I've been struggling with mouth noises and wondering if there's a solution...?

[Mangangan]

I am 18M and struggling with mouth sounds. Clicking, lip smacking, you name it, it's a problem for me. I've been trying to find a solution for some time now, and I've read about as much advice as you can possibly read; to no avail. I've tried different pronunciation, microphones, microphone positions, changing gain level, hydrating, and de-clicking programs like RX by IZotope. None of these things seem to help dramatically.

The best help has been IZotope, but even that has its problems. If I set the settings too high, then my voice sounds robotic and certain letters like K's, B's and D's are barely audible when I'm speaking. This is also a problem no matter where I place the frequency skew. On the contrary, if I set the settings too low, then my voice is super clicky and it seems like the software does nothing. Plus no matter the settings, IZotope doesn't seem to fix all the mouth sounds, only the clicks in particular. I have yet to find a middle ground with the settings that work. It seems like I have no choice but to either eviscerate my audio quality to remove clicks, or just live with the clicks. Seems like my voice is just the right frequency that the software has to cut out my voice to get rid of the clicks.

My mouth sounds range in frequency, so it's hard for the program to pick up on all of them. Sometimes they're high pitched, other times low pitched. It feels like no matter what I do, I have bad audio, and it's getting frustrating since if I didn't have these mouth sounds, I'd be perfectly happy with my audio. They aren't that bad, but I just feel like mine are worse than most people's and I'm not sure why. Do some people just have naturally noisier mouths? Or is there just some secret I'm not being told about?
So is there anyway to fix these clicks? Or a certain way to make IZotope actually work properly with my voice? Thanks in advance everyone!

[amanise]

I'd start with the simpler things before diving into corrective tech solutions. Not very exciting, but the less you're having to correct the better. For you, I'd advocate taking anything signal enhancing like compressors out of the signal path leaving just a mic and interface, and then focusing on mic technique. Forget everything else, for a while anyway. The cleaner you can get the simplest setup, the better. Then when you can't improve from there any more, turn to the tech. Try a few different mics along the way, if you can. There'll be one out there that suits you best. There's been loads of mic shoot outs on here and in the mag. But do persevere, the results will be well worth it.

[Hugh Robjohns]

Yes, some people have noisier mouths...

But a lot of the problem can be minimised, if not corrected, by good vocal technique, and for that I'd recommend working with a good vocal coach.

After that, mic technique is very important and, again, a good vocal coach can help with that.

The next most important factors are the placement of the mic and the choice of mic, followed by the signal processing chain — heavy compression will obviously make matters worse.

But fundamentally, the problem is working too close to the mic... so take a step back... and if it then sounds too 'roomy' sort out the room acoustics.

You say you've tried different mics and different positions, but have given no details... so its impossible to suggest improvements. However, given your description you might find good dynamic, like the Shure SM7B a better choice than a bright capacitor mic, or you might find moving the mic up to forehead height helps.

And finally.... it might just be that the recording is actually fine and you're just hypersensitive to it. Post an a link to an example and let the more experienced here offer their constructive feedback.

[SafeandSound Mastering]

Hugh has mentioned a lot of good points. RX should be able to make quite a big difference. RX has to be set up though per click for good results, there are 2 options for clicks if I recall correctly. I have very rarely blanket de-clicked anything. It's 99pct of the time, 1 by 1. That can be a quite lot of work.

And sometimes that is what it takes, a lot of work.

Do not drink milky drinks before any takes, you could try brushing teeth, rinsing very well and then drinking room temp water before the take. I have heard some broadcast presenters produce a lot of clicks, it is not just singing performances.

It is quite common so please do not get a complex about it, many vocalists have a quite extraordinary amount of clicks that are at the starts end or in or between words. Some are very gaspy, some very pop-py as well again editing and clip based attenuation helps a lot. Great vocals can still result.

It is an audio engineers job to hear and rectify as best as possible. If you are mixing, you have elected for it to be your job. It is surprising how many can get through to mastering as well.

Just purely for a test put your existing mic directly 90 degrees off axis (towards the crease of your lips) but as close as is practically possible, the tone will change a lot but most probably so will the mouth sounds as they are often high frequencies which are very directional. (You are also unlikely to need a pop shield.)

All the best with it, it is rarely insurmountable. A mic change is fairly big change for your vocal tone so it has potential down side but maybe you can find the perfect vocal mic in that process.

[Mangangan]

Currently using the SM7B, but I've tried condensers too. Same issue no matter what mic I've tried. I'd love to try even more mics, but unfortunately can't be shelling out money for a bunch of new mics. I'm not really in a position to set up full room acoustics, and the acoustics aren't terrible, but its a noticeable downgrade in quality if I'm too far from the microphone. But to elaborate a bit, I've tried further distance from the microphone, angling the microphone away from my mouth, raising it above my mouth, moving it to the side of my mouth rather than directly in front, etc. I've tried a ton of different positions and distances; all with the same result.

I seem to notice the clicks no matter whether I apply effects or none at all, but I do wonder if maybe using things like compressors and limiters are amplifying the problem? However, the SM7B seems to have pretty low gain output, so I kinda have to use those things to get my microphone to a reasonable volume without clipping. Should I invest in a cloudlifter or something like that to increase my volume naturally without relying on effects? I'm not very knowledgeable on audio, but I do wonder if that could be my issue. However, I've had this issue regardless of what effects I apply (or none at all), so I'm not 100% sure.

Chances are I'm just hypersensitive to it, but what really bothers me is that when I'm listening to anybody else, I very rarely notice clicks even when I'm intentionally trying to hear them in other people's audio. It's super noticeable in my audio though.

I don't drink caffeine, soda, or have any dairy products, yet still have the issue. I have tried brushing my teeth prior to recording and I drink atleast 40 oz of water daily, and occasionally drink room-temp water while recording.

[Hugh Robjohns]

I can't add anything more than I've already said.

You might well get an improvement by working with a vocal coach to improve your singing technique.

You'll definitely get an improvement by working further away from the mic, and by moving the mic away from on-axis to the mouth... but both require good room acoustics, so you'd need to invest in room treatment.

Compression and limiting will inherently make low level mouth noises worse.

The sm7b is well known for its very low output level. A cloudlifter or equivalent will help a lot if your preamp/ interface is struggling.

Some people naturally have noisy mouths, just like some people can't play guitar (despite their best efforts).

It's quite likely you've become over sensitive to the issue which isn't really a problem at all... Post a link to an example and let the experienced ears here judge.

[Mangangan]

I can't provide recordings since I'm not home right now, but I may try to do that soon when I'm back.

I have a feeling room treatment is the way to go, but that's just not possible for me right now unfortunately. Might give a cloudlifter a shot though, doubt it'll fix anything though. Probably just me being oversensitive to my own work though, but I have tried occasionally to listen to other people's voiceovers/songs just to hear if there's mouth clicks, yet there usually never is; and if there are, it's usually a very miniscule amount.

Thanks for your advice and I understand if you have nothing else to add, I just appreciate you taking time to try and help. Unfortunately though this just seems like something I'll have to deal with.

[amanise]

Hugh and SafeandSound have really nailed it here quite comprehensively. You probably are also being hypercritical as well. We all hear our own voices very differently to how others hear them. especially things like perceived tonal nasties and noises like sibilants etc.

But - from experience - I'm willing to bet a fiver that there's a compressor that needs dialling back a bit during the initial capture. It's really easy to overdo the initial compression settings, and end up with enhanced clicks and esses etc as well as the good stuff you want to keep.

[MOF]

Have you tried a more ‘old school’ microphone position, from above as opposed to level with the mouth?
That way will give you more of the chest, head and projected vocal sound and less of the nasal and mouth interior sounds.

[Mike Senior]

This is something I usually do my best to minimise while recording if I can, and have found that sipping water with a bit of powdered Vitamin C in it works particularly well.

[Hugh Robjohns]

That's genius! Thank you Mike.

...and it might also explain the slice of lemon in Sir David Attenborough's water glass when I sat in on a V/O session years back.

I just thought the studio assistant was trying to be posh!

[Drew Stephenson]

And I'm glad the scurvy's clearing up nicely.

[tacitus]

If it’s very noticeable, have others said so? And if it is, can you not capitalise on it? We all strive for perfection, but most instantly recognisable voices aren’t like the masses. As you would expect after a moment’s thought.

Consider how hard it is for a tribute band to emulate their target. Much, much easier to go your own way than to try to sound like another star. Maybe you could record something live, unprocessed, you doing what you do and somebody else twiddling the knobs on your gear. Just to get an idea of how you sound. Then get opinions on that.

I hate my voice recorded, and avoid it as far as possible. But others have been captivated by it. I agree with the possibility you’re extra sensitive to the sound of your own voice, like me. But I suppose we all must get used to it eventually, even if I’m doing my best to die first. It sounds as if you’ve played around with enough options to be sure this is mostly how you sound (but not forgetting the solid advice to root out compressors and limiters when tracking). If it’s not your voice, 10 to 1 it’ll be something stupid you’re convinced isn’t even happening when you track.

[hz37]

I think it would be easier to suggest solutions if we had a bit of audio to listen to. Myself, I have a weird voice, but I actually host a popular podcast and do the occasional voice work for paying customers. As someone who has been talking in microphones my whole life for over 50 years now, I can offer a few suggestions:

- Earlier in this thread someone opted against blanket processing with Izotope RX Mouth De-click. But do know you can use Izotope RX Mouth De-click as an insert effect in real time. We (me and colleagues in post production audio) do this a lot with very good results. I add Mouth De-click when people have excessive mouth noises. For the occasional mouth click I do offline select-and-render AudioSuite processing with the offending bit of voice recording.

- I own more microphones than one person should be allowed to have. For my own podcast weekly babble about astronomy I first used expensive condenser microphones, like my beloved Townsend Labs mic. But more and more I go back to a Shure SM58 or a Sennheiser e945 for voice recordings, also when I record clients externally. The SM7B is also a favorite, but I don't own one yet. It appears to me that the condensers are often times more unforgiving and record more detail than needed. You could experiment with that too.

- Plosives can also really ruin a recording, but you can tame these very well. I record myself with both a plop-cap and a plop-shield. Plop-caps are practically free and brands like SE have great plop-shields. Even then, I almost always process my voice recordings with RX Izotope De-plosive. But not at its default 200 Hz, which makes the recordings way too thin. Something like 90 Hz works very well.

- It is useless recording when one is tense, tired or stressed out. I love recording myself at the end of the day, when the wife and my daughter are already sleeping. By then, the stress of the day is pretty much over and everything gets nice and quiet. My voice is also relaxed and "trained" from speaking all day. It is very important to find the right time of day to record.

- Microphone usage/positioning and body posture also make all the difference in the world. Most of my outside work involves recording voice-overs with Neumann TLM microphones. This is of course a workhorse microphone, but there are huge differences in how good or bad people sound. That's mostly a matter of microphone usage/positioning and body posture. Experiment with how you sit behind the microphone. Talking straight into the diaphragm is less optimal than talking sideways over the mic.

- You can get someone to do vocal coaching. I have heard remarkable improvements when voice-overs had a bit of training. There are experienced voice actors who can hear how we are mistreating our vocal cords or wrecking our nerves before recording. When I do voice recordings and people tend to smack a lot, it's usually just nerves. When we're nervous, the body goes into survival mode and reduces saliva, because you don't need to digest food when you're chased by a black panther. I usually let people talk a bit about how their day went, have them drink a bit of water and then the smacking is usually gone or very much reduced.

Good luck!

Hens Zimmerman

[alexis]

Thanks, Hens, for the wonderful post!

...
- Plosives can also really ruin a recording, but you can tame these very well. I record myself with both a plop-cap and a plop-shield. Plop-caps are practically free and brands like SE have great plop-shields....

I wasn't able to find anything about plosive caps on DuckDuckGo ... can you explain a bit please?

Thank you!

[hz37]

Sure. I mean both a cap like this one:



https://www.thomann.de/nl/shure_a58ws_bk.htm

And a filter like this one:



https://www.bax-shop.nl/microfoon-popfi ... -popfilter

[Hugh Robjohns]

Ah, thanks for the clarification. Plop cap had my eyebrows raised too!

I think most native English speakers would refer to the first as a foam wind-shield or foam pop-shield, and the second as a wind-screen or pop-screen.... although these terms are not hard and fast.

But plop cap is a new one on me!

[ManFromGlass]

Good one!
Reminds me of how various cultures describe the exact same sound - like the sound a chicken or dog make.
I find all that fascinating.