Pitch Correction - If, What, Why and Whatever,,,,

[Wonks]

I think Relish is a wonderful album. Bought it when it first came out and is still one of my favorite albums. I thought the follow-on album was rather meh though.

[alexis]

I started at the beginning of the song, and had no qualm at all with the acoustic guitar. Can't say for sure but I think my low standards for enjoying a song may be as responsible for that, even more so probably, than which side of the pond I live on.

Back to tuning: I noticed what I thought was vocal pitchiness here and there much more than tuning problems with the solo.

[BWC]

I actually quite like the hit, in a radio-friendly pop way, but having now listened to the rest of the album nothing grabbed me.
All nice and competent but, other than that acoustic guitar, nothing stood out to make me want to listen again.

Wow! Spider Web? Ladder? Nothing? Hmm.

On the one-hit-wonder side, it's amazing how many artists we assume are fairly worldwide never make it across the Atlantic - both ways.

I wouldn't think she's HUGE anywhere, but (again, among musicians) I'm surprised that only "the hit" made it across.

[Drew Stephenson]

Not really my genre anymore, 30 years ago maybe...

I will give it another listen though, I haven't been particularly with it this week so I wouldn't like to unfairly write something off.

[BWC]

Back to tuning: I noticed what I thought was vocal pitchiness here and there much more than tuning problems with the solo.

Yes, I noticed that too when I went back to listen to the acoustic guitar throughout.

Listening back to the whole song myself, I'm now wondering whether people think the vocals need correction. I don't, btw, but I wonder...

I wouldn't describe it as "pitchiness" or "tuning problems" though. ...with the vocal or guitar. But that's what I wonder about, do others hear it as wrong? Am I alone in loving those notes between the notes? ...or in a tiny (and perhaps shrinking?) minority?

[BWC]

Not really my genre anymore, 30 years ago maybe...

I will give it another listen though, I haven't been particularly with it this week so I wouldn't like to unfairly write something off.

Take your time. Listen when the mood is right. ...then report back immediately!

[alexis]

...
I wouldn't describe it as "pitchiness" or "tuning problems" though. ...with the vocal or guitar. But that's what I wonder about, do others hear it as wrong? ...

Great comment and question, challenging for me, it made me think hard, ouch that hurts!

Right now I'd say I noticed the occasional not landing spot on the notes, but wasn't bothered by that - didn't think it was wrong. I guess I've listened to many more hours of vocals I'd call great that were recorded before the Autotune era than after, so I'm kind of used to that.

(Though I do love me some Karen Carpenter, who never sang a wrong note, all before Autotune of course)!

[BWC]

I guess I've listened to many more hours of vocals I'd call great that were recorded before the Autotune era than after, so I'm kind of used to that.

Me too, and I find that something has gone missing, in the Autotune era. People often come here to ask, "What gear do I need to buy to get my stuff to sound as great as...?" and, of course, it's rarely their gear that's holding them back. I think that what's gone missing from modern music (some styles more than others) is the humanity. Too "perfect" bores me. I don't think these "deviations from the grid" (in pitch or timing) are necessarily mistakes, but subconscious decisions / expressions. Depends on the skill of the performer, of course, but I miss the subtleties in timing and pitch much more than I miss the noise and distortion of old gear, personally.

[amanise]

... Depends on the skill of the performer, of course, but I miss the subtleties in timing and pitch much more than I miss the noise and distortion of old gear, personally.

Exactly. Although I'm not sure someone like Lou Reed had the skill to go off pitch in any direction by a chosen amount at any given time. More an expression of feel or passion in the moment. There'll never be a plug in for that. Or staying up 5 nights straight on acid and coke before slamming down the bennies and getting the taxi to the studio.

I wish you could just write a song and sing it with the passion you had in mind, and still have people listen and adopt the vibe - so you could afford to go back and write and record another one - but it ain't like that any more. It ain't like anything any more.

I had cause to trawl for an album I haven't heard for maybe 40 odd years this morning. Spirit - The Adventures of Captain Copter And Commander Cassidy in Potato Land. Just awesome stuff. They'll never make another one like THAT again. So - it's time to roll over and go with the auto tune.

[Sam Spoons]

Errol Brown (Hot Chocolate) frequently sang slightly sharp which used to annoy me but I realised it was probably deliberate and increased tension/excitement.

[Wonks]

Errol Brown (Hot Chocolate) frequently sang slightly sharp which used to annoy me but I realised it was probably deliberate and increased tension/excitement.

So you whinge again...

[Drew Stephenson]

I think intent is key here. Whether that's sliding to a note, deliberately going slightly sharp, or rushing a beat. When it's done well and deliberately it's easy to just accept it as part of the music, revel in it even. And if you tried to fit it to a grid or a note it would probably sound wrong.
But where something is just slack then it's definitely worth looking at correction.
Maybe.

[tea for two]

Saw Chilli Peppers VFestival 2003. My abiding memory Anthony Kiedis singing ooot of tune on every song. A touch of autotune on Anthony would been alrighty I reckon.

[amanise]

Errol Brown (Hot Chocolate) frequently sang slightly sharp which used to annoy me but I realised it was probably deliberate and increased tension/excitement.

What made you think it was deliberate?

There's an analysis on YouTube of Pavarotti doing his scales that T42 pointed me at a while back, by Wings of Pegasus (may have remembered that name wrong). He was doing his scales in his dressing room and was consistently sharp on the way up - but bang on coming down. I can easily imagine that being deliberate - but Errol? Would he have had that kind of training?

[Sam Spoons]

Maybe deliberate is the wrong word but he was pretty consistent and I realised it added a sense of urgency somehow. If it was due to lack of ability/technique I'd have expected it to be a bit more hit and miss.

[amanise]

Maybe it was anxiety or something. Lots of pressure on singers in a studio environment. I imagine it gets even worse when you've had a few No1 hits and everyone expects another one bang on cue. Thinking back, he did have a sort of 'angsty' sound to his voice. Who knows? You'd have had to know the bloke a bit.

Didn't hurt the singles and album sales did it though? All that would've been pitch corrected away nowadays.

[BWC]

I think intent is key here. Whether that's sliding to a note, deliberately going slightly sharp, or rushing a beat. When it's done well and deliberately it's easy to just accept it as part of the music, revel in it even. And if you tried to fit it to a grid or a note it would probably sound wrong.

Yes! I'd add that it can be either consciously deliberate, or more intuitive. Some performers can't explain it, but can do it, consistently.

But where something is just slack then it's definitely worth looking at correction.
Maybe.

Determining whether it's intent or just slackin' is the trick, which is further complicated by each of us hearing things slightly differently from one another, and even ourselves at different times. As Sam Spoons points out, consistency is a good measure, but then, "even ourselves at different times" so maybe not always.

Saw Chilli Peppers VFestival 2003. My abiding memory Anthony Kiedis singing ooot of tune on every song. A touch of autotune on Anthony would been alrighty I reckon.

I reckon the same. But if too corrected, it wouldn't sound like Chili Peppers to me.

You'd have had to know the bloke a bit.

Ultimately, only the performer really knows if the record sounds as intended (they never really fully do, do they? ).

[amanise]

You'd have had to know the bloke a bit.

Ultimately, only the performer really knows if the record sounds as intended (they never really fully do, do they? ).

True. It's most often a voyage of discovery right to the very end

[tea for two]

I can't sing in tune to save my life. If I can hear myself thru headphones I sing more in tune. I can whistle basic stuff in reasonable tune.
Would I use autotune et al on myself. Nope because I've bumbled upon a singing style that doesn't need to be in tune whilst to me being emotive.

So have a singing style song composition style that doesn't need autotune. This would resonate with untold millions of folk that can't sing in tune which means they could sing their heart out to such songs.