Audient iD-24 and H/W Compressor Connections?

[james090]

I recently purchased the Audient iD-24 and I'm excited to integrate my hardware compressor with it. The iD-24 comes equipped with dedicated insert send and return ports on its analog channels, but i'm not sure how to setup?

I could use some assistance in figuring out the right cables for this setup. Should I opt for Y-shaped insert leads, or would it be more appropriate to use individual single-ring mono cables?
My hardware compressor offers two channels, which I'd like to use in stereo mode. It has Channel A (input/output) and Channel B (input/output).

So, to achieve the desired configuration, do I need to purchase two Y leads, or can I simply use single 6.35mm mono jack leads?

Thanks in advance for your help!

[Drew Stephenson]

Hi James, you'll need to tell us what the hardware compressor is.

[james090]

Hi James, you'll need to tell us what the hardware compressor is.

Apologies its the Alesis 3630, adn i'd like to use it as a stereo compressor.

[Wonks]

The 3630 has unbalanced inputs and outputs, so you’d need four 1/4” TS to 1/4” TS cables. The iD uses separate balanced connections for the insert send and returns, so you can’t use a Y cable (as would be common on a mixing desk).

The 3630 is a pretty bland compressor (I had one for live use), and with the iD4, there’s no point recording anything with it unless you want to add it’s less than stellar ‘character’.

The inserts are wired between the preamps and the A/D converter, so you can only use the compressor like this when recording through the mic or line inputs. You can’t use it to compress tracks you’ve already recorded using the inserts. To do that you’d need an expansion interface connected via ADAT, and set up input and output routings in your DAW.

[james090]

The 3630 has unbalanced inputs and outputs, so you’d need four 1/4” TS to 1/4” TS cables. The iD uses separate balanced connections for the insert send and returns, so you can’t use a Y cable (as would be common on a mixing desk)

- Thanks Wonks, so I'd need to connect standard Mono 1/4” TS from each Send/Return to the 3630 like :

4 x separate cables :

iD-24 Ch 1 Send > 3630 Ch A IN
3630 Ch A out > iD-24 Ch1 Return

iD-24 Ch 2 Send > 3630 Ch B IN
3630 Ch B out > iD-24 Ch2 Return

I know its pretty bland but I was using it as an effect for Lo-Fi style music, and wanted to use it live as its 'recording' into the iD-24 and not compress already recorded material.

If the set up with 4 x cables is correct, I guess it would just work. I have 4 x 1 ring tip mono cables to do this, but it seems no Y Insert leads which I'd need to buy (but it looks like they wouldn't work in this case with the iD-24)

[Wonks]

That’s it.

[james090]

That’s it.

Great thank you, I shall try these connections out.

Is there any benefit over, the really simple connection of a single hardware synth that I'm using, and connecting it in serial? so Synth L&R out > Compressor in > Comp out > iD24 Stereo In?

I hope thats not a stupid question, but I guess its the same 'sound' achieved at the end?

[Wonks]

The synth has a near line-out output level, so should work OK with the -10dBV setting on the 3630 if you go straight into that first.

Going into the iD first allows you to increase the gain to get a hotter signal level into the compressor, which might give you a better signal/noise ratio on the +4dBu setting. It also allows you to drive a hotter signal in to the compressor than the synth could alone, in case you want to add it's distortion to the synth's signal.

But for a plain peak limiting application, there's probably not a lot in it, though you may find one arrangement noisier than the other.

[Hugh Robjohns]

Going into the iD first allows you to increase the gain to get a hotter signal level into the compressor, which might give you a better signal/noise ratio on the +4dBu setting. It also allows you to drive a hotter signal in to the compressor than the synth could alone, in case you want to add it's distortion to the synth's signal.

Due to the internal gain structure, insert points often operate at a depressed level (ie, below the nominal +4dBu of main outputs etc). Although I couldn't find a spec for the iD-24's insert send level, the insert return clips at +12.5dBu.

That implies a nominal operating level through the insert connections of either -7.5dBu (if we assume a 20dB headroom margin), or -5.5dBu (assuming an 18dBu headroom margin). The latter figure is the more likely design choice IMO given the specs of Audient's other products.

Either way, the insert point isn't capable of driving standard (+4dBu) analogue gear to full level, even if you crank the iD-24 inputs. Consequently, running the Alesis at its -10dBV I/O setting would be the best option in both configurations: synth > Alesis > iD-24 or synth > iD-24 > Alesis.

[Wonks]

Well there you go!

[james090]

Going into the iD first allows you to increase the gain to get a hotter signal level into the compressor, which might give you a better signal/noise ratio on the +4dBu setting. It also allows you to drive a hotter signal in to the compressor than the synth could alone, in case you want to add it's distortion to the synth's signal.

Due to the internal gain structure, insert points often operate at a depressed level (ie, below the nominal +4dBu of main outputs etc). Although I couldn't find a spec for the iD-24's insert send level, the insert return clips at +12.5dBu.

That implies a nominal operating level through the insert connections of either -7.5dBu (if we assume a 20dB headroom margin), or -5.5dBu (assuming an 18dBu headroom margin). The latter figure is the more likely design choice IMO given the specs of Audient's other products.

Either way, the insert point isn't capable of driving standard (+4dBu) analogue gear to full level, even if you crank the iD-24 inputs. Consequently, running the Alesis at its -10dBV I/O setting would be the best option in both configurations: synth > Alesis > iD-24 or synth > iD-24 > Alesis.

Thank you Hugh!
So with regards to your last line, it doesn't really matter which way around then? I'm thinking for ease of use without changing and setting the internal iD software that i may just run it as Synth > Alesis > iD-24 for real simplicity?

[Wonks]

The insert points are pure hardware inserts, so no software settings needed.

Still worth trying both methods out.

[james090]

Jus hypothetically what if I used 2 x TRS ¼” jacks outs for my synth L/R?

I guess I need Mono TS jacks for each L/R but need to go in the hunt for some cables first.

Would it still work?

[Hugh Robjohns]

Jus hypothetically what if I used 2 x TRS ¼” jacks outs for my synth L/R?

It very much depends on the synth and, specifically, whether its sockets have internal ring connections or not. Most don't, in which case connecting an unbalanced synth to a balanced input using TRS cables is likely to cause problems along the lines of low signal level and/or unwanted hums and buzzes.

Some modern synths do have balanced outputs and would be fine... but most don't and mono TS cables are required.

[james090]

Thank you Hugh,

It looks like my synth module has both balanced (XLR Outs) and unbalanced outs (1/4 Jack).

So if im going from my Synth straight to the iD-24 then, I guessing balanced XLR cables either end (or XLR to balanced jacks) into the iD-24 ch1&2, and use the 3630 on the inserts with TS jacks as described above.

But if I was to do it in serial, the 3630 is unbalanced, so I could go Synth (unbalanced outs) > 3630 (unbalanced ins > outs) to iD-24 in, as a single chain?

(just so i know to get extra cables)

[Hugh Robjohns]

It looks like my synth module has both balanced (XLR Outs) and unbalanced outs (1/4 Jack).

So if im going from my Synth straight to the iD-24 then, I guessing balanced XLR cables either end (or XLR to balanced jacks) into the iD-24 ch1&2, and use the 3630 on the inserts with TS jacks as described above.

Yes, XLRf to TRS to connect the synth to the balanced line input. I doubt interference would be an issue, but balanced connections are also useful for avoiding ground loops, so it's probably worth trying that solution.

But if I was to do it in serial, the 3630 is unbalanced, so I could go Synth (unbalanced outs) > 3630 (unbalanced ins > outs) to iD-24 in, as a single chain?

Yes, that would work too...

[james090]

Thanks Hugh, I really appreciate your prompt response.

As a longstanding SOS subscriber, I sometimes worry about whether my questions are foolish or nonsensical. Therefore, receiving clear and concise answers from fellow forum members, including yourself as the one of the main SOS contributors, is always a great relief!

[Hugh Robjohns]

No one is born knowing any of this stuff, so every question is valid in my book.