Ampex Model 415

[twotoedsloth]

Greetings,

A couple of years ago a colleague and I found a pair of Ampex Model 415 speakers under a huge pile of various cables.

Do these speakers have any value as "grot boxes"? They look very similar to the very popular Auratone cube speakers. We plugged them in and they sound just fine. Is it worth shoehorning them into our already crowded control room?

Thanks,

Peter

[twotoedsloth]

Sorry to pester you all again, but do you think it is worth keeping these speakers, or should they go on to Kijiji (eBay in Canada)? I guess that the timing is not crucial, as they have been hiding for more than 15 years... longer than I've been working here.

Thanks,

Peter

[CS70]

We plugged them in and they sound just fine.

This strongly suggests they are not equivalent to Auratones

Apart jokes, know nothing of them so hope that someone who has first-hand knowledge will chime in.

What you're looking for is a sealed enclosure (i.e. no ports) and a single small driver (i.e. no crossovers) which gives a mid-rangey vibe, set up in physical mono (i.e. one speaker only, not two speakers playing the same output). Listen to some recordings which have a well done drums/guitar/vocals balance and use these levels to gauge your own.

These days I find myself using an iphone speaker as well for the same purpose.

[twotoedsloth]

So really no one here has experience with Ampex speakers?

Probably you are more familiar with Ampex tape and/or tape recording machines.

Anyways, if you have any insights, ie are "grot boxes" be they NS10s, Auratones, or those pyramid shaped ones, useful in any way?

Right now, we have Genelec 1032b and KRK V8-2 speakers in the control room now, but we could make some room for the Ampex speakers and find space in the rack for an amp if it is worthwhile.

Our control room has excellent sonic treatment, so that's not an issue. We primarily record classical music and small Jazz ensembles in our studio. Although lately we seem to be getting a lot of "world" music - Steel pan, Indian classical music, Balinese Gamelan, Klezmer, that kind of thing.

Thank you for your thoughts,

Peter

[James Perrett]

I must admit that I'm not a big fan of 'grot boxes'. They're very much a personal choice as some people get on well with them but I find NS10's too harsh and tiring. I also have some Dynatron speakers which appear to be designed in a similar way to Auratones (small full range driver in a sealed cabinet) but they just don't give me enough information. Both are consigned to other duties while the nearest thing to 'grot boxes' in the studio are LS3/5a's.

[Sam Spoons]

Go and wash your keyboard out James the LS3/5As are highly respected classic monitors not 'grot boxes'......

[Martin Walker]

I think James may be bigging up his loudspeaker collection by referring to the LS3/5As as the closest thing he's got to grot boxes.



Martin

[Sam Spoons]

Yeah, I guessed I only have a pair of Wilmslow Audio LS3s (a 3/5A ripoff bought in kit form nearly 40 years ago). They sound gorgeous even driven by a cheapo Chinese 'Class T' amp. They serve as my computer speakers in the office.

[James Perrett]

Yes, I like to have a smaller pair of speakers in the studio so that I can demonstrate to clients that the wonderful sub-sonic bass sound they've created won't actually be heard by most listeners. However, 'grot boxes' change the balance completely and confuse anyone who isn't used to them. The LS3/5a's sound sufficiently similar to the big Tannoys to not confuse people - plus I can listen to them for hours on end without fatigue.

[Wonks]

A mono Auratone was fine for checking how your mix would translate to a mono radio speaker, but very few people listen to mono radio for music these days - certainly compared to the '70s,'80s or '90s.

[CS70]

A mono Auratone was fine for checking how your mix would translate to a mono radio speaker, but very few people listen to mono radio for music these days - certainly compared to the '70s,'80s or '90s.

An Auratone is useful for much more than that. It's not *needed* - you can use a variety of other tools if you so like - but it's a good package to have them together and to get results fast: you have a good transient response, you can balance drums, bass and vocals easily, if you listen at low volume and you have excitement and detail, you're mostly done.

Of course you have the physical mono thing - for which any single speaker would do. Regarding the usage of mono - there's a mono speaker which is very popular and used these days, which is the iPhone speaker

[MarkOne]

but very few people listen to mono radio for music these days

You tell that to the droves of people installing Sonos systems throughout their houses!

(Yes I know Sonos systems can do stereo if you buy two for each room, but the people I know buying them tend not to do that!)

[Dr Huge Longjohns]

but very few people listen to mono radio for music these days

Hmmm, got any evidence for this assertion? I have a mono DAB radio in my kitchen that's on every day. I don't believe I'm alone in this!

which is the iPhone speaker

Yep. I think there's probably a very strong case for saying that listening in mono is actually a growing phenomenon for this reason alone. My kids listen to stuff on their phones' speakers constantly.

[The Elf]

I have a mono DAB radio in my kitchen that's on every day. I don't believe I'm alone in this!

+1

[twotoedsloth]

My main concern is how much do we care about listeners who can't be bothered to invest in a stereo setup? Stereo really isn't all that new, people jumped from DVD to Bluray, after all. And in my opinion the difference between DVD and Bluray is not as dramatic as the difference between stereo and mono.

[The Elf]

It's your choice, of course, but how much compromise, or effort, does it take to make sure your mixes translate to mono? In the scheme of things it's a relatively minor undertaking.

Personally, I want to make sure that my clients' material has the best chance of being well-presented however the rest of the world chooses to consume it.

[zenguitar]

Stereo is certainly not new, but it is (and has always been) optional. And whilst those who frequent these fora are likely to have at least one listening environment with speakers and listening position forming a nice equilateral triangle, we are most definitely the exception and not the rule.

From 'significant others' dictating speaker location according to 'what looks nice', pubs and café's laid out so that most of the area is not covered by two speakers, or even some pubs with a juke box where the left channel is in the lounge and the right channel is in the bar (not a nice experience, trust me), real world locations are not stereo friendly. Should you optimise your stereo mix for right hand drive or left hand drive cars? You can't even guarantee headphone mixes with kids sharing earbuds.

Unless you really love the sound of guitars and drums in the lounge bar with bass and vocals in the public bar it makes sense to follow The Elf's advice and make sure your mix collapses nicely to mono.

Andy

[Sam Spoons]

+1 I remember back in the '70s when car stereo makers were telling us what a perfect environment a car was for stereo listening because the occupants seating positions were fixed