Small monitors
Small monitors
I'm looking for a first pair of monitors for a small room with limited space around my desk. I've been using headphones until now, but feel the need for speakers! I''ll be mainly mixing country-style electric guitar based stuff. I won't be cranking them up to high volume, and will probably have them spaced around 80cm. The room doesn't have any acoustic treatment, and I won't be able to treat it.
I'd ruled out some of the main contenders (Neumann KH80, Amphion One12 etc etc) on account of them being too big, and was thinking along the lines of Genelec 8010A, 8020, 8320 or the Eve SC203.
However, the Quested V2104 appear to be within the range of what will fit. They obviously don't have much bass response, but I have a feeling they might be a good option. Has anyone heard them, and if so, do they get a 'yay' or 'nay'?
I'd ruled out some of the main contenders (Neumann KH80, Amphion One12 etc etc) on account of them being too big, and was thinking along the lines of Genelec 8010A, 8020, 8320 or the Eve SC203.
However, the Quested V2104 appear to be within the range of what will fit. They obviously don't have much bass response, but I have a feeling they might be a good option. Has anyone heard them, and if so, do they get a 'yay' or 'nay'?
Re: Small monitors
I've not heard them personally, but they got a good review in the magazine last year. Here's the link if you've not already read it:
https://www.soundonsound.com/reviews/quested-v2104
https://www.soundonsound.com/reviews/quested-v2104
Re: Small monitors
Thanks very much, Luke. Yes, I had read that review, and from what i can tell, it seems generally positive, making me think these monitors could be a decent option for me.
I've been going back and forth between other options, and being unable to decide without hearing them. I'd completely missed the launch of these speakers until the other day, so it was a pleasant suprise to have what appears to be a high quality small monitor to consider.
I'll speak to a dealer and see about arranging a demo, but it would be good to get some other feedback on them.
I've been going back and forth between other options, and being unable to decide without hearing them. I'd completely missed the launch of these speakers until the other day, so it was a pleasant suprise to have what appears to be a high quality small monitor to consider.
I'll speak to a dealer and see about arranging a demo, but it would be good to get some other feedback on them.
Re: Small monitors
Worth looking at the iLoud as well. Good reviews and a few people here have spoken highly of them.
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Re: Small monitors
I'm very taken by ATCs SCM7 miniature two-way speakers. They're passive, so you'll need to budget for a decent amp, but they should still end up comparable to your short listed options. Fabulous midrange and a lovely, well defined low end which makes up its limited power with great extension and timing.
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Re: Small monitors
I have a pair of Genelec 8010’s which are great. Really small and portable if that’s important!!
Highly recommended.
Highly recommended.
They say you are what you eat but I don't remember eating a f**king legend!
Re: Small monitors
Thanks. Yes, the iLouds were on the shortlist at one point, but I think I'd read mixed comments about them, and I wasn't sure about them. With them having DSP and a lower cut-off, they're obviously a different beast from the Questeds.
Although I may be completely wrong about this, I have a feeling I might be happier with the Questeds, even though it appears they don't do bass.
Although I may be completely wrong about this, I have a feeling I might be happier with the Questeds, even though it appears they don't do bass.
Re: Small monitors
Hugh Robjohns wrote:I'm very taken by ATCs SCM7 miniature two-way speakers. They're passive, so you'll need to budget for a decent amp, but they should still end up comparable to your short listed options. Fabulous midrange and a lovely, well defined low end which makes up its limited power with great extension and timing.
That's spooky. When I was originally looking for monitors about a year ago, just before Lockdown, I went to a HiFi shop and demo'd a few small speakers including variants of LS3/5A. The last one I tried was the SCM7, and I came away thinking that was the one. I can't quite remember it now, but I think it was revealing, but not harsh or tiring. I thought it was quite classy. Apparently, they need a good amp to drive them. The main problem, is that although they're small, and curved towards the rear, they're still larger than the Questeds, and I think they might be cramped in the space I have available.
Have you heard the Questeds in comparison, Hugh? I was hoping they'd be in the same league as the SCM7.
Re: Small monitors
I've not heard those little Questeds, but I've heard lots of others and Roger Q certainly knows his stuff. So I'm sure they're good.
But they aren't directly comparable to the scm7 or ls3/5a because these are sealed cabinet speakers, rather than ported.
But they aren't directly comparable to the scm7 or ls3/5a because these are sealed cabinet speakers, rather than ported.
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Re: Small monitors
blinddrew wrote:Worth looking at the iLoud as well. Good reviews and a few people here have spoken highly of them.
I've got some and I'm really impressed with them. Very good for a small desk especially if you mount them on some small mic stands to get them to ear level.
Re: Small monitors
Thanks for all the suggestions and info.
I think the review mentioned the Questeds' ports as being relatively uncoloured, so I thought they might not be a negative. However, I was originally looking for sealed boxes.
I'll have to measure up the ATCs, as they may be too big. I do remember being impressed with them, though, and quite liked the idea of them having ATC's own drivers. The specs suggest they're quite hefty (7.5kg each). The Questeds are 'only' 3.5Kg each, and that includes the amp.
Both are expensive options. I'll look again at the alternatives, but in the long run it might be wiser to spend more now rather than upgrading later.
I think the review mentioned the Questeds' ports as being relatively uncoloured, so I thought they might not be a negative. However, I was originally looking for sealed boxes.
I'll have to measure up the ATCs, as they may be too big. I do remember being impressed with them, though, and quite liked the idea of them having ATC's own drivers. The specs suggest they're quite hefty (7.5kg each). The Questeds are 'only' 3.5Kg each, and that includes the amp.
Both are expensive options. I'll look again at the alternatives, but in the long run it might be wiser to spend more now rather than upgrading later.
Re: Small monitors
deejayen wrote:The specs suggest they're quite hefty (7.5kg each).
Goes hand in hand with being 'good'. Solid cabinets are heavy. Strong, rigid driver chassis are heavy. And big, powerful magnets are heavy. They they are all crucial to ensuring the driver diaphragms do exactly what they're supposed to and nothing else!
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Re: Small monitors
Just a +1 for small ATC monitors. I've now had my SCM10 Pro's for 24 years, and as my acoustic treatment has improved, their sound has gone from very good to even better.
Unless I manage to damage them I've got no plans to change them.
Martin
Unless I manage to damage them I've got no plans to change them.
Martin
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Re: Small monitors
I made my shortlist according to size constraints too
The Genelecs and Neumanns are nicely packaged in that the power and XLR cables fit upwards into recessed sockets so they don't protrude and interfere with placement. The Neumanns are deeper, but being front-ported they don't need the same space behind as the Genelecs.
I ended up with the KH 80s, which I preferred to the others in my demo, particularly for their mid-range clarity, and I'm extremely happy with them. I should mention the somewhat temperamental standby circuit, as reported by others, but at least it can be disabled if it's annoying. That aside, they're a great package and excellent value. I very much agree with Hugh Robjohn's review. It helps to have an iPad, however, as without one (or their MA 1 measurement mic) you can't make use of the DSP features.
The SCM7 is the one I wish I'd tried. It would be a strong choice, and they'd still be with you in 20+ years (like Martin Walkers's SCM10s and my old PMC TB2s which are now brightening up my living room). Passives can always be re-amped, and I tbh I'd be surprised if my active+DSP KH80s lasted as long.
On the other hand, for not much more than the price of the SCM7s and a decent amp, I now have a full-range system in the form of a pair of KH80 and the KH750 sub I added a few months later. It's a complete and fantastically well-integrated system - a joy.
The Genelecs and Neumanns are nicely packaged in that the power and XLR cables fit upwards into recessed sockets so they don't protrude and interfere with placement. The Neumanns are deeper, but being front-ported they don't need the same space behind as the Genelecs.
I ended up with the KH 80s, which I preferred to the others in my demo, particularly for their mid-range clarity, and I'm extremely happy with them. I should mention the somewhat temperamental standby circuit, as reported by others, but at least it can be disabled if it's annoying. That aside, they're a great package and excellent value. I very much agree with Hugh Robjohn's review. It helps to have an iPad, however, as without one (or their MA 1 measurement mic) you can't make use of the DSP features.
The SCM7 is the one I wish I'd tried. It would be a strong choice, and they'd still be with you in 20+ years (like Martin Walkers's SCM10s and my old PMC TB2s which are now brightening up my living room). Passives can always be re-amped, and I tbh I'd be surprised if my active+DSP KH80s lasted as long.
On the other hand, for not much more than the price of the SCM7s and a decent amp, I now have a full-range system in the form of a pair of KH80 and the KH750 sub I added a few months later. It's a complete and fantastically well-integrated system - a joy.
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- Ben Wilmot
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Re: Small monitors
Thanks, Ben.
The KH80 get great reviews, and the dealer I use always recommends them.
I'm still trying to decide. After measuring up again, many of the good monitors are probably too big. However, I'm going to have a look around for monitor stands to see if I could position one of them to give a bit more clearance around my work area for larger monitors.
Keeping with small monitors, I was thinking the small Questeds would be the way to go, but a dealer said they sounded a bit boxy.
I'm sure the ATC's would be good, but, unfortunately, I think they're too big. Also, I spoke to a HiFi dealer about them, and he confirmed they need a quality amp. I had thought about getting some lower wattage monoblocks, but he said they just wouldn't work, so I suspect something like the £2500 3U ATC P1 is probably needed to drive the ATC monitors.
The KH80 get great reviews, and the dealer I use always recommends them.
I'm still trying to decide. After measuring up again, many of the good monitors are probably too big. However, I'm going to have a look around for monitor stands to see if I could position one of them to give a bit more clearance around my work area for larger monitors.
Keeping with small monitors, I was thinking the small Questeds would be the way to go, but a dealer said they sounded a bit boxy.
I'm sure the ATC's would be good, but, unfortunately, I think they're too big. Also, I spoke to a HiFi dealer about them, and he confirmed they need a quality amp. I had thought about getting some lower wattage monoblocks, but he said they just wouldn't work, so I suspect something like the £2500 3U ATC P1 is probably needed to drive the ATC monitors.
Re: Small monitors
You can buy a reasonably powerful Hypex based amp for around £600 (or a bit cheaper if you are open to some DIY). I'd be surprised if that wasn't powerful enough to drive any small monitors. In my experience they sound good. However, given Hugh and Mike Senior's glowing reports about the KH80, it should probably be on your list.
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Re: Small monitors
I'm surprised anyone says teh KH80 are "too large" as they are tiny.
I used to use the K+H O110-D (the forerunner of the KH 120) and those are pretty small and excellent as well (now up for sale as I have upgraded to the ME-Geithain RL906).
I used to use the K+H O110-D (the forerunner of the KH 120) and those are pretty small and excellent as well (now up for sale as I have upgraded to the ME-Geithain RL906).
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Re: Small monitors
Yeah, you could certainly take the cost of SCM7+amp to well in excess of my Neumann 2.1 system. I'd go second hand were I buying some passive ATCs, and I used to drive my TB2s using an old Crown PA amp (I'm sure I could've done better, but it had great specs and so much power it was barely strolling with my PMCs. It was huge though).
I use K&M 26772 Table Monitor Stands for my KH80s, specifically because the space under the speakers remains usable. They don't isolate well, however, and I plan to improve that soon.
There were several more monitors I wish I could've tried, and Amphions were one. Not heard those Quested either. I demoed the ones I had access to and chose the best of those.
I use K&M 26772 Table Monitor Stands for my KH80s, specifically because the space under the speakers remains usable. They don't isolate well, however, and I plan to improve that soon.
There were several more monitors I wish I could've tried, and Amphions were one. Not heard those Quested either. I demoed the ones I had access to and chose the best of those.
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- Ben Wilmot
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Re: Small monitors
I decided the ATCs were too big, plus I don't think I'd ever be able to decide on an amp!
I came to the conclusion that a pair of Genelec 8010A would probably be the most sensible choice for now.
I'd originally tried a couple of times to contact Quested to see if they thought the V2104's would work for me. They didn't reply to their contact form, and they didn't answer the phone when I tried a couple of times on different days. I'd almost given up, but tried once again, and got speaking to a very helpful chap who got in contact with the equally helpful distributor, and they've arranged to send me a pair to try at home.
I came to the conclusion that a pair of Genelec 8010A would probably be the most sensible choice for now.
I'd originally tried a couple of times to contact Quested to see if they thought the V2104's would work for me. They didn't reply to their contact form, and they didn't answer the phone when I tried a couple of times on different days. I'd almost given up, but tried once again, and got speaking to a very helpful chap who got in contact with the equally helpful distributor, and they've arranged to send me a pair to try at home.
Re: Small monitors
deejayen wrote:...got speaking to a very helpful chap who got in contact with the equally helpful distributor, and they've arranged to send me a pair to try at home.
Well that's a result to be sure - hope it helps solve your monitor decision.
Do keep us informed of your findings!
Martin
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Re: Small monitors
I've used ATC SCM20As (the die-cast aluminium ones) as my preferred 'small' monitor for over 20 years for both stereo and 5.1 work (I have a pair of SCM100As as larger main monitoring but rarely take them out any more as they're so heavy!). Over that time I've tried lots of others but none that offered anything special enough to persuade me to shell out money for them.
Until last year, when I had time properly to check out some of the Genelec "Ones". Funny looking things but quite astonishing. Especially for the size. I ended up buying pairs of the larger 8351Bs and much smaller 8331As. I still have the SCM20As but only because I know them really well, I have projects to finish which have used them all the way through, they're already paid for, and to replace the whole 5.1 set with Ones is prohibitively expensive with the current work climate! And I can do 4.0 with the Ones I have (or 4.1 if I use the ATC sub).
Until last year, when I had time properly to check out some of the Genelec "Ones". Funny looking things but quite astonishing. Especially for the size. I ended up buying pairs of the larger 8351Bs and much smaller 8331As. I still have the SCM20As but only because I know them really well, I have projects to finish which have used them all the way through, they're already paid for, and to replace the whole 5.1 set with Ones is prohibitively expensive with the current work climate! And I can do 4.0 with the Ones I have (or 4.1 if I use the ATC sub).
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- forumuser840717
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Re: Small monitors
Thanks very much. I have thought about the 8331, but again I think they're too big, plus they'd be an even bigger financial hit!
I've got the Questeds plugged in now, sitting on ISO-Pucks on my wooden shelf, so they're just about at the right height. They're about 60cm (2ft), so pretty close.
Bearing in mind I've never used monitors before, I think they sound fabulous. I've been struggling with headphones, and the monitors seem to have a clarity my headphones don't have. Everything seems to sound natural and balanced. I thought maybe my room would skew things, and it probably is, but I can't hear anything which sounds off. The centre image and stereo spread are also really good. In fact, ignoring the bass limits of a small box, I can't really imagine how they could be improved.
I've been mainly listening to well recorded Nashville stuff, which sounds great. With some older tracks I've heard things like noise, and also strange effects such as the lead vocals being set back in the mix. I also tried monitoring my guitar through them, and could hear fret buzz which has always plagued me, but not been as noticeable when tracking through headphones.
Life is never straightforward, though! My dilemma now is wondering if all monitors would sound similarly good. Could I could get as good a sound for less money, or better if I spent more? My room limits the monitors I can get, so there's probably not a lot of choice beyond these, but some of the others mentioned in this thread are much cheaper.
Is it worth trying to demo some more, or should I simply decide that these will probably do a good job, and splash out on them?
I've got the Questeds plugged in now, sitting on ISO-Pucks on my wooden shelf, so they're just about at the right height. They're about 60cm (2ft), so pretty close.
Bearing in mind I've never used monitors before, I think they sound fabulous. I've been struggling with headphones, and the monitors seem to have a clarity my headphones don't have. Everything seems to sound natural and balanced. I thought maybe my room would skew things, and it probably is, but I can't hear anything which sounds off. The centre image and stereo spread are also really good. In fact, ignoring the bass limits of a small box, I can't really imagine how they could be improved.
I've been mainly listening to well recorded Nashville stuff, which sounds great. With some older tracks I've heard things like noise, and also strange effects such as the lead vocals being set back in the mix. I also tried monitoring my guitar through them, and could hear fret buzz which has always plagued me, but not been as noticeable when tracking through headphones.
Life is never straightforward, though! My dilemma now is wondering if all monitors would sound similarly good. Could I could get as good a sound for less money, or better if I spent more? My room limits the monitors I can get, so there's probably not a lot of choice beyond these, but some of the others mentioned in this thread are much cheaper.
Is it worth trying to demo some more, or should I simply decide that these will probably do a good job, and splash out on them?
Re: Small monitors
Given your size constraints I doubt you'll find anything much better any cheaper. I've not heard the Questeds but reading Phil's review makes me think that they have created a very accurate speaker provided you can live with the lack of anything under 100Hz. I have used both the NS10 and LS3/5a that Phil mentions and it seems that Quested have produced something that works as well, if not better, but without the foibles of either.
I thought I'd just check the prices of LS3/5a's and it appears that Rogers have just started making BBC licenced versions again but the price is nearly £3k! And that's without an amplifier.
I thought I'd just check the prices of LS3/5a's and it appears that Rogers have just started making BBC licenced versions again but the price is nearly £3k! And that's without an amplifier.
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