Cassette to cassette overdubbing — how did we do it?

[Dr Huge Longjohns]

In the late seventies/early 80s we would record our bands using two cassette decks. We’d plug two mics into one and point them at the instruments to create a stereo backing track.
Then we’d get a second cassette deck and record vocals and the backing track together onto the second cassette.
But for the life of me I can’t remember how we did it. Obviously it’s easy with a little mixer to blend the backing track and live vocals into the second cassette but I don’t believe we had access to such sophisticated equipment!! All we had was basic hifi separates. So how did we do it? Any other oldies got any ideas?
(We didn’t do it by using speakers by the way, in case that was a thought.)

[Mike Stranks]

I don't think you'd have stayed in stereo...

One scenario would be to take the backing track and route that to one track of a second machine and at the same time record vocals onto the other track.

You'd then have backing L, vocals R or vice-versa.

You could then take those tracks and 'mix' them back to another machine using a combination of 2 to 1 adapters and balance controls.

It would work, but I wouldn't vouch for the quality!

The arrival of the Portastudio in 1979 - I remember it well! - really was a game-changer. The rest is history!

[Arpangel]

Mike is right, and if you’d had an amp with a mono button, you could then record a mono mix of the two tracks onto one cassette deck, on both channels.
I wasn’t averse to just snipping cables, and literally just twisting wires into the same signal.

[The Elf]

I must be one of the only guys from my generation that never had a cassette multitracker. I went through a few open reel recorders, though. One of which had built-in 'sound on sound' that I could never understand!

[Dr Huge Longjohns]

We definitely had the backing track still in stereo, I was transferring an example into Logic yesterday!

I’m wondering if some cassette decks let you record the mic ins and line ins at the same time? That would certainly solve it?

The vocals are clearly done with two mics too so it’s all stereo and remarkably good quality actually.

[Hugh Robjohns]

Lots of the cassette decks of that era had basic input mixing functions for combining mics with line sources. I remember a desktop Sony model that had faders on the top which we used in exactly the way you describe.

[Dr Huge Longjohns]

I must be one of the only guys from my generation that never had a cassette multitracker. I went through a few open reel recorders, though. One of which had built-in 'sound on sound' that I could never understand!

I graduated from ordinary cassette as described above, with two mic inputs, to a Teac 108 which let you record right and left tracks completely independently! Two track multitracking! Changed my world. Then a four track Fostex x15, then a Tascam Porta 2! Then along came digital and the Akai dps 12. Happy days!

[Dr Huge Longjohns]

Lots of the cassette decks of that era had basic input mixing functions for combining mics with line sources. I remember a desktop Sony model that had faders on the top which we used in exactly the way you describe.

I certainly don’t remember any mixing/blending functions like that but if it would let you record both sources at once we probably blended using the mic in rec level or something!

[Wonks]

As you had mics, are you sure you didn’t run them into a mixer first and then into a cassette deck? It would have made it a lot easier to do what you describe.

[Dr Huge Longjohns]

No definitely not. A Shure Unidyne B and another plastic no name dynamic was the extent of our recording rig. Just moved them around until it sounded ok on playback. Eq, compression etc were not even on our radar.

[BWC]

We didn’t do it by using speakers by the way, in case that was a thought.

I first did it with speakers, cheap little boom boxes, sounded terrible. I also vaguely remember a bookshelf system where I could push in both the "Tape" and "Aux" buttons at the same time, and if I could make 'em both stay in... then I got my 488 Portastudio...

[James Perrett]

I must be one of the only guys from my generation that never had a cassette multitracker. I went through a few open reel recorders, though. One of which had built-in 'sound on sound' that I could never understand!

You weren't the only one to miss out the portastudio. I had friends with 4 tracks (including one with an old Ampex half inch reel to reel machine) but I upgraded from sound on sound on a reel to reel straight to 8 track. 4 tracks involved too many compromises and on every 4 track session that I did we spent too long trying to overcome the limitations imposed by the lack of tracks. Sound on sound dictated that you had to work in a certain way while 8 track gave you proper multitracking without the headaches of 4 track.

[BWC]

My Portastudio was the later 8-track version. I didn't think four was worth it.

[Dr Huge Longjohns]

8 tracks on a cassette is mad isn’t it! Were these just double speed like the posher four track ones?

[Eddy Deegan]

8 tracks on a cassette is mad isn’t it! Were these just double speed like the posher four track ones?

I had an 8-track cassette for about a week once, I think a Tascam if memory serves, but found the quality unacceptable in comparison to the (surprisingly good) Akai Professional 4-track I'd used previously.

My solution was to return the 8-track and extend myself a bit more to an 8-track HD recorder. Never looked back after that!

[Hugh Robjohns]

8 tracks on a cassette is mad isn’t it! Were these just double speed like the posher four track ones?

Completely mad. Stupidly thin tracks made barely playable by the use of strong noise reduction and doubled tape speeds.

The Tascam 238 eight-track multitracker ran at 3-3/4 ips with dbx, and the Tascam 238S version used Dobley S noise reduction.

[Sam Spoons]

I must be one of the only guys from my generation that never had a cassette multitracker. I went through a few open reel recorders, though. One of which had built-in 'sound on sound' that I could never understand!

Me too, IIRC I went straight from a mono portable cassette recorder to a Revox A77. There may have been a couple of stereo cassette decks but definitely never a cassette multitracker.

[BWC]

My 488 ran at double speed and had dbx that I left switched off. Used with good quality cassettes, I thought it sounded as good as anything else I had access to at the time.

[Dynamic Mike]

Lots of the cassette decks of that era had basic input mixing functions for combining mics with line sources. I remember a desktop Sony model that had faders on the top which we used in exactly the way you describe.

I had a pioneer dual cassette deck that let you blend a mic input when you were copying from one deck to the other. It was just a consumer tower system from Dixons, nothing high-end. I'm pretty sure the backing track stayed stereo but any overdubs would have been mono.

[Music Wolf]

I started with a Tascam 244 Portastudio but my next upgrade was to a Sansui 6 track cassette and 12 channel mixer (they also made a combined 6 track portastudio). After that I moved to 8 track R2R.

[Arpangel]

I didn’t get a Portastudio till the late eighties, there used to be a studio near us, that we used to record in, they had a half inch four track Ferrograph, and I always had trouble filling up those four tracks.
Before all that I had open reel machines, tape bouncing, cassettes, using records as samples, I’m in the middle of going through these old tapes, I can recommend it, it’s very interesting, listening back.

[Dr Huge Longjohns]

That’s exactly what I’m doing, hence my bewilderment!