1959 Hofner Committee restoration

[Bilderpinte]

Hi

I bought this guitar in the 1980's in a secondhand shop for 125 pounds, mainly because I liked the look of it.

As you can see:

http://www.flickr.com/photos/85788943@N08/

it needs restoring. Does anyone know of someone who specialises in this type of thing? Another question, regarding the condition of the guitar, is whether it makes sense to do so?

Thanks,
Mark

[zenguitar]

Actually, from the pics at least, it looks in very good shape with little or no real restoration required. Although the usual caveats apply, everything is subject to seeing the guitar in the flesh, so to speak, rather than just looking at pics.

But from what I can see, things are looking good structurally. Everything seems to be in the right place, the bindings haven't come detached from the body, all the hardware appears to be in good order. The frets and fretboard all appear to be in good shape.

Where you do have an obvious problem is with the finish. The odd scratch and scrape can be ignored, but there are a few places where the finish is peeling away and that appears to be the main problem.

Those late 50's and early 60's Hofners were generally excellent quality instruments. They were well made by skilled makers using very good materials. Very desirable in their time, and still excellent players' guitars now. The current value is mainly as a an instrument to play rather than a collectable, however there are Hofner collectors out there and some of the rarer models do carry a big premium for them. And that's where the potential problem lies. Collectors value originality above all else. For 99.9% of old Hofners you can safely go ahead and get it refinished. But if yours happens to be one of the rare models that collectors crave they would prefer it in it's current condition rather than restored.

If we were talking very early Strats and Les Pauls we are talking about the difference between £50k for all original and £5/10k refinished. But rare Hofners of this period are more likely to be £300/400 refinished and £1500/2000 all original. It's highly unlikely that it is a rarity, and even if it is you aren't losing a massive amount by refinishing. But if you have any doubts, you need to do some research and find a Hofner specialist to evaluate it for you. Other than that, the pick-ups can be rewound if required quite easily, there are sources of NOS parts for pick-ups and the rest of the electrics and the machine heads if needed (and you require that degree of originality), and everything else to make it a great player can be handled by a competent tech or luthier.

One thing is reasonably certain, you have a guitar that is worth keeping and playing regularly. No great value as a collectable, but potentially a very good instrument with a good 50 years or more left in it.

Andy

[shufflebeat]

Good advice as always, Zen.

Be aware that Hofs often have a problem with the neck glue joint. I'm reliably informed that it's due to the use of animal based glue which becomes brittle after 50 years leading to crackage and dropping off-age.

This might be worth exploring and pre-empting in a controlled removal and resetting.

Lovely guitar, lots and lots of character if set up properly and worth nothing in cash terms. It's a keeper.

[Tartaruga]

Hi
In my opinion,that’s a ‘keeper’.It looks very nice and not so common…
So,if you intend to sell it,let it as it is,original.If you intend to play it,maybe you can find someone qualified who can take care of the cosmetics…Beautiful guitar anyway!
Cheers!

[Bilderpinte]

Thanks for the replies. I'll try and do some more research on Hofners and will post the results on here.

[zenguitar]

Be aware that Hofs often have a problem with the neck glue joint. I'm reliably informed that it's due to the use of animal based glue which becomes brittle after 50 years leading to crackage and dropping off-age.

Hmmm... sounds not-quite-right to me I'm afraid. I've worked on quite a few Hofners over the years and not come across any problems with the neck joint breaking down. There was a guitar where the heel had split when the guitar had been abused in the past. Part of the heel remained in the body, and the rest was attached to the neck. The old repair had failed so I had to take it apart and remake it properly.

And one of the great strengths (if you'll pardon the pun) of Hide Glue is that it is very long lasting and it is a flexible glue not brittle, ideal for making musical instruments. It is what violin makers have used for centuries. There is a very long tradition of making the violin family in Germany, and one of the reasons the German guitars of the 50's and 60's were so desirable at the time is that they were so well made. Many of those luthiers came from families with many generations of violin makers.

However, one of the qualities of Hide Glue is that it can be disassembled with heat, and at a relatively low temperature. One of the reasons we luthiers like it so much, it can make some repairs a LOT easier. A guitar in a black case, on the back seat of a car, on a very hot & sunny day, can reach the temperature where the hide glue starts to soften and then the string tension will pull the joint apart.

Nothing wrong with the glue, it's a result of neglect on the part of a previous owner. No need to take the neck off and refit it 'just in case'. There are plenty of 3-400 year old instruments out there held together with Hide Glue, it's one of the very best glues there is for luthiery.

Andy

[Folderol]

Well I don't know anything about restoration but that guitar looks like it has a lot of character, and should be sensitively brought to a state where it can be heard.

[shufflebeat]

I bow to your greater experience of course Zen but the info came from a competent orchestral repairist who, when I asked him if he did neck joint repairs immediately asked me, "is it a Hofner?".

I've had two of them and a buddy had another, all with the same neck joint issues.

Again, I'm not questioning your advice, just marvelling at my own good fortune to have picked up these little gems for pennies for this reason.

By the way, one is now a fantastic sounding bouzouki with four pairs tuned like a fiddle but deeeeper.

[zenguitar]

I bow to your greater experience of course Zen but the info came from a competent orchestral repairist who, when I asked him if he did neck joint repairs immediately asked me, "is it a Hofner?".

I've had two of them and a buddy had another, all with the same neck joint issues.

Again, I'm not questioning your advice, just marvelling at my own good fortune to have picked up these little gems for pennies for this reason.

By the way, one is now a fantastic sounding bouzouki with four pairs tuned like a fiddle but deeeeper.

Don't worry Shuffles, it's all part of life's rich tapestry in my book. There are a LOT of instruments out there and a lot of repairers too. So the bottom line is that none of us see anything other than a very tiny sample of all the instruments out there. And even then we only tend to see the minority with problems rather than the majority that work just fine. So not is it not unusual to find repairers with vastly difference experiences, I would be VERY concerned when two have similar experiences.

And if I hadn't gone on at such length in my first post I would have added another thought. It's not uncommon for issues that lead to being general reputations often go back to a problem with a small batch of guitars. I wouldn't be the least surprised to learn that Hofner had a bad batch of glue at one time, or tried to change to a pre-mixed liquid version that they hoped would save time in the factory but turned out to be less suitable because of the additives used. I once had 3 Seagull guitars in for warranty repair inside a month. The headstock had broken loose on all 3 because of a glue starved scarf joint. Possibly a real problem, but in all probability just the work of someone new, or someone paying too much attention to a manager asking them to waste less glue. I've worked on a lot of Seagulls, mostly set-ups and the quality of the factory set-up is excellent, I've repaired a few that were broken in accidents, but the only three that had faults were those 3 with the headstock falling off. Bottom line? I still recommend Seagull guitars

These things happen, even to the very best manufacturers, and when they do they tend to appear in clusters. All the guitars the apprentice worked on or the new glue was used on ended up in the batch that went to the UK distributor. By the time they've completed all the other orders and got back to the UK distributor the apprentice is much better or the batch of bad glue has run out. Almost all the bad guitars go to one distributor and there's a good chance that the bulk of those end up in the same shop.

However, I think we are both largely agreed, understand that we are both right, and are enjoying and learning from the conversation

And another d*mned essay, sorry. If it's any consolation, there goes my early night !!

Andy

[shufflebeat]

Makes sense, cheers Z.

[Bilderpinte]

Just a quick update. I got in touch with Steve Russell who runs the Vintage Hofner Website.

He had some good news: the serial number 1002 suggests it is either the second or third of this model to be manufactured. Six hundred and something Hofner Committee thinlines were made in total. The not so good news: The pickups are non-Hofner replacements and the original Hofner control console has been replaced by a home-made one. The bridge is not original, and the pickguard is missing. Still, he reckoned that the guitar, once restored, would be worth circa 1.500 pounds. I asked him to recommend a luthier who has experience of restoring Hofners and he suggested Martin Harrison in Lincolnshire. I’ve contacted Martin and will send him the guitar when I’m next in the UK, which will be at the beginning of November.

I’ll post on here once I’ve any further info.

[Folderol]

I’ve contacted Martin and will send him the guitar when I’m next in the UK, which will be at the beginning of November.

I’ll post on here once I’ve any further info.

Send?
Surely you mean take?
There is absolutely no delivery service in this country I'd trust with something like that!

[zenguitar]

That's good news Bilderpinte,

It's been a quite a few years since I needed to order NOS Hofner parts but I do recall that Music Ground had a decent stash a few years ago.

And when it comes to pick-ups, if you can't get good originals, look out for non-functioning period originals and have them repaired/rewound for you, that's always a good option.

Oh, and please let us know how you get on

Andy