Budget 'upsidaisy' CO-I mount

[ef37a]

For two LDCs. I have another Mackie EM91-C coming today. Zon have them at £29 so I jumped. Post free!
Son already has one back in La Belle but he will be here today as well and he can take it back and 'do stereo'.

Any ideas?

[Wonks]

Could you post that again, but in English?

[ef37a]

Could you post that again, but in English?

OK,
"LDC" means "Large Diaphragm Capacitor"

"Mackie EM91-C" is a TYPE of LDC microphone.

"CO-I" is one of many techniques to record in stereo....Need I go on?

Merry Christmas.

Dave.

[Wonks]

If by Zon you meant Amazon, then the £29 Mackie is the -CU USB version, with no shockproof cradle, not the -C XLR with cradle version (at £65 and much cheaper elsewhere).

[Wonks]

"CO-I" is one of many techniques to record in stereo....Need I go on?

Is this one of your unique descriptive terms, because I can’t find any reference to it in the SOS glossary or on the web. XY, AB, M/S, ORTF, coincident, near-coincident - yes, but no CO-I.

And ‘upsidaisy’?

[ef37a]

If by Zon you meant Amazon, then the £29 Mackie is the -CU USB version, with no shockproof cradle, not the -C XLR with cradle version (at £65 and much cheaper elsewhere).

Arrgh!! I was looking for the NOT USB version a few days ago and somehow missed that! Now I am in a quandary. Son might actually like a USB version of the Mackie but of course it won't mate up with his XLR version.

We shall see what sort of results it delivers, I am not going to get into return hassles over 30 quid and I am sure the mic will be useful.

Well spotted that man. I am still in the market for a 91-C but lets get crimble over first! BTW still interested in a stereo mount if anyone knows of something?

Dave.

[ef37a]

"CO-I" is one of many techniques to record in stereo....Need I go on?

Is this one of your unique descriptive terms, because I can’t find any reference to it in the SOS glossary or on the web. XY, AB, M/S, ORTF, coincident, near-coincident - yes, but no CO-I.

And ‘upsidaisy’?

I think if you look at how LDCs (or big ribbons) are setup for (ok "coincident!) stereo, "upsidaisy' fits the bill?

I am sure the term will find a home in Hugh's excellent glossary quite soon!

Dave.

[Hugh Robjohns]

. "CO-I" is one of many techniques to record in stereo....Need I go on?

I presume this is one of your made-up abbreviations and I'm guessing you mean a coincident stereo arrangement?

How that relates to upsidaisey I'm not sure. You want to hang your mics upside down in an XY formation?

It's a bit like playing Christmas Charades with the grandparents....

[ef37a]

. "CO-I" is one of many techniques to record in stereo....Need I go on?

I presume this is one of your made-up abbreviations and I'm guessing you mean a coincident stereo arrangement?

How that relates to upsidaisey I'm not sure. You want to hang your mics upside down in an XY formation?

It's a bit like playing Christmas Charades with the grandparents....

You both know exactly what I mean you pair of Bah! Humbugs!

An another thing! I don't need to come here to be patronized you know? I shall get plenty of that when I visit daughter and grandsons on the 25th!

Dave.

[Hugh Robjohns]

I'm still not entirely sure what you're seeking, but I'd suggest any simple stereo bar will suffice. There are plenty of cheap Chinese ones around.

[Wonks]

And there are 90° adapters for stands if you haven’t got one with a gooseneck.

And I didn’t have a clue about what you meant by CO-I.

Just work out how far apart you want to space the mics. A lot of stereo bars are quite short and fine for doing X-Y with SDCs but that’s hard to do with LDCs. Especially if you have to use the shock mounts.

Those Mackies don’t seem to have ring-style mounts for the base of the mics that many other LDCs have, which would make it a bit easier to get the diaphragms closer together.

[ef37a]

One of these,
https://sxpro.co.uk/product/coles-4038- ... 6WEALw_wcB
(for crying...) But rather with a decimal point somewhere in the price. Wish I still had my workshop.

Dave.

[Wonks]

You can do that with a standard stereo bar. But it needs to be quite long. At least twice the distance from the top of the microphone to the position of the shockmount stand adapter. The ability to space the mounts up to 30cm apart should be enough as they aren’t huge mics (155mm tall according to the specs).

Of course that’s for XY, which might have too wide an inclusion angle for a single guitar.

[Hugh Robjohns]

Ah... now I see what you mean.

Unless you're using Blumlein with fig-8 patterns or trying MS, I wouldn't go that way. The SRA* of XY cardioids is almost 180 degrees so you get very narrow stereo image in most cases.

Near-spaced on a small horizontal bar generally works much better with cardioids IMHO. ORTF, DIN or NOS formats, for example.

But if you want a cheap way of doing that vertical head-to-head thing then a cheap solution is to get one or two K&M 24050 adapters:


....or 23800 brackets:



The former are much more useful and nicely engineered, but the latter are £15 instead of £30.

Mount one mic on the stand's boom arm as usual. Mount the other on the adapter fitted to the stand's vertical column. Adjust the boom and bracket as necessary to align the mics.

Or ignore the boom arm and use two adapters on the stand to support the two mics from above and below.

You might also be able to do it with two mics on a long stereo bar mounted on a horizontal boom arm, but it's a lot of weight so balance may be difficult, resulting in droopage...

*Stereo Recording Angle

[ef37a]

Ah... now I see what you mean.

Unless you're using Blumlein with fig-8 patterns or trying MS, I wouldn't go that way. The SRA* of XY cardioids is almost 180 degrees so you get very narrow stereo image in most cases.

Near-spaced on a small horizontal bar generally works much better with cardioids IMHO. ORTF, DIN or NOS formats, for example.

But if you want a cheap way of doing that vertical head-to-head thing then a cheap solution is to get one or two K&M 24050 adapters:


....or 23800 brackets:



The former are much more useful and nicely engineered, but the latter are £15 instead of £30.

Mount one mic on the stand's boom arm as usual. Mount the other on the adapter fitted to the stand's vertical column. Adjust the boom and bracket as necessary to align the mics.

Or ignore the boom arm and use two adapters on the stand to support the two mics from above and below.

You might also be able to do it with two mics on a long stereo bar mounted on a horizontal boom arm, but it's a lot of weight so balance may be difficult, resulting in droopage...

*Stereo Recording Angle

Thank you Hugh, I have a couple of stereo bars (one an old one from Maplin) so I shall go with your spaced pair idea. The subject is classical guitar.

Dave.

[Wonks]

Interestingly, the EM91-CU is only $19.99 on the Mackie web site. The EM91-C is $44.99.

[Drew Stephenson]

I'm going to join the chorus of people who didn't have a clue what you were on about until you posted the Coles mount picture...
But having done that, here's a picture of how you can do it using the cheaper of Hugh's options:

[tea for two]

Reckon Ef37A was having a chortle dangling the bait as it were.

Upsidaisy I'd say is upside down.
So 2 LDC's facing one another with one of them upside down in a CO-I co-incident mounting.

[Hugh Robjohns]

[James Perrett]

But surely this is Upsidaisy



Or at least, as a parent, that was the first image that came into my head when I saw the post...

[Hugh Robjohns]

[ef37a]

Interestingly, the EM91-CU is only $19.99 on the Mackie web site. The EM91-C is $44.99.

****!!

Dave.

[MOF]

I thought I’d mistakenly gone to a cryptic crossword forum for a moment there.

[Humf]

Love this thread - reminds me of a colleague who used to create his own abbreviations for everything then throw a proper wobbly when nobody understood