Monitor Stands

[biffjunior]

So I’m constructing a home studio for mixing and I’m in the market for some decent sand fillable monitor stands. Does anyone have any recommendations (I’m UK based)? And how much should I be looking to spend on them?

[Wonks]

How high do they need to be (getting the tweeters to ear height when in your normal mixing position)?

This can vary a fair bit depending on the monitors you have.

[Luke W]

As above, exactly what you need will depend on a few things, but you could do worse than having a chat to Custom Design. I bought my stands from them based on recommendations on here and they were really helpful. I can't remember what I paid but I seem to recall them being more than reasonable considering the quality.

[Dan LB]

Check out Towersonic
http://www.towersonic.com/index.php

[sonics]

Check out Towersonic
http://www.towersonic.com/index.php

Their website mentions NAMM. 2018!!


Are they good? What do you have?

[Arpangel]

I have a pair of £28 Gear For Music stands, being the stingy b******d I am.
They do the job, the job being to support my speakers.
I can understand the need for decent stands if you’ve got a big pair of 10k monitors, but for the majority of mainstream cheaper stuff, I don’t think it’s worth worrying about.

[Dan LB]

Check out Towersonic
http://www.towersonic.com/index.php

Their website mentions NAMM. 2018!!


Are they good? What do you have?

Hmmm….. yes, their website does seem to be a little out of date!
Hopefully they’re still in business.

We have the TS-1s in work and they’re very good. Extremely sturdy and very heavy once filled with kiln-dried sand.

I seem to remember Hugh reviewing them a good few years ago and rated them pretty highly.

[Wonks]

There's a page that mentions 'copyright 2024', so someone is doing something to the web page. But the site does seem to fall foul of UK law as I can't see any company registration number or any registered company address on any of the pages.

[ef37a]

My Tannoy 5As are atop two CD holders made from melamine covered MDF, had them years, got them of the net as flat packs.

However, when I was at the network factory they got into Power Poles, an ally extrusion that can be blanked off and populated with mains sockets and data modules. I have several about the place doing duty as mains diss' devices.

We cut them using a terrifying 12" 3ph circular saw which did a superb job and made a dead flat surface, perfectly square to the pole length. Thus I could screw MDF panels on each end. I don't know if anyone sells such poles for speakers?

Not sure the sand is really necessary?

Dave

[Arpangel]

My Tannoy 5As are atop two CD holders made from melamine covered MDF, had them years, got them of the net as flat packs.

However, when I was at the network factory they got into Power Poles, an ally extrusion that can be blanked off and populated with mains sockets and data modules. I have several about the place doing duty as mains diss' devices.

We cut them using a terrifying 12" 3ph circular saw which did a superb job and made a dead flat surface, perfectly square to the pole length. Thus I could screw MDF panels on each end. I don't know if anyone sells such poles for speakers?

Not sure the sand is really necessary?

Dave

I had my hi-fi speakers on top of CD towers at one point, it was like they were made for my RCL Small Loudspeakers, the CD's acted as ballast, they were really heavy.

[Nazard]

Atacama make some good stands from my experience and some are 'mass fillable', e.g. SLX 600.

https://www.atacama-audio.co.uk/

[Arpangel]

Atacama make some good stands, from my experience and some are 'mass fillable'.

https://www.atacama-audio.co.uk/

I suppose £200 isn’t bad for a couple of stands, too much for me though.
I was driving through St Johns Wood in London one day, and saw a pair of expensive looking speaker stands on the pavement with "please take" written on them, it just happened I needed a pair for my KLH Model 5’s, and these looked like they were made from them, the stands were really heavy, I could just about lift one, they had holes for sand filling too. Must have bee a couple hundred quids worth back in the 90’s, that’s why I hate paying for things, I’m used to just picking stuff up at boot sales, or finding things on the street, but that rarely happens these days.
Although a friend recently found a Thorens TD166 turntable in a skip, I was extremely jealous.

[James Perrett]

Although a friend recently found a Thorens TD166 turntable in a skip, I was extremely jealous.

I'll raise that to a Garrard 301 - although it was next to a skip rather than in it.

However, when I was at the network factory they got into Power Poles, an ally extrusion that can be blanked off and populated with mains sockets and data modules. I have several about the place doing duty as mains diss' devices.

We cut them using a terrifying 12" 3ph circular saw which did a superb job and made a dead flat surface, perfectly square to the pole length. Thus I could screw MDF panels on each end. I don't know if anyone sells such poles for speakers?

If you want to make custom stands then take a look at the aluminium extrusions that you can buy cut to the exact length that you need. One source is

https://ooznest.co.uk/product-category/ ... xtrusions/

and you can also buy all kinds of joining pieces and brackets. Extrusions like that formed the frame of our submarine for many years.

[Wonks]

Not sure the sand is really necessary?

I think it very much depends on the stand. Hollow metal tubes will ring/resonate if you hit them, and will therefore resonate at the same audio frequencies they ring at. You don’t want any part of the stand resonating if you can help it. Filling them with sand will damp/kill the metal tube resonances, improving the stand’s performance.

But some stand designs will be better than others in this respect.

[Hugh Robjohns]

It also adds considerably to the mass and therefore inertia, helping to give the speakers a properly solid and stable foundation that doesn't move in the breeze!

[Luke W]

I think it very much depends on the stand. Hollow metal tubes will ring/resonate if you hit them, and will therefore resonate at the same audio frequencies they ring at. You don’t want any part of the stand resonating if you can help it. Filling them with sand will damp/kill the metal tube resonances, improving the stand’s performance.

But some stand designs will be better than others in this respect.

I know mine were like giant wind chimes before I filled them, and the company were clear about them needing material inside of them to perform at their best. Resonances aside, the increase in mass is a big help as well.

[Zukan]

Atacama make some good stands from my experience and some are 'mass fillable', e.g. SLX 600.

https://www.atacama-audio.co.uk/

I have the Nexus 10i to house my Neumanns. Not bad.

[ef37a]

Not sure the sand is really necessary?

I think it very much depends on the stand. Hollow metal tubes will ring/resonate if you hit them, and will therefore resonate at the same audio frequencies they ring at. You don’t want any part of the stand resonating if you can help it. Filling them with sand will damp/kill the metal tube resonances, improving the stand’s performance.

But some stand designs will be better than others in this respect.

Thank you Wonks, Gilbert Briggs was my speaker bible! My objection to sand is that it is messy. The power poles I mentioned are actually very rigid and Aluminium has a lot more internal damping than say steel. I think some BAF wadding or old socks stuffed down the tubes would suffice? In any case the stands are not part of the enclosure and steps should be taken to ensure the cabinets are acoustically isolated from them.

Dave.

[Hugh Robjohns]

My objection to sand is that it is messy.

Not if you use a plastic bag in the hollow tube, and fill that — and many stands come with appropriate bags (or you can find them in the usual marketplaces).

A good alternative to dry sand is (fresh) kitty litter — as advocated by PMC. Lead shot is the idea, of course, but not hugely practical these days. Small steel ball bearings might make a good alternative.

I think some BAF wadding or old socks stuffed down the tubes would suffice?

I have used fibreglass wadding before now, in large diameter pipe stands. Kills the ringing very well, but doesn't add to the mass.

In any case the stands are not part of the enclosure and steps should be taken to ensure the cabinets are acoustically isolated from them.

I don't agree with that.

If the speakers are placed on something flimsy and prone to vibration, like a shelf, then acoustic isolation is undoubtedly the way to go.

But if the stands are solid, and mounted on a solid floor such that the speaker platform is stable in space in all three dimensions, I want the best mechanical coupling I can possibly get between speaker cab and platform.

[Drew Stephenson]

A good alternative to dry sand is (fresh) kitty litter — as advocated by PMC. Lead shot is the idea, of course, but not hugely practical these days. Small steel ball bearings might make a good alternative.

Because I had a bag kicking around I used cement powder. Definitely requires an internal bag but once you've shaken it down a few times it's nice and dense.

[ef37a]

My objection to sand is that it is messy.

Not if you use a plastic bag in the hollow tube, and fill that — and many stands come with appropriate bags (or you can find them in the usual marketplaces).

A good alternative to dry sand is (fresh) kitty litter — as advocated by PMC. Lead shot is the idea, of course, but not hugely practical these days. Small steel ball bearings might make a good alternative.

I think some BAF wadding or old socks stuffed down the tubes would suffice?

I have used fibreglass wadding before now, in large diameter pipe stands. Kills the ringing very well, but doesn't add to the mass.

In any case the stands are not part of the enclosure and steps should be taken to ensure the cabinets are acoustically isolated from them.

I don't agree with that.

If the speakers are placed on something flimsy and prone to vibration, like a shelf, then acoustic isolation is undoubtedly the way to go.

But if the stands are solid, and mounted on a solid floor such that the speaker platform is stable in space in all three dimensions, I want the best mechanical coupling I can possibly get between speaker cab and platform.

Yes, I get the mass thing but what is the logic behind a mechanical coupling between a speaker cab, its stand and the floor?
Not very sociable?

Dave.

[Hugh Robjohns]

Its fiziks, innit. Newton's third law.

The ideal is that the driver's chassis stays absolutely still so all the drive coil energy goes into moving the diaphragm.

If the speaker cab is allowed to be mobile, some of the drive coil energy will be lost moving the cabinet, and you can (in extremis) then get cross modulation distortion between the drivers.

So, the ideal arrangement is a solid concrete floor, with a solid stand, holding the speaker cabinet solidly in space.

Of course, if its a wobbly or resonant floor, you're back into the shelf situation when it's more desirable to prevent mechanical vibrations from leaving the cabinet (or the cabinet/stand combination). So some form of isolation/absorber is needed either between the cabinet–stand or between the stand–floor.

[ef37a]

Err? I don't have a degree in physics, not even a GCE but surely Third Law is for motion in one direction? A speaker cone spends exactly the same amount of time going forward as back and of course with the same mass. Net momentum must be zero?

Yes, in a perfect cab/room situation all would be concrete but I would think the last thing you want is for any cabinet vibration, however small and undesirable, to be coupled to anything else?

Dave.

[Hugh Robjohns]

A speaker cone spends exactly the same amount of time going forward as back...

Only if the waveform is symmetrical, and you're averaging movement over time. Instantaneously, when the woofer thrusts forwards on a kickdrum transient, the cabinet's going to try to go backwards. Ask Mr Newton.

I would think the last thing you want is for any cabinet vibration, however small and undesirable, to be coupled to anything else?

I agree. I want the cabinet to be held firmly in space so it can't vibrate. Other preferences/compromises are available....

[ef37a]

A speaker cone spends exactly the same amount of time going forward as back...

Only if the waveform is symmetrical, and you're averaging movement over time. Instantaneously, when the woofer thrusts forwards on a kickdrum transient, the cabinet's going to try to go backwards. Ask Mr Newton.

I would think the last thing you want is for any cabinet vibration, however small and undesirable, to be coupled to anything else?

I agree. I want the cabinet to be held firmly in space so it can't vibrate. Other preferences/compromises are available....

Mr Newton was too engrossed trying to turn lead into gold... I think the mass of even a 12" woofer cone is such a tiny,tiny fraction of the mass of the basket and cabinet that even for a large DC pulse you would find it hard to detect cabinet movement?

From my guns dabblings, recoil is proportional to velocity times mass. Yes the cone is moving very fast (but not as fast as most bullets) but is very light. Lighter indeed than many bullets.

Dave.