The Behringer Keyboards 'n' Stuff Thread #3

[BillB]

People complain at Behringer for making clones of limited old synths. So they do their best to capture the sonic character of the original, then add interesting modern features that take that idea way past where it started, and guess what.

People complain.

[Hugh Robjohns]

Only some specific forum luddites...

[Arpangel]

People complain at Behringer for making clones of limited old synths. So they do their best to capture the sonic character of the original, then add interesting modern features that take that idea way past where it started, and guess what.

People complain.

If I want something that does new things I wouldn’t buy a replica of an old synth. New parameters are distracting, and unnecessary, I want it to be instantly familiar.
Sure, I'll learn a new thing if I have to, but it’s a completely different approach, getting a "new" instrument.

[Hugh Robjohns]

When Lord Birt was busy destroying the BBC, one of his priorities was to get rid of all those who could see through his malicious plans. He called them 'people tainted by experience' — meaning those who refused to embrace his new practices...

It seems apposite here too...

[BillB]

If I want something that does new things I wouldn’t buy a replica of an old synth. New parameters are distracting, and unnecessary, I want it to be instantly familiar.
Sure, I'll learn a new thing if I have to, but it’s a completely different approach, getting a "new" instrument.

I had a play with my Deepmind 12D the other night, starting from an init patch. I deliberately set out to see what I could do with just the front panel switches and sliders. Result was a nice meaty bass sound with very little effort. The only menu dive was a smidgin of chorus for a bit of width and subtle movement.

I suspect the UB-Xa would be similar. Lots you can do from the front panel alone (the vintage experience) with layers of further modulation available, to whatever extent you might, or might not, want them. Whether you want a 16-voice, reliable OBX-alike is another matter entirely.

[BJG145]

Personally, clones of stuff like the OSCar (for instance) appeals if it's close to the original, because the original is cool and aspirational. (I remember the original ads! My pocket money couldn't cover it.)

If it drifts too far (like this mockup), it's of no interest. It looks nothing like an OSCar, and I might as well use some random unbranded VST that can get similar results.

(This actually looks stomach-churning to me. It's like the Dall-E version.)

[BillB]

Behringer certainly don’t always get the aesthetics right, especially the basic ratio of keyboard size to control panel size. Sometimes they just look like a mini-me version of the cloned original tacked onto a keyboard. I guess they are trying to save them and us money by not adding the kind of space that was needed to house the electronics and controls in the 80’s. But it can certainly be off-putting.

[nathanscribe]

Behringer certainly don’t always get the aesthetics right, especially the basic ratio of keyboard size to control panel size. Sometimes they just look like a mini-me version of the cloned original tacked onto a keyboard. I guess they are trying to save them and us money by not adding the kind of space that was needed to house the electronics and controls in the 80’s. But it can certainly be off-putting.

That missing octave on the VC-340 keybed... yeah.

They don't always do it though, I have to say the RD-8 is a good size.

[The Elf]

Behringer certainly don’t always get the aesthetics right, especially the basic ratio of keyboard size to control panel size. Sometimes they just look like a mini-me version of the cloned original tacked onto a keyboard. I guess they are trying to save them and us money by not adding the kind of space that was needed to house the electronics and controls in the 80’s. But it can certainly be off-putting.

That missing octave on the VC-340 keybed... yeah.

I would love to have been at the product meeting that decided to put a 3-octave keyboard on the VC-340, then add a transpose switch. I suspect their tea was spiked that day...

I still chuckle when I recall the introductory video that mentioned key-split, then moved on hastily without demonstration, and hopefully before anyone realised that they only get one octave of keys on the short side of the split!

[Arpangel]

When Lord Birt was busy destroying the BBC, one of his priorities was to get rid of all those who could see through his malicious plans. He called them 'people tainted by experience' — meaning those who refused to embrace his new practices...

It seems apposite here too...

New practices, malicious plans, it’s a dumbing down, conditioning us to accept things like the Berry Oscar, I'm with Elf on this one.

[DGL.]

UB-XA now only £818 delivered from Thomann, madness!
https://www.thomann.co.uk/behringer_ub_xa.htm

[Arpangel]

VCS3 ?

[N i g e l]

A crumb of information.... Behringer Wave unboxed.

A Youtuber video, commenting on the Behringer bloke video, of unboxing a Wave.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=RRHEZWUGubY

Not my favourite channel (!), I dont know where the link to the original is,
skip to 3:45 if time [or patience] is short.

$899 is mentioned

[t-sun]

I've been looking forward to the Wave for a few years but $900 is an oof. Weird that the original video shown in that video no longer appears to be online.

[Arpangel]

Behringer seem to be living in a completely different space time continuum to what I'm used to, things mentioned months ago fail to appear, then out of the blue comes something completely unexpected, I think they have "burned down" this trend, and may fade into uninterested customer oblivion if they carry on like they are, there is a saturation point for any market.

[The Elf]

This recreation has been mentioned (and mock-ups shown) by Behringer on many occasions. Not my bag, but I know people who have been awaiting this one. I think the price is going to come as a shock this time, though.

[Drew Stephenson]

Even they aren't immune to the effects of a world-wide spike in inflation I guess.
It's hit everyone else so it was only a matter of time.

[Arpangel]

I think we should go back 50 years in terms of pricing, expensive instead if cheap.
One, it will increase perceived value, two, it will only be available those who really need it and are prepared to make the effort to get it, that aspect acts like a hardware A&R man.
It would be quite a novel situation, interesting how it would affect us, and music in general.
My guess is that it would kill hardware sales completely, and everyone would go in the box, or use a Yamaha PSS from the charity shop.

[N i g e l]

I reckon "gear inflation" in the '20s averages at 7%/yr, based on my limited number of purchases.

[tea for two]

Wish Uli would say % of gross from every berry knock oorrff Moog, ARP would go to Bob Moog Foundation and Alan R. Pearlman foundation.

A few years earlier Uli reportedly sent $200K to various music charities also reportedly sent Synths to underprivileged as it were schools.

[t-sun]

I think we should go back 50 years in terms of pricing, expensive instead if cheap.
One, it will increase perceived value, two, it will only be available those who really need it and are prepared to make the effort to get it, that aspect acts like a hardware A&R man.
It would be quite a novel situation, interesting how it would affect us, and music in general.
My guess is that it would kill hardware sales completely, and everyone would go in the box, or use a Yamaha PSS from the charity shop.

I don't know, that just seems like gatekeeping to me. I remember how hard it was to find equipment and any information at all about how to use it before the internet. I'd rather kids get in to hardware and understand the creative possibilities of physical control than just be stuck using software they increasingly have to rent instead of own.

[t-sun]

Wish Uli would say % of gross from every berry knock oorrff Moog, ARP would go to Bob Moog Foundation and Alan R. Pearlman foundation.

A few years earlier Uli reportedly sent $200K to various music charities also reportedly sent Synths to underprivileged as it were schools.

They also did a thing with the UB-Xa pricing where they asked buyers who may have set aside money for the original stated price to pay that price and the difference (I think it was $300?) would be donated to charity.

Apparently they regularly give away synths to underprivileged schools in areas where synths are hard to come by, afaik that's what happened to their remaining stock of MS-1 mk1s. Which is why they weren't available for a few years.

[BJG145]

I think we should go back 50 years in terms of pricing, expensive instead of cheap. One, it will increase perceived value, two, it will only be available to those who really need it and are prepared to make the effort to get it, that aspect acts like a hardware A&R man. It would be quite a novel situation, interesting how it would affect us, and music in general.

I don't think that's necessary. People will always want what they can't afford, and feel that it's the missing piece of their creative puzzle. Who knows, maybe it is. I know I need a glass armonica, for a start.

[resistorman]

I think we should go back 50 years in terms of pricing, expensive instead if cheap.
One, it will increase perceived value, two, it will only be available those who really need it and are prepared to make the effort to get it, that aspect acts like a hardware A&R man.
It would be quite a novel situation, interesting how it would affect us, and music in general.
My guess is that it would kill hardware sales completely, and everyone would go in the box, or use a Yamaha PSS from the charity shop.

I know it's only musing, but what an awful idea For one thing, you used to be able to make a reasonable living playing music even at the lowest rung on the ladder, so laying out big money for a Prophet 5 or DX7 in the 80's made sense. And if you want "perceived value" gatekeeping, it has already ruined the second hand market with stupidly inflated prices. Behringer's new prices are what used equipment prices should be in my own musings

[FrankF]

He called them 'people tainted by experience' — meaning those who refused to embrace his new practices...

It seems apposite here too...

What an unbelievably stupid thing to say. I guess you could say he and his minions were "poisoned by their own ignorance", or some such retort.

John Drummond (ex-BBC) has named his book after the quote:
https://www.amazon.co.uk/Tainted-Exper ... 057120922X