New Hydrasynth Models

[N i g e l]

Dont count your Hydrasynths before the're delivered ! - what with the global shipping situation and everything.

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I was thinking that the Prologue exists in 2 models, as 16 or 8 voices and is bi-timbral, so why not the Hydrasynth ?

[Eddy Deegan]

Also Novation with the Summit, which is basically 2 Peaks in a single instrument with some additional controls for splits/layering and edit modes for one, other or both of them.

The use of different coloured LEDs on the interface to let you know which mode you're in works really well in the Summit and makes perfect sense for the Hydrasynth.

I also like that the patches on the Deluxe are fully compatible with the original Hydrasynth and the ability to straightforwardly mix-n-match any two of them on the Deluxe is very elegant.

[The Elf]

I was thinking that the Prologue exists in 2 models, as 16 or 8 voices and is bi-timbral, so why not the Hydrasynth ?

Maybe you're right. But I doubt it. As above - Peak and Summit are a good example.

[tea for two]

Dear Ashun and Glen see this, just making it into a
Sampling Workstation

with
*10inch Touchscreen, Vocoder, Quality Dual Combo inputs (xlr and trs), Balanced outputs, Usb out.
*Keeping it Battery powered and Usb portable battery powered.
*Keeping PolyAT. Keeping 37keys.
*Enabling recording on a separate internal  tiny 1TB m.2 ssd that's easily replaceable.
*Sound import via Usb and Sd card and saving to them.
*Adding Korg Kaoss Mini style dynamic processing pad.

(Removing Synth engine frees up enough associated real estate).

Dear Ashun and Glen, I get the feelz it would sell as Hot Cakes amongst DJs EDM, HipHop producers, Beatz makerz, YouTube musicians, Electronic musicians, Musicians on the go in several genres.
Freeing them up from Macbook, current MPC, Laptop.
Freeing them up from having to carry several gear.

As you are aware, no manufacturer has done this. I've been waiting since Korg MicroSampler (2009).

Tech wasn't ready before, it is ready now.

It is such an obvious product yet
It would unique.

It takes a smaller company as yourselves to be innovative Dear Ashun and Glen.

[N i g e l]

I was thinking that the Prologue exists in 2 models, as 16 or 8 voices and is bi-timbral, so why not the Hydrasynth ?

Maybe you're right. But I doubt it. As above - Peak and Summit are a good example.

Im not saying right or wrong - Im just guessing whats possible from an uninformed {but perhaps logical?} standpoint.

The 'logue voice cards are 4 voices per card {bi-timbral},
the blofeld is just 1 DSP to do everything {16 timbral},
Ion/Micron/Miniak are 1 special chip per voice {8 timbral}

those facilities do the hard graft of generating sound but milti timbrailty, the act of setting up different sets of synth parameters, recognising MIDI/kb zones and allocating notes to voices seems a less onerus & time consuming task by comparison.

I note that the Hydrasynth16 has buttons for multi mode, which is nice & elegant. I was thinking of a work flow more like the Prologue, which achieves bi-timbrailty via the sub menus of the buttons that have no legend*.

thinking about that, it may be that ASM dont want such an inscrutable asthetic.

*mine has got appropriately annotated mixer scribble strip console tape.

[t-sun]

Just saw these, the little one is on my list for sure. Poly Aftertouch on semi-weighted mini keys? I have to have one just to see how any of that sentence works . My only poly aftertouch keyboard is a spotty VFX-SD, and frankly given everything about the spec on this it seems like the whole line is aimed right for that. The array of I/O on the back of the Explorer is superb too.

I'm drooling at the specs on the Deluxe, but it's out of my price/space range and besides, I looked at the back and was immediately disappointed. A 73-key full size keyboard and they're still running it on a WALL WART! Will we ever get internal power supplies again? Can't some company come up with top quality 5v, 9v and 12v internal supplies with IEC sockets that can be sold wholesale as off-the-shelf parts to synth makers or something? I realize they're intended to be easy to replace (and save manufacturing costs, but come on it's $1800!), but there is no such thing as a well isolated wart.

[The Elf]

A 73-key full size keyboard and they're still running it on a WALL WART!

I'm with you. I think it's a disgrace when gear at this level is saddled with an external PSU. I didn't fail to notice in the video how thin the power cable was, either. Is this pro gear, or a toy?

My plan with my current Hydrasynth was to get the PSU mounted inside the case, but lockdown overtook me. When I get my Hydraynth Deluxe that will again be my plan. I've had external PSUs placed inside on several of my devices and it makes them more suitable for gigging. I've pretty much resigned myself to having to do this more often.

[jjlonbass]

I'm drooling at the specs on the Deluxe, but it's out of my price/space range and besides, I looked at the back and was immediately disappointed. A 73-key full size keyboard and they're still running it on a WALL WART! Will we ever get internal power supplies again? Can't some company come up with top quality 5v, 9v and 12v internal supplies with IEC sockets that can be sold wholesale as off-the-shelf parts to synth makers or something? I realize they're intended to be easy to replace (and save manufacturing costs, but come on it's $1800!), but there is no such thing as a well isolated wart.

Yes, off the shelf power supplies like this are available. Indeed, very few manufacturers of equipment like a synth would design their own power supply, instead they would source a standard or custom PSU from the many manufacturers of such things.
The justification for not doing this is that equipment with built-in mains power supplies has to undergo more extensive compliance testing than equipment that is powered from a low voltage. This is true regardless of who made the built-in PSU - it is the entire system that has to be tested. This testing takes time and costs a lot of money. Either the manufacturer pays and reduces their profit margin or the consumer pays a higher purchase price.

John

[The Elf]

The justification for not doing this is that equipment with built-in mains power supplies has to undergo more extensive compliance testing than equipment that is powered from a low voltage.

...and so they should knuckle down and do it, instead of saddling us with this external PSU nonsense.

I'm prepared to pay extra, so give me the option.

I've seen all kinds of justification for external PSUs and none of it washes with me. It's about saving money - plain and simple.

While most of the world seems not to care, or is happy to explain it away, and even justify it for them, manufacturers will continue to save the pennies and smile as they take our money.

[jjlonbass]

I agree, it is all about money and I'm not too keen on wall warts either.
I just wanted to explain why equipment is often designed to use a wall wart.
I've designed some low volume production electronic equipment and this had to use an external PSU as we simply couldn't justify the cost of mains voltage compliance testing for the expected sales volume.

John

[The Elf]

No worries, John. I wasn't targetting you.

This is my bi-monthly external PSUs rant. The regulars here are used to it. Glad to meet someone of the same mind.

[Ben Asaro]

The baby Hydrasynth may push me over the edge, I've heard so many good things about that synth engine.

[Drew Stephenson]

No worries, John. I wasn't targetting you.

This is my bi-monthly external PSUs rant. The regulars here are used to it. Glad to meet someone of the same mind.

And my bi-annual counter; it's not about the cost of the synth or the power supply, it's the cost of the production line.

[The Elf]

It matters not what or where the cost is - it just needs meeting. No excuse.

[Drew Stephenson]

Dare I suggest that perhaps you, and indeed most of us on this forum, are not entirely representative of the entire target market for musical instruments; being as we are, ahem, slightly older and probably slight more well-heeled than the average aspiring musician?

We are very good at extrapolating our own requirements out and spending other people's money here.

[The Elf]

When someone is looking at spending over 1500 quid for a 'Deluxe' synth I don't think we are considering budget gear that needs corners cutting.

Now the Hydrasynth Explorer - there I can more likely accept (much as I hate it) an external PSU for reasons of cost.

[Drew Stephenson]

But what would be the additional cost of making the production line safe at 240v?
And for what percentage of users is this actually an issue? Most pro musical instruments (and I mean that in a genuine pro not a marketing pro) is actually used by amateurs, that's the big market.

But we've done this discussion to death.
Until someone comes up with an actual cost per unit of changing a production line I don't think either of us are likely to change our position.

[Folderol]

It's a case of not changing horses in mid stream.

Running a 240V safe test area is not particularly expensive, changing an existing one is extremely so. Also, with modern electronics all the risk factors are already down.

First you don't run the line at 240V, you run it a sniff over 100V (universal SMPSU in the kit), also you float the supply with leakage detectors and trips included. My personal experience is that you get more failures running at lower voltages than higher ones due to the higher currents, so it's a better test anyway.

It is only the test area that actually requires any of this. It would be ridiculous to have in the assembly areas!

YMMV

[The Elf]

Bottom line - most gear used to have internal PSUs. There is no reason they now can't.

[Martin Walker]

Waited patiently two years for a 5-octave follow up, then a month ago, thinking it wouldn't happen after all, I capitulated and got a new 49 key original... now it decides to turn up with another octave on top of that!

Same here, although when I bought my 49-keyer a few weeks back I managed to get it for a few pounds over £1000 (bargain in my book!), so I'm still well chuffed with my purchase.

I do agree that availability of these new models may be a bit hit and miss, so I'm still chuffed that I bought mine when I did. There, I've convinced myself

Martin

[The Elf]

For that money you've done really well. A four-octave keyboard is great for a lead synth, and it just nicely covers the range of a virtual Mellotron!

[ajay_m]

Why do manufacturers use external PSUs
1. It's a really expensive and time consuming issue getting the various safety and compliance certifications for all the regions they want to sell into 2. Switching PSUs radiate EMI which is tricky to shield and equipment such as the HS which has quite a few analogue ins and outs is obviously vulnerable to this 3. An internal PSU will have to be grounded whereas an external PSU can be double insulated thus removing a potentially challenging route by which interference can be further propagated. Ground currents are a nightmare because of the very low impedances involved and anyone whose grappled with noise from a bus power usb audio interface will have hit this issue. Although analogue PSUs are an option for relatively low currents the weight and heat dissipation issues then become another challenge. So understandably internal PSUs have become much less common.

[The Elf]

I've seen these 'reasons' many times - every time I raise the issue, in fact. All I say is, no matter how complicated and expensive it is... they should do it. Novation managed to do it with the Summit (I hugged the engineer who told me he was responsible for that decision), so how come some companies can and others can't?

We need to stop making their excuses for them.

[Drew Stephenson]

Because it's a non-issue for most customers and therefore it makes more sense as a manufacturer to keep the price down?
Maybe?