Microphone recommendations

[Rob Collins]

I've just purchased a Sound Devices MixPre 6 II with the view to record various sounds (both indoors and out) for foley and sample instruments.

I have some nice mics for recording instruments such as a MG M300 and M930TS and a Crowley and Tripps Naked Eye.

Im looking for a mic (or possibly a stereo pair) suitable for outdoors to capture natural sounds and ambience that could also double up as something suitable for outdoor dialogue work.

I'm thinking along the lines of a shotgun type such as the Sennheiser MKH416 but am wondering if people use 2 of these as a stereo pair when capturing suitable material

Any recommendations welcome !

[zenguitar]

As an alternative you might want to consider something like the DPA 4060 Stereo kit. A pair of miniature omni's with an assortment of mounting options.

https://pinknoise-systems.co.uk/product ... 0-smk-core

And I recall Hugh posting pics of a pair of these mounted on a repurposed stereo antenna assembly with wind screens as a highly portable option.

A lot of flexibility on offer that would give you a lot of options.

Andy

[Drew Stephenson]

Possibly the fig 8 version of the Sennheiser MKH series to with the shotgun for an M/S array?
I'm not sure how tonally consistent they are though.

[ghellquist]

Congratulations on a new and rewarding hobby. Can become expensive though, and you probably already know that. But my thoughts here are free, and probably worth as much.

You can use about any mic outdoors. A bit unpractible to use a mains powered tube mic though, but apart from that anything works. Generally outdoor sounds tends to be quiet so a low noise floor tends to help. As the mic will subject to environment it is good if it is resistant and you will want to protect it from wind noise using a blimp or similar, typically a Rycote although there are many alternatives.

Personally, I have always liked the Sennheiser MKH40 (for mid) and MKH30 (for S signal). The modern version is MKH8040 + MKH8030. On the expensive side though, but will last your lifetime and more. Stereo MKH416 - never seen that and quite a bit suspicious.

Advice might be to get one mic, any really, and wind protection. Go out there and record and learn from mistakes (only way is to make a lot of them).

[Hugh Robjohns]

Andy is quite right. I use the DPA 4060 core a lot for general outdoor ambient recording, either onto a Nagra VI or a Zoom F8npro.

And the details of my really effective telescopic aerial mount are described in this review too:

https://www.soundonsound.com/reviews/dp ... -4060-core

For outdoor voice work, or where I want a more focused sound, I now use Rode NTG5s. Rode essentially reverse-engineered the Sennheiser MKH416 to make their NTG3, and then re-engineered the NTG3 to make the superior NTG5. It's an amazingly effective and affordable short shotgun mic.

https://www.soundonsound.com/reviews/rode-ntg5

You can use two NTG5s for stereo in a static location if you mount them in a wide V shape, but that's not really workable on the move. So for mobile stereo in the field I use a Sennheiser combo of MKH40 (or 50) with an MKH30 in a Mid-Sides array, contained within a Rycote Cyclone windshield. It's not too heavy or bulky and does an excellent job, even in windy conditions.

The MKH20/30/40/50 are obsolete now, replaced by the smaller 8000 series, but they still pop up on second-hand sites (try BBlist.co.uk). And there are plenty of alternative mics as well as alternatives to Rycote windshields, of course. But good windshielding is vital...

Hope that helps.

[Rob Collins]

Thank you for your responses....

I will have a look at the Rode and DPA mics.

I've got the chance to use a Sennheiser MKH416 for the next few days so i will give that a go.

I appreciate some of the mics mentioned aren't cheap, but i also realise that getting a good one / ones will serve me well for years to come - both my Microtech Gefell mic purchases were made off the back of Hugh's reviews and don't regret purchasing them for a second !

[Studio Support Gnome]

I like the Sennheiser’s for out door work Being RF rather than AF condensers they’re more tolerant of moisture/humidity , well made , robustly reliable and with high quality audio performance makes them a sound choice for the mobile sound recordist

Pun entirely intended

I’m less happy about using shotguns in stereo pairs , the colouration inherent in achieving shotgun pickup pattern by physical design is not usually kind to the goal of stable and spectrally neutral stereo image

An M/S array is a solidly practical way forward , it’s compact and practical to mount in a hand held suspension system

Couple of alternatives though , just for variety , I present you rabbit holes to go down and explore

maybe a single mic multi capsule surround format ?
Something like the core sound tetramic , its relatively small , light Although less robust and more environmentally sensitive.

Or the other end of that idea , the Xylia pro multi capsule surround mic . Ludicrously impressive ability to separate out sources ,

Bit more cumbersome than either the tetra or MS array

[jimjazzdad]

Roland Harris (can't remember his forum handle - norfolksoundman?) discusses outdoor recording and reviews various mics and wind protection on his blog https://drbadphil.com/. A great resource.

[Bob Bickerton]

I have a portable rig for recording stereo outdoor ambience and these days pretty much use A/B Omnis @ 400mm for most things. So in terms of microphones, I have a pair of MKH 8020s for critical or commercial work, which deliver an excellent sound (and have many other uses in the studio or for concert recording), but I also have a pair of Immersive Sounscapes Earsight Thumb microphones which are a fiftieth of the price of the 8020s, which I pop in the bag when I'm trekking and I don't want to take the 8020s out.

The Earsights have pretty low noise at -14dBA and a sensitivity of -24 dB and I'm really quite enjoying them. Sure, they're not as neutral as the 8020s, but they're still pretty good and workable in most situations. I'd certainly recommend them.

They also have other products, so check out: https://immersivesoundscapes.com/earsig ... -straight/

I'm considering a pair of their Nano2s and rigging them using Hugh's TV aerial method for a more portable rig still. With self noise of -17dBA they're quieter than the 4060s. At just 100 euro a pair what's not to like.

Bob

[Arpangel]

Possibly the fig 8 version of the Sennheiser MKH series to with the shotgun for an M/S array?
I'm not sure how tonally consistent they are though.

I use MKH30/40, never noticed any tonal variations, but I am 70, all I know is that they are a very compact convenient solution.

[Hugh Robjohns]

Possibly the fig 8 version of the Sennheiser MKH series to with the shotgun for an M/S array?
I'm not sure how tonally consistent they are though.

The main issue is not the fig-8 capsule but the inherently dodgy polar response of the shotgun mic which typically varies dramatically at different frequencies, with substantial sensitivity peaks and dips at different angles and frequencies.

This wild off-axis variation doesn't matter too much when you're only interested in the on-axis voices on a film set. But stereo imaging is all about the off-axis consistency, and that's usually pretty poor and very coloured-sounding on most shotgun mics.

So stereo with shotgun mics is usually only done in extreme situations where there are no other practical alternatives, rather than as a preferred high-quality technique.

And while mounting a fig-8 capsule on a shotgun for Mid-Sides stereo is certainly doable and is done (I've used that technique myself), it doesn't solve the off-axis colouration problem and the stereo imaging is more of an unstable ambient effect than accurate, stable source location!

Nevertheless, if you want to go down that route, its worth considering the Sennheiser MKH418S which is essentially an MKH416 with a fig-8 capsule built-in to give a Mid-Sides stereo output. The upside is that it's a very convenient and practical package that fits into standard windshield system and gives a usable stereo effect...

https://www.sennheiser.com/en-gb/catalo ... s/mkh-418/

[R_A]

A sound recordist that I collaborate with has the following kit:

Microphones:
DPA SMK4060 omni directional microphones
Sennheiser AMBEO Ambisonic 4 channel microphone
Sennheiser MKH 416 shotgun microphone
JRF C-Series contact microphones
JRF C-Series hydrophones
Telinga Universal Mk2 Parabolic

Sound recorders:
Sonosax SX-R4+ Multitrack Recorder
Sound Devices 744

He gets excellent results.

[Rob Collins]

A sound recordist that I collaborate with has the following kit:

Microphones:
DPA SMK4060 omni directional microphones
Sennheiser AMBEO Ambisonic 4 channel microphone
Sennheiser MKH 416 shotgun microphone
JRF C-Series contact microphones
JRF C-Series hydrophones
Telinga Universal Mk2 Parabolic

Sound recorders:
Sonosax SX-R4+ Multitrack Recorder
Sound Devices 744

He gets excellent results.

I saw the Sennheiser Ambeo VR mic on their website and was curious - the Mixpre has an optional plugin that could be used with mic to record the 4 channels correctly

I'm wondering if the 4 channels could later on be 'collapsed' to stereo if needed with an audio editor such as Steinberg's Wavelab

Just a thought

[Wonks]

With the right software, you can ‘collapse’ the recording to any pattern you want, even custom ones.

And with multiple instances of the recording, you can pick out individual sounds (within reason) for each instance.

[Hugh Robjohns]

There are loads of ambisonic decoder plugins. Some free (like the Soundfield and Ambeo plugins) and some paid (Harpex, Audio Brewers, VVEncode, Blue Ripple...etc). I think Reaper has one included in its own plugin collection.

The facilities and usability vary between them, but most can accept A-format or B-format (FuMa or Ambix) inputs and generate stereo or various multichannel surround/immersive outputs.

...and there are alternatives to the Ambeo, too, including the Rode NT-SF1, Core Audio Tetramic and Zoom VR360.

[James Perrett]

There are loads of ambisonic decoder plugins... I think Reaper has one included in its own plugin collection.

You had me intrigued there Hugh because I hadn't seen one. A quick search led me to

https://www.ambisonictoolkit.net/documentation/reaper/

which also appears to be able to decode UHJ recordings. Now I'm wondering if it will work on the old Alan Freeman sessions that I recorded which were apparently using the BBC's Matrix H system.

[Drew Stephenson]

Possibly the fig 8 version of the Sennheiser MKH series to with the shotgun for an M/S array?
I'm not sure how tonally consistent they are though.

The main issue is not the fig-8 capsule but the inherently dodgy polar response of the shotgun mic which typically varies dramatically at different frequencies, with substantial sensitivity peaks and dips at different angles and frequencies.

This wild off-axis variation doesn't matter too much when you're only interested in the on-axis voices on a film set. But stereo imaging is all about the off-axis consistency, and that's usually pretty poor and very coloured-sounding on most shotgun mics.

Thanks Hugh!

[Hugh Robjohns]

A quick search led me to

https://www.ambisonictoolkit.net/documentation/reaper/

which also appears to be able to decode UHJ recordings. Now I'm wondering if it will work on the old Alan Freeman sessions that I recorded which were apparently using the BBC's Matrix H system.

Worth a try...

I'm not clued up on the fine detail of the encode/decode matrix parameters, but I do remember the history of Matrix H because I was fascinated by it at the time. It was similar in concept to the Samsung QS quadraphonic format.

The BBC's R&D report 1977/02 covers the Matrix H system in detail:

http://downloads.bbc.co.uk/rd/pubs/reports/1977‐02.pdf

And there's a good description of Matrix H in Wireless World magazine (May 1977, page 41) also written by the same BBC R&D guys.

https://www.worldradiohistory.com/UK/Wi ... -S-OCR.pdf

UHJ was a later development from Matrix H, where the Beeb first got together with the NRDC (who developed Ambisonics with German and Craven) to include their 45J system, resulting in Matrix HJ.

Subsequently, the Nippon-Columbia UD-4/UMX system was blended in too, resulting in the final stereo-compatible UHJ format which has persisted to this day.

As I say, I dont know the inner detail, but I think the J45 and UMX systems used slightly different matrix coefficients and filter parameters, so a UHJ decoder is likely to give slightly different sound locations (and tonal quality) than an original BBC Matrix H decoder. I doubt it would be significant or problematic, though.

[Tomás Mulcahy]

I have a portable rig for recording stereo outdoor ambience and these days pretty much use A/B Omnis @ 400mm for most things.

Pretty much the same here, closer to 300mm because that is as wide as I can get the mics in my budget Pro Aim blip. It's intended for shotgun but I just use it sideways.

Probably not what the OP wants- all budget gear here!
Pro Aim blimp
Tascam DR60Dii
Naiant MSH1 omni (tiny, 20 years old)
Innercore parabolic with Sony ECM 717 stereo mic

My biggest issue was finding a rainproof bag for the Tascam, ended up trying a few cheap "fannypacks" from Amazon before finding the right size. The Pro Aim is quite light, I would not like to rely on it for pro work.

[R_A]

A sound recordist that I collaborate with has the following kit:

Microphones:
DPA SMK4060 omni directional microphones
Sennheiser AMBEO Ambisonic 4 channel microphone
Sennheiser MKH 416 shotgun microphone
JRF C-Series contact microphones
JRF C-Series hydrophones
Telinga Universal Mk2 Parabolic

Sound recorders:
Sonosax SX-R4+ Multitrack Recorder
Sound Devices 744

He gets excellent results.

I saw the Sennheiser Ambeo VR mic on their website and was curious - the Mixpre has an optional plugin that could be used with mic to record the 4 channels correctly

I'm wondering if the 4 channels could later on be 'collapsed' to stereo if needed with an audio editor such as Steinberg's Wavelab

Just a thought

Defo

Software-wise he uses:

Envelop - Ambisonic
iZotope RX
Harpex

Mostly uses REAPER as his DAW though also Ableton Live and I think Pro-Tools (if he absolutely has to).

[Rob Collins]

After some further homework, i have decided on giving the Sennheiser MKH8018 mic a try !