32-bit hardware for recording vocals

[Johnny Go-Time]

Hello - I had a situation recently where I recorded vocals which ended up clipped...and then shortly after I saw the review of the Rode NT1 5th Gen mic https://www.soundonsound.com/reviews/rode-nt1-5th-gen which apparently is immune to clipping, so I'm interested...

But then I also saw the Zoom UAC-232 interface which seems to solve the same problem https://www.soundonsound.com/news/zoom-release-uac-232

Can I use any "normal" mic (i.e. the one which came in my Focusrite Scarlett 3rd gen interface pack) with the 32-bit Zoom interface, and avoid the clipping?

Or is it better to put the 32-bit Rode through my Scarlett interface. Thank you!

[Sam Spoons]

Hi and welcome to the forum.

It's unlikely that the mic is clipping unless you are recording a seriously loud source, more jet engine at 1m than vocals. So the likely cause is that you've set the gain structure 'sub-optimally'. If your recorder/interface can record at 24bit that will let you record with plenty of headroom, if you have signal level meters make sure the the average level is around -18dB and peaks don't exceed -10dB, if three colour LEDs then set them so the yellow is flickering with the red never illuminating.

The Zoom 32 bit recording system gives massive digital headroom which allows you to record without paying any attention to levels but with minimal care 24 bit will work just as well.

The Rode mic is not '32 bit' (it's not digital) but works by having massive max SPL capability but unless you set the gain structure correctly it won't help prevent clipping on its own.

[Wonks]

The Rode mic is not '32 bit' (it's not digital) but works by having massive max SPL capability but unless you set the gain structure correctly it won't help prevent clipping on its own.

Oh yes it is (the 5th gen mic linked to) if you use the USB interface!

But the mic (used with the USB connection) becomes the interface. You don't plug it in to your Scarlett interface if you use the USB connection. If you've got PC you'll have a choice of using either the NT1v5 or the Scarlett for recording. If a Mac, then you can create an aggregate device and have both.

To monitor the recording if using the USB connection on the Rode on a PC, you'll need to use a Rode interface (not the Scarlett) that's compatible with the Rode Connect utility (currently only the Rode AI-Micro is listed as being compatible) https://rode.com/en/interfaces-and-mixe ... s/ai-micro so you'll really have to want to go down the all-Rode route if you plan to use the NT1 in USB mode all the time on a PC.

Yes, you could get a 32-bt interface (there are quite a few around now and the number will grow), but unless you are always getting a mic out at impromptu recordings sessions with only seconds to set up and probably place the mic in a less than ideal position, then recording at 24-bits and setting an average recording level at -20dB for the loud bits should give you more than enough headroom with what you already have.

And for very loud instruments/noises, you'll still need to be aware that there's 132dB SPL limit for the NT1, above which it will still clip. That's very loud, but put the mic right next to some loud drums, up the bell of a brass instrument or against the grille of a very loud speaker, and you may still get distortion. Unlike some mics, the NT1 doesn't have any in-built pads to increase the range.

Plus there is the 48kHz or 96kHz only operation via USB, which you may find limiting or require some external file mangling before importing them into existing 44.1kHz or 88.2kHz projects.

[Sam Spoons]

The Rode mic is not '32 bit' (it's not digital) but works by having massive max SPL capability but unless you set the gain structure correctly it won't help prevent clipping on its own.

Oh yes it is (the 5th gen mic linked to) if you use the USB interface!

You're right...

[Wonks]

To be fair, I had read the SOS review.

[Johnny Go-Time]

Hi and welcome to the forum.

Hello - thank you and for the quick response!

The Zoom 32 bit recording system gives massive digital headroom which allows you to record without paying any attention to levels but with minimal care 24 bit will work just as well.

I have to admit, I am looking to avoid even that 'minimal care' in setup that you mention...
I am a novice and only get to do the things sporadically, so I'm looking to remove as many "setup issues" across various hardware as possible, while acknowledging that it's better to learn proper techniques in the long run!

[Johnny Go-Time]

But the mic (used with the USB connection) becomes the interface. You don't plug it in to your Scarlett interface if you use the USB connection. If you've got PC you'll have a choice of using either the NT1v5 or the Scarlett for recording.

Aha! Thank you for the quick response and your great points. Yes I work only on PC, not live.

To monitor the recording if using the USB connection on the Rode on a PC, you'll need to use a Rode interface (not the Scarlett) that's compatible with the Rode Connect utility (currently only the Rode AI-Micro is listed as being compatible) https://rode.com/en/interfaces-and-mixe ... s/ai-micro so you'll really have to want to go down the all-Rode route if you plan to use the NT1 in USB mode all the time on a PC.

Thank youuuuu for pointing this out! Hahah somehow I missed that, and it would have completely frustrated & derailed me to discover it after buying & opening the Rode as I'd been leaning toward

unless you are always getting a mic out at impromptu recordings sessions with only seconds to set up and probably place the mic in a less than ideal position, then recording at 24-bits and setting an average recording level at -20dB for the loud bits should give you more than enough headroom with what you already have.

I'm afraid it's more that I want to protect myself from messing things up after teardown/setups in my own workspace, as I rarely do the vocals. I recognize that it's better to get skilled at doing so, but I'm hoping for a layer of protecting-myself-from-myself here... I wasn't able to dial in a good setup that covered the dynamic range from very quiet words to very loud singing, so wondering if 32-bit range would help me there.

[Wonks]

The whole point of 24-bit recording is that you've still got plenty of quiet dynamic range available even if the singer does go from quiet to loud, even if peaking at say -12dBFS.

You'll still have the same exact dynamic range captured with 32-bit float recording.

If you are really concerned, then you could go old-school and use a compressor on the way in. I don't think the Scarletts have any insert points, so to do that you'd then need an external mic pre-amp and a compressor, or a channel strip incorporating both.

So it may well be easier to get something like the Zoom UAC-232 if you want peace of mind.

I don't know what Scarlett interface you have, but in terms of I/O the Zoom is equivalent to a 2i2, but with the added benefit of hardware MIDI (which you may or may not find useful in future).

One question that I don't think has been asked is what is your current vocal mic? This is more to check the spec of the mic and what maximum SPL it can accept without overloading than for anything else.

[Hugh Robjohns]

We're all novices at least once.... but setting levels sensibly is page 2, not page 756. You don't need 32-bit floating point, or magic beans. You just need to adjust the gain so that peak levels don't go higher than about -10dBFS.

[Johnny Go-Time]

Thanks everyone for responding.

I am struggling with being able to capture quiet vocals transitioning to loud. When I reduce the gain on my interface to a point where loud singing doesn't clip, then the quiet stuff in the same song sounds just too faint & hollow...but then of course if I turn up the gain, when the heavier stuff comes, the clipping kicks in.

I just have the Focusrite Scarlett Studio mic which came with my 3rd Gen interface, I haven't been able to find its specs online.

I have a digital compressor in the chain now and will see if I can get that to help.

[Wonks]

Use compression after the recording when you can set the parameters to suit the dynamic range, not as part of the recording chain.

[RichardT]

With 24 bit recording you have enough dynamic range for really quite big differences in volume to be OK.

Set your levels as described above for the loudest peaks, don’t apply any compression on the way in, and, as Wonks says, you can fix things later.

You can use both compression and level automation in your DAW to even out the volumes.