MIDI vs DIN leads

[Les Behan]

So - does anyone have first hand experience of problems using standard all five pins wired DIN leads instead of 3 pins wired with twisted pair and shielded PROPER MIDI leads?

I just bought some very cheap "MIDI" leads and discovered after the fact that all 5 pins are connected & I have no idea if they are rtwistede pair or not.

I`m going to be using them on a fairly intense MIDI setup comntrolled by an Akai ME80P active patchbay and dopnt want to foll around wiring it all up to find it is unreliable.

[Hypagen]

A Standard 5 pin DIN isn't a MIDI cable, they are wired differently!

Pin Layouts

A long time ago, I nearly bought a Roland MC-303, thinking it had MIDI, but it was a 5 pin DIN for recording audio.

[MarkOne]

Except that it's wred 4-4 and 5-5 and ground to ground just like the midi lead is.

To be honest I've used DIN-DIN audio leads for MIDI without a problem in the past... But they all got replaced along the way, and to my knowledge an audio DIN cable is a rare beast indeed these days

[Hypagen]

Except that it's wred 4-4 and 5-5 and ground to ground just like the midi lead is.

I now understand what the O.P. was on about now!

To be honest I've used DIN-DIN audio leads for MIDI without a problem in the past... But they all got replaced along the way, and to my knowledge an audio DIN cable is a rare beast indeed these days

Thinking about it, I may have done the same thing, as my Dad will have had these sort of leads lying around when I first started getting into using MIDI, it's a long time ago though, I'm sure I remember them not working or at least having problems, but I could be wrong.

[Les Behan]

Funnily enough the link you posted was exactly the same mine of misinformation that the vendor referred me to.
Would you honestly trust someones expertise who is selling oxygen free MIDI cables?

As I intimated in the original post I already know exactly how MIDI and DIN leads are supposed to be wired, just that I have always used proper MIDI leads in the past and am trying to get an INFORMED FIRST HAND opinion before deciding whether or not to send these back.
For what its worth they are brand new sealed in a box, but the box is labelled scart leads and I only found out they were not wired as standard MIDI leads as advertised when I put my multimetmer across them. All five pins are connected. Hence the question.

[The Elf]

I've not seen any problems with 'audio' 5-pin DIN cables used as MIDI leads, other than with the old Atari ST which used two of the pins as a MIDI Thru.

But 'genuine MIDI' leads are so cheap, why add anything questionable to your rig?

[Hypagen]

A long time ago, I nearly bought a Roland MC-303, thinking it had MIDI, but it was a 5 pin DIN for recording audio.

It was actually an MC-202..............my brain isn't working today!

[The Elf]

A long time ago, I nearly bought a Roland MC-303, thinking it had MIDI, but it was a 5 pin DIN for recording audio.

It was actually an MC-202..............my brain isn't working today!

The 5-pin DIN on a Roland MC-202 would be the clock/sync port - not an audio output.

[paulears]

An stereo audio DIN cable works fine for MIDI - it was only a problem the other way around when people used a 2,4,5 wired MIDI for audio and nothing happened. Audio was always a pain for DIN cables anyway, as a lead could have a record plug dangling, or it could be a play plug - not every one was wired both ways if people used mic cable rather than 4+screen.

[Hypagen]

A long time ago, I nearly bought a Roland MC-303, thinking it had MIDI, but it was a 5 pin DIN for recording audio.

It was actually an MC-202..............my brain isn't working today!

The 5-pin DIN on a Roland MC-202 would be the clock/sync port - not an audio output.

At least I managed to work out it wasn't a MIDI port!

The idea was to control the MC-202 via MIDI and have the MC-202 control my SH-101. Years later I bought a Little MCV for my SH-101 which provided the MIDI control I was looking for.

[Martin Walker]

...my brain isn't working today!

I'm surprised anything's still working at the temperatures we're having in the UK at the moment (nowhere near as extreme as they get in some other parts of the world, but we're not used to it )

Martin

[Matt_Moose]

For what its worth they are brand new sealed in a box, but the box is labelled scart leads

Are they 5m long and cost about £2 off ebay?

[dmills]

IIRC the major issue with generic 5 pin din leads as midi was that some of them connected the connector shell to the screen, thereby destroying the opto isolated current loop nature of MIDI.

Regards, Dan.

[Michael Dow]

I dont think there's eve that much of a problem. I was silly enough to buy oxygen free mdi cables that cost a small fortune once, and the rest have all been real cheap 5 quid ones. EVen sync-24 cables have worked for midi for me before. The old 303/606 cables

[Hypagen]

...my brain isn't working today!

I'm surprised anything's still working at the temperatures we're having in the UK at the moment (nowhere near as extreme as they get in some other parts of the world, but we're not used to it )

Martin

It's unreal the amount of snow we've had, it's not going to stop my expedition to the Pub tonight though!

[Les Behan]

IIRC the major issue with generic 5 pin din leads as midi was that some of them connected the connector shell to the screen, thereby destroying the opto isolated current loop nature of MIDI.

Regards, Dan.

Aha! THAT was whgat I was trying to remember!!! Thanks a lot.

Off to get the meter out...

[ef37a]

I have also never had a problem with all wired audio DIN leads for MIDI.

You might however stumble on a lead wired to copy tape to tape. Think about it!

Very early computer keyboards used DIN leads and these work fine. I picked up 3 in the bargain bin at Maplins a couple of years ago, about 2quid each.

I have also sent my MIDI keyboard down 42mtrs of CAT5 unshielded just for the crack, worked the pc at the end fine! My conclusion is that MIDI ain't that fussy re cable.

If I had a "proper" studio and a lot of MIDI kit I would bring all those pesky DINs out on breakout boxes and use RJ45's to link things up. Cheap as chips, quick to fit and will survive the size 13 boot test, try that with a DIN, usb or Fussywire plug!

Dave.

[Folderol]

I have also never had a problem with all wired audio DIN leads for MIDI.

Same here

You might however stumble on a lead wired to copy tape to tape. Think about it!

Damn things aught to have been illegal! I kept to one type, and made up a special M/F DIN reverser for the few times I needed it.

Very early computer keyboards used DIN leads and these work fine. I picked up 3 in the bargain bin at Maplins a couple of years ago, about 2quid each.

So you were the guy in front of me then?

I have also sent my MIDI keyboard down 42mtrs of CAT5 unshielded just for the crack, worked the pc at the end fine! My conclusion is that MIDI ain't that fussy re cable.

Not tried that. Mind you I'm beginning to think that Cat5 is the 'gaffer tape' of electronics!

If I had a "proper" studio and a lot of MIDI kit I would bring all those pesky DINs out on breakout boxes and use RJ45's to link things up. Cheap as chips, quick to fit and will survive the size 13 boot test, try that with a DIN, usb or Fussywire plug!

Dave.

Fussywire - must remember that one