Neumann KH150 and KH120II

[porthoss78]

Hi, I did a search but couldn't find any other forums posts about this yet but Neumann have announced a new KH150 DSP 7" monitor:

https://www.gearnews.com/nab-2022-neuma ... nd-aes-67/

Apparently someone also found reference to a KH120II monitor in a recent Neumann MA-1 software version:

https://www.audiosciencereview.com/foru ... st-1168652

I'm pretty excited by the prospect of more Neumann monitors with DSP in!

[Hugh Robjohns]

A larger version of the KH80 was an obvious next step, so the KH150 makes perfect sense.

I'm less sure about a revised KH120ii since the KH80 almost matches the 120 anyway in terms of bandwidth and SPL... but I'm sure Neumann has a plan.

[Drew Stephenson]

I'd expect a 310 DSP before too long as well. In my ignorance I would assume that the DSP required for a 3-way would be more complex than for a 2-way box though.

[ConcertinaChap]

It's funny, gear lust. Having had my KH120s for a good few years now, knowing the sound well and very happy with it, I still find the thought of upgraded monitors very tempting. Never mind that my 70 year old ears are unlikely to be able to hear much difference with new Neumann monitors. Never mind that I like the mixes I make on them. The old ones are somehow lacking just because they're not the new ones.

Hey ho, I'll get over it, especially after y'all stop stop talking about them ...

CC

[Hugh Robjohns]

I'd expect a 310 DSP before too long as well.

Absolutely, and I'm surprised it hasn't already appeared.

In my ignorance I would assume that the DSP required for a 3-way would be more complex than for a 2-way box though.

There's an extra crossover to code and another driver to tune and protect, but it's just more of the same rather than anything new. Plenty of other manufacturers have 3-way DSP designs

[Hugh Robjohns]

I still find the thought of upgraded monitors very tempting.

There's no doubt in my mind that good DSP monitors are more accurate, natural and revealing than conventional analogue monitors. And you would undoubtedly hear the difference. The new PMC 6.2, for example, is a genuine revelation!

However, plenty of stunningly good records have been made on analogue monitors (many not performing as well as KH120s, too)... so your speakers really aren't the limiting factor.

Although having used many DSP speakers and appreciating their merits, I'm in no rush to swap out my analogue KH310s.

Of course, if PMC asked me to store a grubby set of 6.2s I wouldn't object too much...

[ConcertinaChap]

so your speakers really aren't the limiting factor.

Thanks, Hugh. It's always worth reminding myself that the limiting factor lies between my ears, not outside them.

CC

[porthoss78]

A larger version of the KH80 was an obvious next step, so the KH150 makes perfect sense.

I'm less sure about a revised KH120ii since the KH80 almost matches the 120 anyway in terms of bandwidth and SPL... but I'm sure Neumann has a plan.

I sold my KH120A monitors a wile ago to help out some friends but I'll definitely be looking to buy a new set by 2023, so the KH150 might be just the thing I'll be getting! That's after reading your review of it, obviously

I'm surprised about the potential DSP version of the KH120s too, if it is true. I wonder if Neumann are just looking to expand the range of woofer sizes so they're similar to other monitor manufacturers in the sizes they offer... I'm sure we'll get to see what they're offering soon enough (and hopefully a KH310 DSP version!)

[bn1studio]

I think KH120 DSP is a no-brainer from Neumann's point of view. It's a well-known and well-regarded speaker so an update makes sense. The fact that the KH80 now treads all over the toes of the KH120 makes it essential!

IMHO the KH80 seems better-integrated than the KH120, which is odd as that's one area where the KH120 has never seemed lacking. Let's see what DSP can do for the KH310 - I expect the improvement will be enormous

[Nazard]

It hasn't made the Neumann website yet.

I was interested whether the DSP setup was still iOS only, or, included Android?

And there were a few niggles with the KH80s, mainly related to power off/on, if I remember.

Clearly DSP appears to be presently the state of the art, but I expect that machine learning, rather than a slightly blunt tool like DSP, may be the way forward. For example, if Neumann, (and KEF, etc.,), collected data from their users, they could use that data to produce individual firmware updates, to their end users. Very bespoke and a great sales tool, potentially.

P.S. my idea needs a lot more thought, but I think that there may be a nugget there, or not, haha!

[dickiefunk]

I’ve had the KH120’s ever since they first hit the stores in the UK. I’ve been using them for well over 10 years and love them. I added an Eve TS108 sub to these which is a surprisingly good little sub but I haven’t been able to perfectly integrate with the KH120’s. Whilst it’s not too bad, I don’t really use it for critical mixing. It can be useful to give me a rough idea of what’s happening in the sub bass area but not 100% reliable due to certain frequencies overwhelming my small room.
For more accurate mix translation, I tend to use just the KH120’s by themselves and reference of headphones for the deeper sub frequencies.
Whilst the KH120’s are capable of putting out surprisingly deep bass by themselves, i would ideally like a little more.
I have considered the KH310’s but them are completely out of my budget.
I did consider changing the Eve TS108 for the Neumann KH750 as this has the dsp to help tune the whole system to my room but I goes an extra octave lower than the Eve TS108 and I’m thinking this could be even more overwhelming/overkill for my small room.
I have been wishing Neumann would release something in between the KH120 - KH310 and am really excited to hear that they have with the KH150!!
I can’t wait to find out more about it and hopefully try out for myself! This could be the perfect solution for my mixing room!

[Arpangel]

I wish it was as easy to swap out our ears, as it is monitors.

[Bob Bickerton]

Don’t do it! Look what happened to Van Gogh……..

Bob

[Arpangel]

Don’t do it! Look what happened to Van Gogh……..

Bob

Yes, but that could never happen to me, see, "he" was very strange.

[ManFromGlass]

Ear transplants?
Why not!
Sign me up too, something that goes from 20 - 17kHz hopefully with my choice of colour!

[Drew Stephenson]

I see a set of open-backed headphones are also in the pipeline...

[dickiefunk]

I see a set of open-backed headphones are also in the pipeline...

Yep. Will be interested to check those out as well! Really love the KH120’s and would ideally have liked the KH310’s but simply can’t afford those.
The KH150’s “could” potentially be ideal as I would expect those to have a little more depth of bass and the dsp as well.

[Arpangel]

Ear transplants?
Why not!
Sign me up too, something that goes from 20 - 17kHz hopefully with my choice of colour!

I’d be lucky to hear 10k, realistically, it’s more like 7/8k.
New monitors for me? that’s why I haven’t bothered.

[dickiefunk]

Thomann recently had the KH150's up on their site with a pre-order price for £1399 each which is quite a difference from the KH120's at £525 each. It's also pretty close to the KH310 price.
I'm really interested to see what Neumann has planned for the KH120 mk2. Also, Focal announced a new ST6 range updating their Solo6 and Twin models with new drivers and lots of other improvements across the board.

I would love to hear how the new Neumann KH150 and KH120mk2 compare to the new Focal Solo6 and PMC Result6 when they are released!

[porthoss78]

Thomann recently had the KH150's up on their site with a pre-order price for £1399 each which is quite a difference from the KH120's at £525 each. It's also pretty close to the KH310 price.
I'm really interested to see what Neumann has planned for the KH120 mk2. Also, Focal announced a new ST6 range updating their Solo6 and Twin models with new drivers and lots of other improvements across the board.

I would love to hear how the new Neumann KH150 and KH120mk2 compare to the new Focal Solo6 and PMC Result6 when they are released!

Thanks for the info - I wasn't expecting them to be so expensive but I guess that was just wishful thinking on my part. Hopefully the price was incorrect, or only provisional, and it'll be cheaper when they are officially released.

If they are going to be that expensive, maybe I'll wait to see if the KH120mk2 are released after all

[porthoss78]

After some more Googling, I found a thread on a different audio forum (I hope it's ok to post it here) where they have photos of the KH150 compared to the KH120. The KH150 is quite a bit larger:

https://www.audiosciencereview.com/foru ... 454/page-6

Here is the photo (It is taken directly from the forum so I completely understand if this post isn't allowed):



Plus there is a German audio site with a bit more information on them (in German):

https://www.da-x.de/de/news/neumann-ste ... 150_A&tar=

Translation:

New KH monitors with 6.5" drivers, DSP and AES67
After the KH 150 had already been sighted by some visitors at the 2022 NAB Show and the rumor mill was busy bubbling, we finally have concrete information about the new DSP-based studio monitor!

Big brother of the KH 120
In the line-up, it is the big brother of the KH 120 and, after the KH 80, is now the second DSP-based studio monitor from Neumann. In contrast to the KH 80 DSP, the KH 150 has a significantly larger woofer with a 6.5" diameter, which booms down to 39 Hz and can therefore also be operated without a subwoofer without any problems. As always, the usual Neumann quality offers maximum linearity and minimum distortion , no coloring and an extremely consistent sound with only ± 0.8 dB manufacturing tolerance.

Built-in DSP engine
As with the KH 80, the new DSP engine from Neumann is used here. This DSP-controlled electronics enables optimal adjustment to the listening environment through linear phase behavior and room-adaptive calibration using the MA 1 Alignment Kit - phase cancellation caused by the listening room and overemphasized resonances are a thing of the past. However, the MA 1 Alignment Kit must be purchased separately and is not part of the scope of delivery.

AES67 - Audio over IP
As a bonus, there is also the variant with an integrated AES67 network port. AES67 is not an ordinary protocol, because compared to other audio network protocols that cannot be combined with each other, AES67 is considered an exchange format with the ability to connect various network standards. The KH 150 AES is fully compatible with broadcast standards such as ST 2110, ST 2022-7 redundancy and RAVENNA and also interfaces with DANTE-generated AES67 network streams.

Available from the end of August in anthracite and white
The KH 150 will probably be available in white and anthracite from the end of August.

[porthoss78]

Looks like the KH150s are now available for pre order at Thomann:

https://www.thomann.de/gb/neumann_kh_15 ... 4&affid=84

They're £1365 each though so only a bit less than the KH310 but obviously have DSP in.

Looking forward to the review of these in SOS and the update to the KH120 with DSP (if that's true of course...)

[dickiefunk]

The KH150's are also up on the Neumann website :-

https://en-de.neumann.com/kh-150#description

The KH120II is based on the names of some files found in a subfolder of the new MA1-installation.

[porthoss78]

The KH150's are also up on the Neumann website :-

https://en-de.neumann.com/kh-150#description

The KH120II is based on the names of some files found in a subfolder of the new MA1-installation.

Of course, I'd almost completely forget that the KH120II had already come out at the start of the thread

I checked earlier and couldn't find the KH150 on the Neumann website so either must have been updated today, or more likely, I missed it! Thanks dickiefunk

[jaminem]

Thomann recently had the KH150's up on their site with a pre-order price for £1399 each which is quite a difference from the KH120's at £525 each. It's also pretty close to the KH310 price.

I paid £2,600 for my pair of KH310's....New!

sorry..