specifically after a Mackie but when I searched my vendor of choice for small mixers between £50 and £150 I filtered out all the Behringer results and picked the most suitable from the remaining offerings. I was particularly happy as Hugh gave it a good review a little while back

Had none of this happened I may well have ended up with a Behringer one but the list of things I haven't-bought-but-would-have (Neutron, Poly D, 2600, small mixer) from Behringer is growing and is probably only another entry away from £2k, which has gone to Arturia, Novation, ASM and Mackie instead. I'm not doing it to make a difference to Behringer, but to make a difference to me ... and it does.

My hope is that Behringer will demonstrate better ethics going forward such that the threshold can naturally reduce over time. I don't enjoy disliking them.

[muzines]

My hope is that Behringer will demonstrate better ethics going forward such that the threshold can naturally reduce over time. I don't enjoy disliking them.

Magic 8 Ball says something about leopards and spots...

[Eddy Deegan]

My hope is that Behringer will demonstrate better ethics going forward such that the threshold can naturally reduce over time. I don't enjoy disliking them.

Magic 8 Ball says something about leopards and spots...

I am an eternal optimist. Things don't stay the same forever so maybe ...

[muzines]

I am an eternal optimist. Things don't stay the same forever so maybe ...

True. Uli's not going to run the company forever. Maybe in 20 years he'll step down and someone else will step in and change the organisational values. Or maybe he'll sell out before that.

So there's always hope.

[Arpangel]

OK, so you’ve spent years developing something, it’s selling OK, at a fair price, it’s recognised as being a good product and is unique to you.
Then someone comes along, reverse engineers it, cuts a few corners, maybe has better contacts in Chinese factories, and makes the same thing for half the price



But this seems quite a normal practice in white goods, consumer stuff, TV's etc, and no one questions it.
Maybe that’s because that’s easier to get away with, with stuff that isn’t so easily recognisable, and many times it’s the factories themselves who are just re-badging their customers designs without telling them. Difficult to get away with that in the synth reissue market.

[nathanscribe]

But this seems quite a normal practice in white goods, consumer stuff, TV's etc, and no one questions it.

Not so much OEM going on in the synth market though. There has been, and still is, with guitar pedals. But synths? I can't really think of any. Maybe in the small mixer market etc? Genuinely not sure how far the OEM route goes with music gear.

The VC340 was mentioned earlier, I think that's a good example of something that only Behringer did the closest thing to a proper job of – not counting Roland's boutique, it's a different animal. Weird how we've got a plethora of 2600s now though.

[Arpangel]

[Weird how we've got a plethora of 2600s now though.

It is, I suppose you could say it’s a milestone because it’s such an iconic synth, and before the reissues it was still very expensive.
Like me, also, I think a lot of people love them for all sorts of reasons, not just sound, it sells on so many points, and it’s a supposedly good bet for anyone having a go at a reissue, and, I think they really have dented the original market, I think prices have fallen quite a bit by the looks of things, and people aren’t so fussy anymore, these machines aren’t getting any younger, and as time goes on, they become money pits.

[ManFromGlass]

So shopping for a 2600 is starting to look like shopping for a tv due to all the offerings -
1) do the research including bad reviews that look like the reviewer knew what they are talking about
2) look for reviews about which companies units need service sooner than others
3) check for warranties
Buy from Amazon or buy a Chinese clone of the clone on Amazon. (Tongue in cheek for this last sentence) Actually looking forward to a good chuckle when cheaper clones of all Behringer gear starts appearing. But then that might push the price of the original clones into the stratosphere. Hmmmmm

[nathanscribe]

So shopping for a 2600 is starting to look like shopping for a tv due to all the offerings -
1) do the research including bad reviews that look like the reviewer knew what they are talking about
2) look for reviews about which companies units need service sooner than others
3) check for warranties

Of course what you really want is an early '70s black & white TV with a wooden case and big chonky buttons. Really warms up your 4k Blu-rays.

*hides*

[Folderol]

So shopping for a 2600 is starting to look like shopping for a tv due to all the offerings -
1) do the research including bad reviews that look like the reviewer knew what they are talking about
2) look for reviews about which companies units need service sooner than others
3) check for warranties

Of course what you really want is an early '70s black & white TV with a wooden case and big chonky buttons. Really warms up your 4k Blu-rays.

*hides*

Oh! A modern one then. Not like the real thing at all - the ones that had plug-in coils for the different BBC (only) channels, and an internal back projection screen only visible in low ambient light

Like this:
http://www.thevalvepage.com/tv/philips/ ... il1800.htm

... and that is the exact model I was extremely proud to have been able to restore to working order.

Ahhh, memories

[ajay_m]

There is a DS80 though. Just not made by Behringer but Medeli via ASM ie the Hydrasynth. So maybe Uli left it a bit late on that one....

[Drew Stephenson]

Actually looking forward to a good chuckle when cheaper clones of all Behringer gear starts appearing.

Do you not have Wish in Canada?

[Martin Walker]

Actually looking forward to a good chuckle when cheaper clones of all Behringer gear starts appearing.

Do you not have Wish in Canada?

No Drew, you're probably thinking of Rush

Martin

[resistorman]

Clones, reissues and resulting controversy seem more related to sports and religion than making music to me.

[Arpangel]

Clones, reissues and resulting controversy seem more related to sports and religion than making music to me.

Maybe Uli is the "Second Coming"

[Drew Stephenson]

Clones, reissues and resulting controversy seem more related to sports and religion than making music to me.

Maybe Uli is the "Second Coming"

Don't give him ideas, I get the feeling that his is not an ego that needs feeding!

[ManFromGlass]

He’s more in third or fourth place in my mind.

[tea for two]

If a company has world class engineers then this company undermines the ability talent of these world class engineers producing knock offs :
in effect saying to these world class engineers you are not good enough to produce your own products.

Whereas these world class engineers should be trusted to produce their own products.

[DGL.]

A progress update on the Prophet 600 clone, first prototype is under test and it seems to be sounding good. As has been mentioned they are working with Gligli so it should be good.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_bwUEmXFErY

[DGL.]

An update finally on FB, 100 units have been produced that are going off to beta testers who have an original OB-Xa to compare with and once all the beta testing has been done and the Xa is fully ready production will commence.
Oh and by looking at the picture not only is it now called the Ob-Xa it sports the old Oberheim logo!

And I would guess the image attached to the FB post is the final revision, although that is not made clear,