A cheap 34mm capsule in a t.bone SC450

[forumuser915213]

I happened to have a t.bone SC450 that was unused because it had developed the whooshing noise condenser mics get when they have been affected by damp.

On the verge of throwing it away recently, I had the idea of finding a capsule on eBay and fitting it. For about £15 I bought a 34mm large diaphragm condenser capsule on eBay from a seller called Eveningstore2015.

I'm what you might call a reluctant mic modder and didn't expect my experiment to go well, not least because I get my soldering iron out about once a decade.

This video shows the results recorded in an untreated room, facing away from a corner padded with a duvet. The sound sources include maile reading, baritone voice, jumbo acoustic guitar and femail soprano.

I'm pleasantly surprised. It might even be my new favourite LDC mic, though I've thought such things before and learned better over time. There is no eq here.

https://youtu.be/0gQHhnqFwHM

[Guest]

But did the woshing noise go away when it had dried out?

[Eddy Deegan]

I happened to have a t.bone SC450 that was unused because it had developed the whooshing noise condenser mics get when they have been affected by damp.

On the verge of throwing it away recently, I had the idea of finding a capsule on eBay and fitting it. For about £15 I bought a 34mm large diaphragm condenser capsule on eBay from a seller called Eveningstore2015.

I'm what you might call a reluctant mic modder and didn't expect my experiment to go well, not least because I get my soldering iron out about once a decade.

This video shows the results recorded in an untreated room, facing away from a corner padded with a duvet. The sound sources include maile reading, baritone voice, jumbo acoustic guitar and femail soprano.

I'm pleasantly surprised. It might even be my new favourite LDC mic, though I've thought such things before and learned better over time. There is no eq here.

https://youtu.be/0gQHhnqFwHM

I'm not a mic expert, as many on this forum are, but other than the female vocal sounding more like an alto part to me (just a pedantic observation, nothing to do with the mic), I reckon it sounded fine, and if it was unusable before buying a replacement diaphragm then I'd say that was money well spent, even though I have no idea how the original diaphragm would have sounded

[Eddy Deegan]

But did the woshing noise go away when it had dried out?

I've been on a fence here for a while but at the risk of coming across like a judgmental git, really, I think this is a borderline troll response. The OP was clear that the diaphragm was a replacement.

[Guest]

Trying not to engage the troll hear but.
I remember the Danish online music shop company selling a couple starter kits with 3 t bone mics included, as if why would as it suggests someone starting out need 3 t bone microphones???

[zenguitar]

Trying not to engage the troll hear but.
I remember the Danish online music shop company selling a couple starter kits with 3 t bone mics included, as if why would as it suggests someone starting out need 3 t bone microphones???

It was clear from the original post in the Topic that the diaphragm had been replaced, and a link was provided do demonstrate that that had solved the problem. Instead of following that link and listening for yourself, you felt the need to ask an unnecessary question.

When you were, rightly, called out on that troll like behaviour, you ended up making the post I have quoted above which has no bearing whatsoever on the subject and makes an utterly unfounded allegation of trolling against a long standing forum member who has built an excellent reputation here because of his long track record of proven, positive, contributions.

Enjoy your week long ban from the SOS forums. And when you are allowed to return, please bear in mind that further troll like behaviour can result in longer, or permanent, bans.

Andy

[Mike Stranks]

Hmmm... looks like I was wrong...

I'd recently come to the view that this was a person who didn't have a clue what he was about and maybe had 'issues' that accounted for some of his behaviour. It's now clear that I was wrong and he's led some of us a merry dance and wasted hours of our time trying to help him.

Without divulging everything that's been established he's gone to enormous trouble to lay a false trail to lure-in suckers - me.

Only a week Andy?

And sorry to the O/P for hijacking his thread. Good for you if your mic-mod's proved successful.

[forumuser915213]

My wife pitched her verse a bit lower than usual and slightly regretted it

It happens that I also have a standard un-modified SC450, which is what enabled me to make the comparison shown in the video. That may not have been as obvious as I imagined and I should spell it out in the description.

Cheers Mike! I thought my story might be interesting to a few folks who like me own one or two of these things.

For myself, I'm tempted to repeat the process, on my other SC450. But I intend to see how I go with this one for a little while first...

Gavin

[Drew Stephenson]

Just listening on a cheapish pair of headphones and i thought i detected a bit more low end weight on the new one. But to me the most obvious difference was that with the original capsule i'd have been reaching for a deesser, whereas i didn't feel the need with new one.
Anything that results in a recording requiring less processing is a good thing in my book.

[forumuser915213]

I'm also interested in what other folks think because as an older geezer and long time musician, I'm aware that my hearing is in a somewhat used state. I know that at 63 I don't hear anything above 12kHz.

Gavin

[Drew Stephenson]

I'm still good to about 14.5kHz but we'll need better ears than mine for anything above that.

[Hugh Robjohns]

Only a week Andy?

Music Master reacted to his week's ban by attempting to re-register under a different name and trying to post a highly offensive and threatening post. That's why we have a moderation queue...

Needless to say, both of his accounts have now been permanently removed, but all his log-in details and posting history -- including the final threatening post -- have been archived in case further action becomes necessary.

H

[ConcertinaChap]

Just had a listen, Gavin and I agree with Drew's summary - richer low end and less essy. Have to say I think the "new" mic suits Julie's voice well. For codgers like me who own a soldering iron but try to avoid using it that's a bit of an inspirational story

CC

[forumuser915213]

Just had a listen, Gavin and I agree with Drew's summary - richer low end and less essy. Have to say I think the "new" mic suits Julie's voice well. For codgers like me who own a soldering iron but try to avoid using it that's a bit of an inspirational story

CC

Well that's all good then!

I've just noticed the guitar samples are mislabelled. They're in the right order, but it's actually the 34mm capsule sample you get first.

I think on guitar it sounds somehow more precise and less smeary, but that might be because there's just less of it.

Another experiment I've tried recently was an attempt to reduce resonances in the shells of a pair of old Oktava MK219s using wodges of Blutack taped to the outside and large foam windscreens placed over the top to prevent the grills from ringing (they ping if you pluck them).

I can't easily give before and after recorded samples because I've treated both of them this way. (And a third I also own never did sound as good so I didn't bother.)

Gavin

[forumuser915213]

Just listening on a cheapish pair of headphones and i thought i detected a bit more low end weight on the new one. But to me the most obvious difference was that with the original capsule i'd have been reaching for a deesser, whereas i didn't feel the need with new one.
Anything that results in a recording requiring less processing is a good thing in my book.

Agreed on all counts. Though I haven't got a de-esser!

Gavin

[Jumpeyspyder]

Well listening here using my 'middle aged' ears, budget monitors, with no acoustic treatment (Don't tell Hugh or Martin )

Your modification sounds better than the original, less congested and more 'open'

Glad it worked out

[TNGator]

I happened to have a t.bone SC450 that was unused because it had developed the whooshing noise condenser mics get when they have been affected by damp.

On the verge of throwing it away recently, I had the idea of finding a capsule on eBay and fitting it. For about £15 I bought a 34mm large diaphragm condenser capsule on eBay from a seller called Eveningstore2015.

I'm what you might call a reluctant mic modder and didn't expect my experiment to go well, not least because I get my soldering iron out about once a decade.

This video shows the results recorded in an untreated room, facing away from a corner padded with a duvet. The sound sources include maile reading, baritone voice, jumbo acoustic guitar and femail soprano.

I'm pleasantly surprised. It might even be my new favourite LDC mic, though I've thought such things before and learned better over time. There is no eq here.

https://youtu.be/0gQHhnqFwHM

I'm not a mic expert, as many on this forum are, but other than the female vocal sounding more like an alto part to me (just a pedantic observation, nothing to do with the mic), I reckon it sounded fine, and if it was unusable before buying a replacement diaphragm then I'd say that was money well spent, even though I have no idea how the original diaphragm would have sounded

Hi Eddy. If you're no expert than I dont know what I would be called because I would say my knowledge is easily below everyone elses here To be honest...I really didnt hear any darn difference in those recordings. Im glad that guy got his mic working and that the replacement worked. OK.. novice here will now go hide in the corner.

[forumuser915213]

Whether I can hear a clear difference seems to depend on what you're listening through.

Even with my hearing (discussed above), I can hear a clear difference when using my inexpensive Samson headphones (but not an inexpensive closed back pair of Audio Technica cans).

Friends and I heard it clearly on Sunday using the very cheap Behringer Truth monitors we have hooked up to our telly when played using our TV's YouTube app.

When cast using a phone app, it's less obvious. We've noticed that casting Youtubes produces poorer sound quality.

This is of course all very low end, and I feel as if I'm frolicing about in mud...

One thing I'm pleased to be getting from this thread is that no-one appears to be reporting anything strange going on in the area in which I can't hear - ie, above 12khz.

Gavin

[forumuser915213]

I should explain that the differences we're hearing here are:

- Better controlled sibilants
- More 'air' - above 6-8khz, I'd guess
- 'Slightly lighter' low frequencies

Overall it seems more 'natural' at the same 8in mic to mouth distance, though that's /very/ subjective. But from what I understand, large diaphragm condenser mics are a very subjective topic.

Gavin

[forumuser915213]

I went ahead, as discussed, and fitted a second 35mm capsule into a working t.bone SC-450. I was pleased to find they sounded the same.

So I made this recording of my wife's singing accompanied by my guitar, if anyone's interested.

https://youtu.be/OgoXNuEMmUM

Gavin

[Drew Stephenson]

Got to be fairly happy with that.

[ConcertinaChap]

While I was listening to this Anne wandered over and said, "That sounds nice. Who is it?". Well sung and beautifully judged accompaniment. And the mics sound good.

CC

[forumuser915213]

Thanks folks!

I suppose, if you ever find yourself in posession of a SC450, you'll know what to do with it!

Gavin

[Andreaux]

Sorry for hijacking the thread with a semi-related question, but maybe the OP can help me out.
I have an SC-450 and it's behaving erratically. i switched from a Focusrite Saffire Pro 24 interface to a Focusrite Scarlet 18i20 today and my SC-450 stopped working. As soon as I'm a bit louder, it pops and the sound is gone and it becomes extremely quiet (almost no signal) and noisy. If I disconnect it and wait a while, then reconnect, it's ok again until the next loud noise, where it pops-out again.
I can't go back and test with the previous interface and other mics (like the Audio-Technica AT2020) work perfectly fine with the new interface even at high sound pressure.
I remember having issues with the SC-450 many years ago and set it aside for a while, then started using it again and everything was fine (I don't remember what the original issue was back then honestly)... until today.

Where could the fault be? The capsule? Some electronics in the mic related to power? If it's the capsule, I'd lean towards doing the same mod you did as it turned out pretty nicely!

EDIT: I installed the Saffire back and it does the same thing there too... This morning it was working fine Incredible.

[Hugh Robjohns]

Where could the fault be? The capsule? Some electronics in the mic related to power? If it's the capsule, I'd lean towards doing the same mod you did as it turned out pretty nicely!

Lots of potential things it could be, ranging from the capsule diaphragm shorting out on the backplate at excessive volume, to dry joints on the circuit board, to failing capacitors, to excessive moisture/humidity when singing close and loud.