J Dilla Drums?! What on earth...?!

[brothersjohnson]

I Just read the article on Deconstructed Rhythm, an MPC Drums sample back supposedly inspired by the sounds of the much respected and imitated late producer J Dilla. I'm surprised to say the least that musicians in this day actually fall for this sort of barefaced exploitation of a known name to sell products, did he endorsed it? To think that having that pack makes you the equivalent in production possibilities of any hardworking sample collector, crate digger and beat maker is nothing short of bemusing to me.

That's not to say the product is worthless, I actually think there is much to gain from it but it grates when the angle used to get interest is done by making the would be user feel as if becoming a great producer is as easy as purchasing the pack.

Naturally some will disagree with my view, just don't expect your validation of this sort of marketing to make sense to anyone worth their salt in MPC beat creation or myself.

[tomafd]

It's just the same as Pixie Lott splashed all over London buses with a milk moustache (right now...)

"Sponsorship". "Validation" or whatever you want to call it, helps sell stuff. Music technology is no different - it'll at least get people to have a listen, if not to buy.

You're confusing the art of the music with the art of selling stuff ... and getting annoyed because you feel this kind of marketing is fooling people. I'd say it's unlikely, or if it is, only the most naive. Whatever, it's not something to get that fussed over, it's just marketing ...

I've quoted it before, and I'll quote it again. From Van Morrison -

"Music is spiritual. The music business is not." (Including, in this case, the musical instrument business)

Read, mark, learn, think about, and understand exactly what he is pointing out there. NEVER confuse the two !

[Richie Royale]

Got a link to the article?

Dilla was an SP 1200 man I thought.

With regard to the sample pack, well it doesn't matter, Hip-Hop is a genre based around using other peoples music and ideas to create something new. It isn't about digging for samples, although it helps to keep the genre fresh and sample packs like this help speed up the creation even more. But if you want a sound that sets you apart,if you are using samples from a CD or from a record you have dug, it is what you make out of it rather than how original the break is.

The use of an artists name, particularly in death, may be insensitive and often with sample packs, unauthorised. I have seen plenty of "Kanye West" or "RZA" drum packs on ebay.

Incidentally, didn't Dilla give Kanye a load of samples before he died? I'm sure I read that somewhere once.

[brothersjohnson]

Here's the Link Rich
http://www.mpc-samples.com/product.php/138/deconstructed-rhythm-inspired-by-j-dilla/

Your point is a good one, it is what you make of the sample that really counts! I suppose Kanye did get a bank left for him as just after Dilla passed Mr. Wests production took on a bit of the Detroit nuances.

[brothersjohnson]

There was never any confusion about the spirituality of Music but thats what my rant has come across as.

I know what commerce and its influence on consumers is and I only vented because I'm a fan of the late J Dillas catalogue of music...I have seen exactly what you meant which is only complete Donuts would buy into the illusion.

Thanks for sharing your your view too.

[Richie Royale]

Thanks I'll check the link in a bit.

I have a Dilla mix on the net if you have quick google or send me a PM for a link.

[Dave Garnish]

I have some Jerkins and Max Martin samples I gave away on my facebook page here:

http://www.facebook.com/note.php?note_id=388237727630

You can grab them here:

http://dl.dropbox.com/u/2498717/Garnish%20urei%201.zip

[ken long]

I don't think it matters much. I remember time ago Emagic released similar CD for EXS24 featuring samples from Pete Rock, RZA, QBert, Prince Paul, and the Roots. All the sounds were pretty useless IMO. Not many tails crossing at zero, clicks, pops, and a general unpleasant hiss. Made me think they just gave away very very crap sounds on purpose. But then in the context of a full sequence on an MPC, (yeah Dilla was SP ), the sounds probably did work for them as well as the processing not present on the banks.

There's nothing wrong with Dilla's estate making money off the name. Everybody in showbiz does that kind of thing. Obviously, if it isn't endorsed, the key phrase here is "inspired by".

ken

[Danny J Lewis]

All the sounds were pretty useless IMO. Not many tails crossing at zero, clicks, pops, and a general unpleasant hiss.

Good Hip Hop (i'm talking the mid 90s to early 2000 stuff really here - prior to all this electronic new school stuff) is all about the hiss, vinyl noise and non zero edited samples, can't see any problem with this at all. If you have a bunch of cleanly edited samples and you are not a very experienced programmer with a good mix engineer (or the ability to mix for yourself) you will struggle getting an authentic hip hop sound. These noises and textures fill the gaps and often create to the groove - making it easier for the less skilled beatmakers to get the authentic flavour.

[ken long]

And that's why I wrote in the context of an MPC/SP setup.

I'm quite aware of the old school flavour. I've owned 2 SP1200s (still got one) and an MPC3K.

Its only a problem when cats sample sounds out of these classic machines. Hiss is OK if it is constant but loading these types of sounds into very clean DAWs hardly ever works IMO. YMMV.

ken

[Danny J Lewis]

And that's why I wrote in the context of an MPC/SP setup.

I'm quite aware of the old school flavour. I've owned 2 SP1200s (still got one) and an MPC3K.

Its only a problem when cats sample sounds out of these classic machines. Hiss is OK if it is constant but loading these types of sounds into very clean DAWs hardly ever works IMO. YMMV.

ken

Do you know what, i missed that sentence, apologies, I somewhat jumped the gun there. I do think however that the noise is a welcome addition to DAWs - adds the vibe that many are missing.

[ken long]

And that's why Pete Rock's engineers slaved trying to gate every output from hissy SP.

I think noise for this genre CAN be a good thing. But when you start slicing up drum loops, the clean gaps in between makes it hard for me to suspend my disbelief!

Again, YMMV.

ken

[Danny J Lewis]

And that's why Pete Rock's engineers slaved trying to gate every output from hissy SP.

I think noise for this genre CAN be a good thing. But when you start slicing up drum loops, the clean gaps in between makes it hard for me to suspend my disbelief!

Again, YMMV.

ken

If people slice at every transient then yeh the gaps issue is a problem.. that's why it's probably better for newbies to slice every beat or even longer.. the gaps and noise can contribute the flavour.

[vinyl_junkie]

All those sample packs are mega WACK so I wouldn't even bother.
Go out and spend your money on vinyl break beats instead, Skull Snaps any one?

Dilla started out on a MPC-2000 classic and that's what he made most of the early stuff on, he then got a MPC-3000 which he's very well known for using. He also used a SP-1200 on the slum village stuff.

Pete Rock now uses a MPC-2000XL but his best tracks were made in his SP days

[ken long]

All those sample packs are mega WACK so I wouldn't even bother.
Go out and spend your money on vinyl break beats instead, Skull Snaps any one?

2 Copies VJ. 2.

[Zukan]

All those sample packs are mega WACK so I wouldn't even bother.
Go out and spend your money on vinyl break beats instead, Skull Snaps any one?

Have you heard these mega wack samples then since you berate them so openly?

[ken long]

All those sample packs are mega WACK so I wouldn't even bother.
Go out and spend your money on vinyl break beats instead, Skull Snaps any one?

Have you heard these mega wack samples then since you berate them so openly?

Well here's a man who's sample packs are PHAT! Samplecraze is the fire.

ken (happy customer)

[Zukan]

All those sample packs are mega WACK so I wouldn't even bother.
Go out and spend your money on vinyl break beats instead, Skull Snaps any one?

Have you heard these mega wack samples then since you berate them so openly?

Well here's a man who's sample packs are PHAT! Samplecraze is the fire.

ken (happy customer)

Thanks Ken, and I happen to be the guy who designed the J Dilla sample pack.

So I am particularly interested to find out people's opinions here and where they source their information from.

[A Non O Miss]

All those sample packs are mega WACK so I wouldn't even bother.
Go out and spend your money on vinyl break beats instead, Skull Snaps any one?

Have you heard these mega wack samples then since you berate them so openly?

Well here's a man who's sample packs are PHAT! Samplecraze is the fire.

ken (happy customer)

Pretty
Hot
And
Tempting

&

F^ck!ng
All
That

[ken long]

Not tried them or even heard them. I was referring to EXS24's Extreme Hip Hop pack which was completely lost on me. Nothing usable back in the day and nothing usable now. I think they cost £60 at the time from Turnkey.

I do stand by my statement that its difficult to get good sample packs. More often than not, I'll find one or two useful sounds with the rest not really fit for purpose. Others may feel differently.

Your percussion pack was spot on though mate. I've got some good mileage out of them already and its shaped some of my writing so "mad props", as they say. Love the crisp castanets.

ken

[ken long]

Oh, and make some SP1200 disks if you can man!

[Zukan]

Oh, and make some SP1200 disks if you can man!

Ah dem days..........

[ken long]

I'm serious.

[Zukan]

I'm serious.

mmmmmm

[narcoman]

Yo brothers of review.....

Firstly - it's a product aimed at providing a certain style of sound. It relies on how you use them - but the tite is "inspired by...."... I see nothing wrong in that at all. Platinum Samples has BFD drums "recorded by" and there are the IK multimedia "Jimi Hendrix " packs.... it's all about labeling a product so you know what you're getting into. Would it be fair to say it's closer to the J Dilla sound than the Jimmy Page sound

Second - music making has become a consumer activity. Some companies provide products around certain sounds for various users.... Labelling a product "inspire by JD" is entirely appropriate and par for the course in a free market place. The sample pack won't turn you into Dilla, nor does it claim to. It's a sound pack that the designer has put together with those sonics in mind. How else is he/she supposed to let you know that this is the inspiration is a particular soundscape.... in this instance the work of J Dilla? It's an angle of marketing...... it lets the potential customer understand what the product is intended to be.

Third - There are uses beyond the intent for a product. I've used various sample packs over the years - some by some contributors to these very forums. Whenever I've found a good use for any packs or sounds I TELL the originators of the set. I let them know what products it's been used in and how useful I found them. As such I've used a couple of pack from this supplier in major products (a recent major motion picture for one thing - where it fulfilled a few requirements - and a current new Disney project). I RARELY use samples as intended.... I did use some of Samplecrazes hihats on an orchestral project!! ....

So as a balance to some of the critique in this thread about this particular product I'm going to say that other products from this supplier have been of excellent quality and found their way into much of my work - I'll expand - much of my highly paid and globally profiled work. The products I have used are suitable for professional work.
whether they fit your own unique requirements or, in any individual opinion fit the description on the tin - is entirely subjective. They do it for me.