Folderol wrote:This may be a really really silly question, but can't you just wind the volume down to zero?
Well there are ways around it, of course, though turning it down isn't one of them - it may be playing a part! The simplest way is to go switch off Local each time I power up!
But it's just annoying that it doesn't stay off when I switch it off - even when I save the system settings.
I find it just a bit more concerning when manufacturers go radio silent.
I’m sorry you haven’t got this sorted Elf, I’ve been in similar situations where forum posts have had a lot of attention about my particular problem, and in those cases I’m left wondering why on earth these posts have escaped a manufactures attention?
After all, they should be alert to these things, and at least reassure those concerned to stop any potentially bad vibes.
Last edited by Arpangel on Sun Jan 24, 2021 8:23 am, edited 1 time in total.
The Elf wrote:Well it's the only problem I have with it, and it's fairly minor in the scheme of things. No bugs found here. I'm very happy with it!
I’m guessing you don’t use the MPE side of things then
I use my Roli for MPE. I've used the Hydra's poly AT with a few different poly AT-receiver synths with no problem. What problems are you referring to that I can try to recreate?
Last edited by The Elf on Tue Jan 26, 2021 9:04 pm, edited 2 times in total.
Just did a bit of Googling on this out of curiosity and came across a video which demonstrates some illogical choices in the implementation of mono patches when played by an MPE controller. (A Linnstrument here.)
You could say that some of these are minor, or that it's a choice rather than a bug (eg playing and releasing a duplicate note cancels the note), but these kinds of quirks can be quite annoying in performance (and some of them are clearly wrong).
Last edited by BJG145 on Wed Jan 27, 2021 8:59 pm, edited 7 times in total.
At least one of those 'bugs' looks like what happens when you single-channelise poly AT (the bend leaving a note at the wrong pitch).
I've just tried running my Roli into my Hydrasynth in MPE mode and it's working fine for me. I can't do the 'repeating same note' test, as my Roli doesn't support that, but I'm not getting any of those other problems. Bending pitch with two notes held on a mono patch doesn't de-tune the first note held, slide bending works as expected, mono note chain releases return to the correct note...
All seems fine to me!
Last edited by The Elf on Wed Jan 27, 2021 10:30 pm, edited 2 times in total.
The Elf wrote:Well it's the only problem I have with it, and it's fairly minor in the scheme of things. No bugs found here. I'm very happy with it!
I’m guessing you don’t use the MPE side of things then
I use my Roli for MPE. I've used the Hydra's poly AT with a few different poly AT-receiver synths with no problem. What problems are you referring to that I can try to recreate?
The Elf wrote:At least one of those 'bugs' looks like what happens when you single-channelise poly AT (the bend leaving a note at the wrong pitch).
I've just tried running my Roli into my Hydrasynth in MPE mode and it's working fine for me. I can't do the 'repeating same note' test, as my Roli doesn't support that, but I'm not getting any of those other problems. Bending pitch with two notes held on a mono patch doesn't de-tune the first note held, slide bending works as expected, mono note chain releases return to the correct note...
All seems fine to me!
Sorry after posting the previous link I read your post.
So I just tried with my Roli the same problems are there, so it would be really good for me to find out how yours is working.
Can you init a patch on the hydrasynth, then go to voice and select mono.
Now with the roli in mpe mode slide two notes, on yours only the last played is effecting the pitchbend not both of them?
I just did some further testing with the Roli and can replicate all bugs, including the playing the same note twice which the Roli does support.
The first note changing when the second note is slid and then release is slightly hidden by the fact that the Roli do not do the "intelligent" quantising the Linnstrument does and is firing of PB messages for the original note unless you hold your finger very still. This makes the two notes PB values fighting each other bug much more noticeable though.
I would be very interested why you do not see these bugs, I have a Desktop do you have the keyboard?
Maybe I could set up a midi file latter that shows the bugs and you could fire it off to your HS to double check if you have some time?
[ACCOUNT DELETED] wrote:Can you init a patch on the hydrasynth, then go to voice and select mono.
Now with the roli in mpe mode slide two notes, on yours only the last played is effecting the pitchbend not both of them?
I play two notes (only one sounds, obviously). Whichever I bend, when I let go the pitch returns to the correct pitch of the still-held note. That seems as it should be to me.
If you mean that pitchbending both held notes starts a fight between them - yes, but it's in mono, so I would expect that too - you're sending two lots of bend data for a monosynth. Again, I'm fine with this.
I have the Hydrasynth keyboard.
Last edited by The Elf on Mon Feb 01, 2021 12:09 pm, edited 1 time in total.
[ACCOUNT DELETED] wrote:Thanks, can you hold two notes and bend both please, do the PBs fight against each other?
Yes, and I would I expect that. I'm playing a monosynth and sending it two lots of pitchbend data. It's like using channel aftertouch and pressing two notes at the same time - the same thing happens.
Ah if you expect that to happen then I see why you don't see it as a bug
For some of us though with MPE the PB and other CCs are linked to a channel, one channels data should not effect another channels data which is what is happening in mono mode on the HS.
For a correct implementation you could try something like Pigments which is spot on, or a continuum/eaganmatrix , or the Mordor NF1, etc etc.
Hi, all I’m trying to say is other MPE synths do not work in this way with mono patches, the modulation amounts are attached to a note which is attached to a channel.
If you pass your Roli midi through the software linked above and then to the HS it fixes this issue.
Although ASM haven’t got back to me about this issue I have this from someone else:
Hi Andy,
So, I had someone's attention at ASM recently, and took the opportunity to mention the above bugs. A brief conversation ensued, and I forwarded a copy of your video to them. They got back to me within the hour, acknowledged the problem directly, and said that they were "working on it". Colour me hopeful...
[ACCOUNT DELETED] wrote:Hi, all I’m trying to say is other MPE synths do not work in this way with mono patches, the modulation amounts are attached to a note which is attached to a channel.]
But you're reducing the synth to a single channel, so I don't get what's supposed to happen?!
I'll try it with something like Equator and see what the difference is...
It is using the HS and switching between the fix (via the software linked above) and the normal working to try to explain, I'm not sure if it does that well
Last edited by Guest on Mon Feb 01, 2021 3:02 pm, edited 1 time in total.
A mono MPE synth it is not a single channel, it is multiple channels.
So the "mono" part is the number of voices that are allowed to sound at a time, not the total number of notes that are held and being tracked on all the channels.
Just like a normal mono synth remembers the notes you play and hold even though only one is sounding, an MPE version should do the same the only difference is that any modulation changes should only effect the note/channel they are attached to. If it is the currently sounding note you hear the change, if it is a silent note the modulation values should be saved for when that note plays again.
The issue with the HS is that it is merging the modulation values in mono mode so that modulation values for the sounding note are effecting the held notes and modulation values for the held notes are effecting the sounding note.
Yeah its one of those things, if you don't use it or play it this way it wouldn't bother you.
I play a lot using this sliding with mono patches on the Linnstrument, probably because its the sort of thing I do on guitar using tapping/hammer ons/pull offs with sliding.
Uhe Diva has a good mode where each channel acts like an individual mono synth, the linnstrument also supports a channel per row mode, so you get the idea of playing 8 mono synths one for each row of the Linnstrument, each supporting this tapping/hammer ons/pull offs idea, very neat.
The good thing about this thread anyway is now my HS is reconnected and I am re-discovering how good it is
I'm pleased you posted this - I was looking to purchase one of these, but bad communications between the company and the customer are one of my absolute hates.
I will give them a wide-berth.
Compare that with UDO - send their support team an email and they reply the same day with an actual useful email that answers your question.
Matt D wrote:I'm pleased you posted this - I was looking to purchase one of these, but bad communications between the company and the customer are one of my absolute hates.
I will give them a wide-berth.
Compare that with UDO - send their support team an email and they reply the same day with an actual useful email that answers your question.
If you want MPE in a hardware synth, I don't know of any others. It really is a great synth regardless. I've not had problems with mine, and since I bought it from Sweetwater I get 2 years of tech support if I should need it. I hope the company stays in biz...
^^^ Pretty much sums up my feelings too. I may complain about lack of contact, but it wouldn't stop me buying this synth again. It's too good to pass up.
I raised a bug with them a while back that sending a note on event from another keyboard to the HS and holding that note down, then pressing and releasing the same note on the HS stops both notes. I suspect this is the cause of some of the issues where the firmware isn't handling multiple overlapping midi events correctly. Ken Flux Pierce on the FB forum seems to be pretty close to the team and I believe they are looking into these issues so let's see.
