ZEDi-6 vs MG06

[flozzi001]

Hello Guys!

I hope someone of you can share your experiences and help me.

I´m searching for a small mixer as a use of a monitoring mixer directly from the artist.
I narrowed my decision down to the Yamaha MG06 and the Allen Heath ZEDi-6FX.
Both of them have their drawbacks. However, I would prefer the A&H.

Now to my question it is essential that the mixer can drive a 250ohm DT770.
From my experience i know that the Yamaha mixers can manage it easily, but I read that the A&H ZEDi-6 has problems with high impedance HP.

Does anyone have experience with a A&H ZEDi-6 and high impedance HP?

I would be very happy if someone could help me.
Thanks a lot.

[James Perrett]

I'd be surprised if the A&H had problems with high impedance headphones - they've been building decent mixers for many years and I've never had any problems with my older A&H Saber when driving high impedance headphones.

[shufflebeat]

Is there a ZEDi-6?

My experience of A&H would suggest they give proper attention to the driving of headphones.

I'm a bit intrigued by your mention of a "monitoring mixer". Can you elaborate on your intended use?

[flozzi001]

Thank you for your nice Answers.
Yeah well I know A&H is not a known to be a cheapo company.
However, I have a Focusrite interface, which of course doesn’t provide the quality of a RME or UAD interface.
This AI rates their HP Amp for use with up to 300Ohm Headphones. So I was thinking it is not an infamous company therefore the specs will be some kind of correct.
As it turns out it is not even near able to drive a 250Ohm HP. Not in a recording situation, not even in a playback situation.
In comparison the HP Amp in my Yamaha MG10 drives my Dt770 with ease. Never I need more than ¼ of the level knob and no distortion, therefore also I have lots of Headroom if I have to check on quiet signals.
From the A&H ZEDi Series I read in some press statement that the HP output is a little weak…
In others I read it have plenty of HP level, I guess it always depends on what you are expecting.
Plenty of level with low impedance HP, is quite different than plenty of Level with high impedance HP.

I am not sure if you can compare a real analogue console *feeling jealous* with a tine tiny budget mixer.

I am Sorry, yes of course there is no A&H ZEDi-06, I meant A&H ZED-6.
To be honest I don’t know if “monitoring mixer” is the correct terminology.
English is not my mother tongue, I hope I didn’t create to much confusion.
The main use of the mixer will be, that the artist can control their own HP mix.

[Mike Stranks]

I've owned both in my time and still use the A&H occasionally.

I don't recall ever having a problem with any sort of headphones. They're both good little mixers... that said, my preference is for the A&H because of it's PFL facilities.

[Drew Stephenson]

However, I have a Focusrite interface, which of course doesn’t provide the quality of a RME or UAD interface.
This AI rates their HP Amp for use with up to 300Ohm Headphones. So I was thinking it is not an infamous company therefore the specs will be some kind of correct.
As it turns out it is not even near able to drive a 250Ohm HP. Not in a recording situation, not even in a playback situation.

Interesting. My focusrite will happily drive my DT770s (250Ohm). For listening to pre-recorded music they're never more than '9 o'clock' on the dial and even when doing overdubs on work in progress they never get past 12 o'clock.

[flozzi001]

Yes you are right Mike, I also think if you compare those two mixers the ZED-6 is much more capable.
Working without PFL is possible on small Mixers but definitely a pain. Also having real Pan control and High Low shelf for all channels is a big plus over the Yamaha.
Overall, despite my intended use of the mixer I think it can be a big live saver if something goes wrong. Run out of mic pres, no problem, run out of DIs (because the keyboard player thinks he needs at least 4 keyboards at the same time) no problem. I know it is definitely not the way to go, but if everything else fails it can save the session.
There is one thing though which I don’t understand and kind of excludes lots of use cases.
Why the hell did they put the HP level after the Master Fader?
With their bigger consoles it is switchable pre or post master, but it seems to be a weird design choice, if you have to choose one, that you would go with post Master.
However with this one flaw I´m happy to live with, compared to Yamahas five issues…

Really? What kind of Focusrite interface do you have?
I have the Scarlett series, to be exact the Scarlett 18i6 3rd Gen.
Maybe with their Clarett Serie they didn’t cheap out on the HP Amp?
I can get the desired level out of it at around 3 o clock but than it is just distorting like crazy.
everything sounds like an E-Guitar
No issues though with low impedance HPs.

[Drew Stephenson]

Really? What kind of Focusrite interface do you have?
I have the Scarlett series, to be exact the Scarlett 18i6 3rd Gen.
Maybe with their Clarett Serie they didn’t cheap out on the HP Amp?
I can get the desired level out of it at around 3 o clock but than it is just distorting like crazy.
everything sounds like an E-Guitar
No issues though with low impedance HPs.

Scarlett 8i6 1st gen. Don't think there's anything special about the headphone amp but if I was listening to it at 3 o'clock my ears would be bleeding.

[Jorge]

I pulled my broken ZEDi-8 out of the box in the basement and hooked it up to test the HP amp. The ZEDi-8 is the same as a ZED-6 with USB I/O added. I used a Sennheiser HD600, which has a nominal impedance of 300 ohms and is a bit harder to drive than my other headphones. The ZEDi-8 was capable of driving the HD600s WAY louder than I would consider safe for even short term listening. Sound quality did not change up to the point where I had to pull them off my ears because it was scary loud. So I don't think a weak HP amp will be a problem with the ZED-6.
The two problems that keep me from using the mixer are 1) the R main out is intermittent and goes completely dead fairly often. It usually comes back with a good smack to the mixer, but that is not what I want to be doing at a gig. Unfortunately it is out of warranty. 2) Similar to another forum member comment a few years ago, I also hear a very noticeable noise on the unbalanced TS line-in channels 1 and 2 with a mono signal on a TS plug, with the instrument/line button depressed. Short cable, no change with moving the cable. I tried 2 sources, a laptop with Dragonfly DAC and a Bluetooth receiver, both with unbalanced stereo outs on a 3.5mm plug. A balanced signal into Channel 1 or 2 produces a hum, probably ground loop. The noise is not there with mics plugged into the XLR inputs. I can sometimes hear the noise over the music signal, and it is not there in either of the Stereo line in channels 3/4 or 5/6. Sound quality is fine otherwise. I really liked the mixer before the main out became unreliable. So if you buy it, make sure the warranty is valid, you might need it.

[flozzi001]

Wow Jorge, thank you so so much.
You are the best.
Really thank you a lot that you tested it for me and gave me this great advice. I really appreciate it a lot. Thank you so much.

Also thank you blinddrew, your answer got me thinking about my Focusrite and I tested it again.
Okay to be honest it is not completely bad. I also can’t reproduce the distortion Problem, don’t ask me form where it came. In the past I could reproduce the distortion on 2 separate days.
I apologies for the miss information.
I guess it was an issue with my DAW. Cause I now opened the same mix and checked again. Some small tweaks and my DAW was happy to add +14 db of Master gain out of nowhere and of course not showing it either.
Samplitude gets worse with every update, topic for another thread...
It is definitely not like an E-Guitar neither became the cleanest HP amp I heard. At least not at max level.

About the level I would say I miss around 6db to my previous interface.

Case 1: Recording situation, direct monitoring
Peak: -10dbfs
RMS: -30 to -35
Fousrite HP maxed out (5 o´clock) -> playback level. To quiet for recording.
Yamaha MG 10 no issues.

Case 2: Final Mix:
Peak -1dbfs
RMS -15 to -10
Focusrite around 12 o´clock for Playback/mixing. 3 o´clock more than someone could ever wish for.
Yamaha between 9 and 10 o´clock for mixing.

So you are right the Focusrite have decent enough HP outputs, just not that much Headroom.

[Jorge]

It only took a few minutes to test the ZEDi-8 and gave me a chance to check it out again. Good thing I did, it turns out I hadn't done a thorough troubleshooting when it started messing up. Today I opened up the case to see if I could find some bad capacitor or loose connection. First, the build quality looks excellent and very nicely laid out inside, separate board for each channel strip. No bad looking capacitors, the wiring harness from each channel strip was on tight, but I pulled it off, put a drop of Stabilant-22 on each pin and re-seated. The XLRM main out sockets solder joints were all beautifully shiny, lean and solid, I couldn't find an obvious visible problem without getting technical. Closed it back up, put some Stabilant-22 on all the output pins and reconnected all the inputs. The noise on the Channel 1&2 lines-in was gone, it could have been a source noise or bad connection to the harness, I can't tell. The R main out is working fine for now, it could have been a bad XLR connection. Then I re-tested the USB input. Compared with the Dragonfly (red) DAC, the ZEDi-8 USB input sounded indistinguishable at least with YouTube source. In addition, I didn't know that you can use the USB stereo channel strip simultaneously with the 2 stereo channel strips and the 2 mic channels, unlike the Zed-10FX which uses one of the analog stereo channels for the USB.
So I want to tentatively retract the criticisms I had in my previous post, since it looks like I have found and fixed both problems. Now I can say the ZEDi-8 is the best of the tiny all-analog mixers that I have had, including the Zed10FX, Soundcraft Notepad, Mackie 402, 802 and 1202. I haven't tried the Yamaha MG06 to compare. I also haven't tested the USB ADC into the computer, just the playback direction.