Bose S1 Pro versus JBL Eon One Compact

[Bob Bickerton]

Greetings learned ones.....

I moved out of live sound production two years ago and have survived without any sort of front of house system since then.

I'm looking to buy a portable system for a specific application - which then may also be used for other applications from time to time. This is for acoustic music reinforcement - mainly vocals and traditional Māori instruments (think flutes and quiet sounds).

Inputs will be a Sennheiser G4 radio system (probably using an AKG C520 headset) as well as a Beyer M201.

The specific application is concerts in schools, which I'm looking to get back into - so an important factor is ease of set up - 10 minutes would be about right!

I used to use a Yamaha Stagepas 300 system which is rated at 112 dB SPL @ 1m maximum output level and a Frequency Range of 55Hz - 20 kHz (unspecified level). This system worked very well for the above application - but had one downside in that the amp cooling fan was often audible.

Anyway, I'm looking at the possibility of buying a pair of battery powered speakers, either Bose S1 Pro or JBL Eon One Compact. The JBL has a similar output to the old stagepas, with a little more low end extension (not really a benefit for me). The Bose is rated at 125 dB SPL at 1m and a similar low frequency extension.

I have to say the prospect of walking into a school and being independent of any power source would be a huge advantage. (I'd buy a battery driven receiver for the radio mic). Maximum usage would be 3 x 1 hour shows per day and I'd imagine the system would not be pushed hard at any time, so even though there was a long thread regarding battery life earlier, I should be fine.

Potential other applications would be small scale duo concerts, using a couple of M201s, radio mic, looping and a harp (with strings) and obviously using a mixer.

Given the sensitivity of the acoustic instruments being used, a high degree of accurate translation would be a priority. I'm a little wary of Bose's imposed 'optimised processing'.

Just now, JBL seem to be suffering supply issues here but Bose seem OK.

I know there's a few S1 users around here, anyone got a view its ability to meet my requirements and also how it might compare to the JBL?

Always appreciated.

Bob

[Hugh Robjohns]

I absolutely love my S1pros!

Great hi-fi-esque sound. Loads of volume / headroom. Easy to carry around. Versatile placement options -- I use mine as a floor monitor or keyboard backline as much as a compact PA.

However, I don't generally plug mics direct into mine. When serving as a PA we run them from a Mackie 1608, so I'm not sure about the gain range for M201s.

The published specs aren't very informative! I'll run some measurements of mine over the weekend if I get the chance and report back.

You've probably already found these, but just in case, here are Mike Crofts' thoughts:

https://www.soundonsound.com/reviews/bose-s1-pro

https://www.soundonsound.com/reviews/jbl-eon-one-compact

[Bob Bickerton]

Thanks Hugh, that would be appreciated if you have time.

Bob

[Hugh Robjohns]

A few quick measurements...

First off, the channel EQ ranges. These are simple symmetrical bell-style EQs. The bass range is +/-8dB centred at about 120Hz, with a bandwidth of around 0.66 octaves or a Q of 2.4.

The treble EQ range is +/-10dB centred at 10kHz. The bandwidth is 1.25 octaves and the Q around 1.1.

The 'tonematch' EQ is more intriguing! The black line is the flat mode, the red is the guitar setting and the blue is the vocal setting.

As you can see, in the guitar mode there's an 80Hz notch (presumably to remove sound hole resonance), with a little dip around 650Hz and a very broad boost around 4kHz.

The vocal EQ mode thins out the low end a bit with a modest shelf below 850Hz and a roll-off below 100Hz, combined with a broad presence boost centred around 3kHz.

Both EQ options are typical of generic PA EQ settings for those sources, really.

Now... levels.... and I am completely deaf after these tests... The Bose S1 Pro is bloomin' loud!

With the channel volume control at maximum, the signal level required to illuminate the red clip light is -34dBu for the TRS input and -40dBu for the XLR input. So the XLR is 6dB more sensitive than the TRS input. A small but useful difference...

Considering your planned use of the Beyer M201, with the channel volume at maximum, and with the Beyer M201's sensitivity of 1.2mV/Pa, you'd need 110dB SPL at the mic to generate an output of -40dBu and tickle the red light! ...and that would (theoretically) generate 125dB SPL from the speaker.

However, more realistically, you'd be working with a nominal 20dB headroom, so you'd actually need -60dBu from the mic which requires around 90dB SPL in front of it.

That's still quite a lot to expect from an acoustic instrument, even with close mic placement! ... But of course, these figures assume you actually need the full output level from the speaker, which you probably won't in your application....

Nevertheless, it does suggest that you'll probably need to run the M201 channel flat out (or nearly so) to get enough contribution, and you might be better off using an external preamp or mixer.

With the volume control up full I measured the noise floor at the line output at around -80dBu which isn't bad, actually, but it suggests the preamp is not as quite as more boutique designs!

With the volume control at its centre-detent position, the maximum input level for full output is -18dBu via the TRS input or -24dBu for the XLR input.

The channel volume control reduces to zero, but the highest level it will accept before input clipping is +24dBu via the TRS input.

Clearly, this thing is designed to work with mic and instrument sources, rather than pro-level line mixers. As I said, it can accommodate full pro-level inputs, but only with the volume control turned down low and there is no calibrated input level. Consequently, matching two speakers for stereo is a little fiddly.

The line output provides +2dBu just before the red channel clip lights come on, but is again clearly intended to provide instrument level signals under normal operating conditions.

There's roughly 16dB of gain available on the volume control above the centre-detent, and the usable working range of the volume control is around 45dB in total.

I hope that's of some help.

[Bob Bickerton]

Thanks Hugh.

Channel EQ looks workable, not so sure about the tone shaping but you never know. Flat looks good

Any idea how much gain is available on the preamps? Hopefully enough to service the M201s.

Much appreciated, looks like the perfect solution fo the school work and no doubt many others uses too. Actually it would make a tidy talkback monitor when I’m recording remotely from the performers.

Bob

[Sam Spoons]

My non scientific take on them is that the Bose S1 sounds nicer than the JBL Eon, the Eon has the typical JBL 'house sound', harsh upper mids. The Bose has an over-hyped bass (but is hopeless for bass guitar ) but otherwise sound very nice as Hugh says.

There have been issues with the batteries draining when the speaker is switched off*, not sure if they have been resolved but, as I'm barred from the Bose forum, I can't go and check progress.

The JBL phone app has a mixer, the Bose does not which nearly swayed me in favour of the JBL but I just could not live with the sound of the Eon...

* Search for S1 Pro Battery Drain Issue. One of mine went back to Bose twice and still needed a firmware update before it's battery performance** became acceptable. Also the S1 battery pack has a sleep mode where it goes to sleep after 30 days inactivity and needs to be plugged into the mains to 'wake it up' so check/charge before any gigs to be sure.

** Battery performance in use is not affected by 'the issue' and is excellent, it is only retention of charge over a period of no use that is affected.

[Hugh Robjohns]

Any idea how much gain is available on the preamps? Hopefully enough to service the M201s.

As I said, with the volume control at maximum you can generate a +2dBu output level for an input of -40dBu. So there appears to be 42dB of gain in the system's signal path.

I suspect that would be just about enough for your application, partly because the S1 Pro has a powerful amp feeding the speaker and can go louder than most other comparably sized alternatives.

But I would expect that you'd need to run with the volume control close to flat out to get enough signal, and personally, I would probably prefer to use an external preamp/mixer to have available more and quieter gain.

The SD MixPre 10 would do a really good job, and keep it all battery powered....

[Bob Bickerton]

Thanks Hugh, I guess I’ll just have to rough it with the mixpre ………….

Bob

[Hugh Robjohns]

...and that way you've got all the shows on file ready for the Live album....

[ConcertinaChap]

There have been issues with the batteries draining when the speaker is switched off*, not sure if they have been resolved but, as I'm barred from the Bose forum, I can't go and check progress.

My experience here. When I first got my S1 Pro the battery would go flat over the course of a few days. Not a problem in live use if you recharged the battery, say, the previous day but not right all the same. Then Bose issued a firmware upgrade and the problem largely went away.

CC

[Sam Spoons]

Then Bose issued a firmware upgrade and the problem largely went away.

CC

Largely but not completely by a large margin, even the best performing S1 Pros are draining the battery at 10 times the rate that could be attributed to self discharge in the Li-Ion cells (as proven by removing the battery from the speaker). As you say it's only a problem if you have to go off grid for a few weeks, which is exactly why I bought my first S1. I pulled it out of the car for a rehearsal session after a week and it was dead. Despite that I did buy a second one and both last about 3 weeks without losing more than 10 or 15% of their charge.

[resistorman]

Also, the Bose have a mini line array for the top end, so they are wide and carry very well. I’ve never had an issue with feedback, and found very little need to EQ them if the source is reasonable. I’ve not found the tone match switches to be useful in any of my applications. No battery problems, but we charge them before use, and they run longer than I’ve needed so far. I use them for my synths and PA/ monitors, and my wife uses them for harp, piano, and vocal, usually for weddings and events. I sold our QSC K10s because we almost never used them anymore. My biggest gripe is the steep price for the backpack and the silly little slip cover which offers no protection at all.

[Bob Bickerton]

Thanks all, I don’t think I’m too worried about the battery discharge as, being a belt and braces sort of a guy, I’d always fully charge the night before.

Don’t hold your breath for the live album!

Bob

[Hugh Robjohns]

I might be slightly slow on the uptake here, but I see the new Bose Sub-1 and (larger) Sub-2 subwoofers are (finally) intended to be used with the S1Pro to make a compact sat/sub system.

I cant find anything much on specs yet, but the Sub includes a high-pass output mode which is designed and optimised to feed an S1 Pro mounted on a pole screwed into the sub. The subs add bass extension and volume (more of both with the S2 of course).

It looks like a very neat and practical system, and around £2.5k for a pair of S1pros and a pair of Sub1s stereo system. Sub2s would add another £200 to the bill.

[resistorman]

That's really interesting!

[Wonks]

Though neither the Sub-1 or Sub-2 are battery powered, so only for use where power is available.

[Hugh Robjohns]

True. You'd need big batteries to keep a sub running for a decent time, though.

Doesn't bother me. I rarely run the S1 Pro on its battery anyway.

[Bob Bickerton]

Noted. Probably not necessary for the application I have in mind, but nice to know the system can be extended.

Bob