Techno production. Acoustic room treatment or a sub? Which would you prioritise?

[jellyjim]

I've committed to taking a deep dive into techno production this year with an aim to mastering it, or at least as much as you can in twelve months. As genres go it was always one of my first loves.

I'm happy with my monitors (Genelec 8330As) which I know well and I'm satisfied enough with my mixes in other genres. But techno is all about the detail and let's not forget the ubiquitous sub bass.

What would you prioritise? Acoustic treatment for my studio space (currently none) or a sub to nail the all important bottom end?

Just to caveat the former, my space isn't too bad. I find my mixes translate pretty well. The 8330As come with the mic doodad and room correction software which certainly helps. So it's not like my mixing environment is an absolute nightmare.

[Drew Stephenson]

Even given your caveats above, I still wouldn't advise putting a sub into an untreated room. Maybe a really nice pair of headphones instead? Or just carry on with the tools that you have and know well and treat yourself to a holiday?

[RichardT]

The 8330As seem to be flat only down to about 60Hz or so, with a -6dB point at 45Hz so you are not going to earth shaking bass out of them.

I honestly think for techno you are going to need both room treatment and a sub!

[jellyjim]

Yes I think both are ultimately necessary, and I guess they're actually different solutions to different problems, but I'm wondering which to do first as the cost will have to be staggered over some months.

Headphones is a good point. Are there headphones that reproduce sub frequencies in a meaningful way? My current pair are Shure SRH1840s. Great cans but they're open back so not ideal for bass accuracy.

It's not normally something I'd think about (sub bass) but it's particularly important for techno, especially the sub-genres that interest me. Gotta love those four to the floor 808/909 hybrid kicks with that continuous rolling sub bass rumble!

[RichardT]

I would treat the room first. That way, you can get used to how it sounds before getting a sub, and you’ll be saldé to test out a sub in a good environment.

[Sam Spoons]

I would definitely treat the room first, whatever the genre, and if it's a bass heavy genre that goes double. The difference it made to my studio was huge (and I still want to add some more). Once you hear the improvement you'll be a total convert.

[Zukan]

Mid and high frequencies can be better assessed in an 'average' room than low frequencies. Subs really need a well treated room to be most effective.

It's dance buddy, get those panels and traps up.

[tea for two]

I've committed to taking a deep dive into techno production this year with an aim to mastering it, or at least as much as you can in twelve months. As genres go it was always one of my first loves.

I'm happy with my monitors (Genelec 8330As) which I know well and I'm satisfied enough with my mixes in other genres. But techno is all about the detail and let's not forget the ubiquitous sub bass.

What would you prioritise? Acoustic treatment for my studio space (currently none) or a sub to nail the all important bottom end?

Just to caveat the former, my space isn't too bad. I find my mixes translate pretty well. The 8330As come with the mic doodad and room correction software which certainly helps. So it's not like my mixing environment is an absolute nightmare.

Lay down some reference tracks here JJ so I can get an idea of what you are aiming for. I properly dig some types of Techno even though nowadays my ears can't cope with the beats that much.

[SafeandSound Mastering]

To be a Master of a specific genre in 12 months (as in sounding as technically/musically/stylistically as good as major artists in the genre, cause that is what mastering a genre is.) is unlikely even in a well trated room and top grade monitoring.

Unless you make a track each month and work with progressive, detailed and iterative mistake identification and correction. (And then you will most likely go back to the first 6 tracks and accurately correct the errors as well if you think they are keepers.)

Techno is probably not quite as complex as some other dance genres but don't underestimate it. The techno artists I have worked here make very lush sounding mixes and that does not happen over night. Even if you go the presets route. (synths/kicks etc.) Though that will certainly speed things up, in fact for a 12 month target that will be nigh on essential.

^ That is a very worthy tip right there.

It took me 6 years to get top level sounding tracks in a very technical genre as an 'enjoyable' (it was often not enjoyable) pass time, and that was making a track about every 3-5 months.

And I have been working as a pro sound engineer for 2 decades plus.

Not to rain on the parade as you may have exceptional and natural talent but being realistic is also a good thing, just in case you are not.

All the best with it.

[jellyjim]

To be a Master of a specific genre in 12 months (as in sounding as technically/musically/stylistically as good as major artists in the genre, cause that is what mastering a genre is.) is unlikely even in a well trated room and top grade monitoring.

Lol. Well of course it is. I was being playful.

I've been performing and making music for 30+ years. Believe me, I know how deep the rabbit hole goes.

Not to rain on the parade as you may have exceptional and natural talent but being realistic is also a good thing, just in case you are not.

Don't worry there's normally somebody who comes along sooner or later who does, either that or is incredibly patronising

[SafeandSound Mastering]

You seem to have plenty of experience. I had the impression you were starting from scratch.

Sound advice for anyone who wants to fast track in a genre is to find quality synth presets for synths you own, for said genre, if dance music use kick samples and snares/claps (For kicks this is a quick but sometimes limited way, ultimately as they are not as flexible as using a Kick synth.)

When I learnt the genre I did it was without question that I wanted to learn the synthesis for every well known sound the genre uses.

I always synthesized every kick and bass line (commonly not for this genre as it is very difficult to do it well, technically vs groove. Often included using an oscilloscope to phase align components of the kick and bass.) So all the synth sounds in tracks are made by myself, all kicks and often snares.

This was not a small undertaking as you often did not know what synth was best at making any given sound. So you would work out to how to make it on one synth and then recreate it on other synths to see if it did it better.

This very morning I am considering what it takes to hit the mark of the best in a genre.

Technical
Production
Mixing
Composition

Each one a skillset in itself, and they are somewhat interdependent on each other, yet seperate.

And mastering which is often handed over of course.

All of those have to be top level to match the best.

That's a marathon not a sprint, unless for some reason you have exceptional abilities in all areas.

And by the way treat the room first, then get the sub.

This is where I ended up after about 5-6 years (about 16 tracks made this was track 16, something like that.) and what I feel hits the technical mark, musically of course is subjective. Not so far away from techno actually.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=eVzVirUoLx0

Check the video description for further info on how to complete tracks.

Completing tracks is absolutely paramount to improving as an artist. It is extremely easy to end up with a bunch of incomplete loops on a drive.

Until complete they are just ideas and not much use to yourself or a label to promote.

By having only hard drive loops you do not get experience in every aspect, you need to learn successfully all the skills to produce completed tracks which every single big artist in every genre always does !

All the best, just keep going at it with a serious intent on improvement. Another tip take lots of written notes, take time, pause and reflect, frequently.