Roland HD-1 stupid pedals

[mellowsouls]

I was recently given an old Roland HD-1 electric kit by a friend as a thank you for doing some mastering for them. Nice!

The pedals are both suffering from a stiffening of the rubber actuators (not sure of the correct name), so will need replacing. Looks like they’ve been done by a previous owner once already.

Got to wondering if it was in any way possible to somehow modify the wiring to allow for the use of a standard piezo-based pad, instead of the resistance-based standard thing. I have spare piezo pads that I made a few years ago, and a pedal from my acoustic kit to use with them.

A search ont’ net didn't turn up anything, but it’s got to be possible, right?

[Sam Spoons]

I've used piezo triggers on a Roland brain (a TD-3 and I can't remember if I had a more sophisticated one after it) using a standard kit with mesh heads. Seemed to work ok. Why not just try it if you've got the brain and the triggers?

[mellowsouls]

Yep. Already tried it. Don’t work. I’ve read it’s a different type of sensor in the pedal (and therefore a different way of processing the signal in the brain) than the usual piezo-based stuff. The snare/toms/cymbals are piezo, but not the stupid pedals.

The optimist in me believes there is some simple set of instructions a clever person can provide me, and I can get busy with a soldering iron and make it work.

Guessing it would have been done by now if it were possible, and I’d find it on a web search.

[Sam Spoons]

Sorry, I misread your post, we didn't use the Roland kick pedal but an acoustic kick drum (mesh head) with a piezo sensor which worked fine on our old V-Drum brain. Hope you find a solution, if you do report back as somebody with the same problem may find this thread in the future.

[Wonks]

I found this

https://jonbondy.wordpress.com/2012/01/ ... land-hd-1/

I don't know if the hd-1 pedals are velocity sensitive, but the chap above just used a contact switch to trigger the kick drum.

[Wonks]

One option is to ditch the hd-1 brain and get a used Roland drum brain from another kit that uses all-piezo inputs. You can get a TD6 brain for around £80. I had a TD6 kit for a while in a failed attempt to learn to drum and that sounded pretty good (though I got a mesh head snare to replace the standard rubber pad).

I don't know if the HD-1 brain has fixed leads but the pads must still connect via standard TS or TRS leads (for single or dual-zone pads respectively).

Then you can use standard piezo kick and high-hat triggers.

Or trigger sounds over MIDI from the HD-1 to another drum brain (less kick and hats + hat pedal), and plug piezo kick and hat/hat pedals into the new drum brain as well as your existing piezo pads for even more drum sounds.

But given that you can get decent used Roland kits for £200ish, I'd probably think about whether persevering with the HD-1 is worthwhile if you do think about a new brain.

[mellowsouls]

Thanks Wonks! Yeah, I don’t want to spend money on it, just wanted to use what I have. I should be saving my pennies to finish the room to put my acoustic kit in!

The HD1 pedals are velocity sensitive, and I can pull the TS jack out the back, but the way the brain deals with the signal is different to a piezo signal, so plugging something sensible in doesn’t work.

I think I’ll just pull it apart and play with wires for a bit to see what happens. I will certainly update if successful.

[Folderol]

Are these the small pads with {sort of} two nobbles?
If so, carefully removing them, cleaning them (and the contact points) with a mild alcohol solution often works.

[mellowsouls]

I’ve had them apart and cleaned them. Seems the issue is a common one - the rubber springs that sit between the underside of the pedal and the flat sensor harden over time. A new set would only be £20, but I just thought it might be more fun to find some way of interfacing some piezo pads. I could then use an actual bass drum pedal, which would feel better.

[Wonks]

There are quite a few videos on YouTube about fixing the HD1 pedals. Using silicone grease (to stop them drying out) and gently warming them up with a hairdryer to restore flexibility seems to be a common theme.

[Wonks]

But you could try out a force sensitive resistor and see if that triggers the kick.

Something like this:

https://uk.rs-online.com/web/p/sensor-d ... ls/2883672

(Others are available, that was selected at random).

Not too expensive so it's worth giving it a go. You could plug in a TS-TS to the existing pedal and measure the resistance to see if it's open circuit until pressed, and then what sort of resistance you get, or whether it's always resistive but that changes with pressure.

[mellowsouls]

Now that is interesting. Also sort of explains how it already works. I have an idea, but cannot action it til this eve…

[Wonks]

It looks like you might be able to replace a piezo sensor with one of those, though you may have to stick some thin backing on it to make it as thick for a drop-in replacement.

[mellowsouls]

Wonks, this is exactly the sort of thing I came here for - Thank you!

The online fixes are all temporary, and would only return the pedal to its former self for a couple of years. It lacks the feel of a real pedal even when working correctly. Hence my musings.

I plan to crack open the kick pedal, plug it in and whack the sensor with a drum mallet to see if it responds. I suspect it will. I will also measure its resistance.

Two options then;
1. purchase one of those pads you linked and stick it to the old pad I have in a box somewhere, or
2. butcher the current pedal and utilise the sensor with the old pad I have in a box somewhere.

Option 2 is greener, right?

[Wonks]

You can try option 2 first and if that fails or proves impossible to take apart without destroying the whole thing, try option 1. At least there is a plan B!

I'm sure you'll need to provide some protection for any sensor for long-term use. But the current pedal should give you a clue as to the type and how much is required.

[mellowsouls]

Right. The sensor is linear in shape, and volume is determined by how much of the correspondingly shaped rubber bit touches the sensor. When tapping it directly, I can only get full volume. Hmm. Think the thing to do is get one of those circular sensors, and experiment with coverings.

[mellowsouls]

Still waiting for the sensor to turn up…

So nice to be able to play again, even if half the BD hits are missing! . Will be great if/when it’s fixed up.

[Philbo King]

I had the same problem. First I slit the old rubber 6 or 7 times to make it more bendable, but after fighting it for a while I just bought a new HH pedal.

[mellowsouls]

Yeah, I’ve performed minor surgery with a scalpel too! Might spring for a new set of rubbers at some point.

I’m an eternal tinkerer though, so going to give my alternative (and significantly cheaper) way a go first. Will be nice if I can integrate a proper pedal.

The sensor I ordered is apparently now in the UK. Waiting patiently for Mr Postman…

[mellowsouls]

It lives! Bought one of these (other sensors and vendors are available);

https://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/387561774068 ... media=COPY

£5.72, a kick pedal I already had, a few bits of wood to make a stand for the sensor and pedal, and I’m away!

Thanks to Wonks for the pointer.

Will pop some images of my cheapo bodge up in a bit.

[Wonks]

[mellowsouls]

https://imgur.com/gallery/new-pedal-roland-hd1-4o8Xnel

Edit: I still don’t get how to share images here

[Sam Spoons]

Nice job on the kick sensor #mellowsouls

Maybe it's time to resurrect my SPD-S drum pad rig.

Re sharing images :- https://www.soundonsound.com/forum/view ... hp?t=75253

[zenguitar]

I've added the image in question to the OP's post.

You made two errors. First, you linked to the gallery page rather than the image itself. And you failed to use the phpBB Image tags to tell the forum you were posting an image rather than a link to a web page.

Andy

[mellowsouls]

Thanks both - will try harder next time!

Been playing this kit a lot! Need to experiment with coverings as it’s a bit too sensitive as-is. Maybe a simple thin patch of rubber to absorb some excess energy will do it…