The All-New Behringer Keyboards 'n' Stuff Thread

[Arpangel]

Brains review.
Starts with a ramble through a tree swamp, which sets the tone for the rather talky video.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=M-j7vR3zQno

I’ve got a lot of Berry stuff, modules especially, but this really is too close to the knuckle for me, plus, it looks tacky, really tacky, the whole thing is like some sort of a morality test for buyers.

[Dan LB]

this really is too close to the knuckle for me, plus, it looks tacky, really tacky, the whole thing is like some sort of a morality test for buyers.

The following is a list of manufacturers I could find who make a clone of Mutable Instruments ’Plaits’:

Michigan Synth Works
CalSynth
After Later Audio
Warped Circuits
Antumbra
Tall Dog
ST Modular
Blue Lantern Modules
Oscillosaurus
Codex Modulex
Tunefish Modular

And now….. Behringer

Why is it only a problem that Behringer are making a clone?
Plaits is open source and available to anyone that wants to recreate / modify it.

My stance regarding their business practices has changed somewhat over the last few weeks. I used to hate the idea of them blatantly ripping off other people’s designs but I’ve realised that this sort of cloning is happening all over the industry and it’s not entirely fair that Behringer are the only ones taking any flak for it IMO.

Warm Audio, Black Lion Audio, Golden Age Project, Heritage Audio, BAE,
WES Audio, Summit Audio, Tube-Tech and loads more are making clones of gear that is still currently for sale by the original manufacturers. No problem there though… a lot of them even advertise in the pages of SOS.

I wonder if MusicTribe had branded the 1176 clone as Behringer rather than KT would there have been more outrage?

Loads of plugin manufacturers are cloning, or maybe more accurately emulating, but still using familiar GUI layouts that are unmistakable.

A company called Cyclone Analogic have been making clones of old Roland gear (TB303 and TR606) for years. Creamware and Studio Electronics made Minimoog clones. The list is endless.

It’s rampant, mostly legal as far as I can tell and it’s not just Behringer doing it.

[Arpangel]

The following is a list of manufacturers I could find who make a clone of Mutable Instruments ’Plaits’:

Michigan Synth Works
CalSynth
After Later Audio
Warped Circuits
Antumbra
Tall Dog
ST Modular
Blue Lantern Modules
Oscillosaurus
Codex Modulex
Tunefish Modular

That’s true, you’ve got a point there, I suppose it’s got a lot to do with the tacky appearance, AFAIC, it just doesn’t look classy at all.

[Dan LB]

it just doesn’t look classy at all.

Agreed! It looks terrible

[Folderol]

Personally, provided a piece of kit does what I want, the crappier it looks the better as far as I'm concerned.
Firstly there's less likelihood of someone wanting to nick it, and secondly I love the look on peoples faces going from disdain to astonishment when they hear the results

[Ben Asaro]

The following is a list of manufacturers I could find who make a clone of Mutable Instruments ’Plaits’:

... with the notable exception that MI's code is open source, so what you're comparing is effectively apples and oranges.

Behringer's overall business strategy is entirely reprehensible to me, but I feel that horse has been beaten to death here and anyone posting regularly in this thread ultimately doesn't care and isn't about to change their minds if what has happened thus far with Behringer hasn't done so already.

[Dan LB]

... with the notable exception that MI's code is open source, so what you're comparing is effectively apples and oranges.

Ah right. Yes that makes sense. So is the open source nature of the code just to allow people to modify it for use with MI’s hardware only?

[Ben Asaro]

Nope, the designer made it open so whoever wants to use the code, can.

[Dan LB]

Ok Ben, I think either I have misunderstood you or vice versa.
I mentioned in my first post that Plaits is open source. What is it about my comparison that makes it apples to oranges? Genuinely confused

[t-sun]

Looks like the RD-9 may not actually arrive this year at all at this point, there's been another delay. Didn't they post pictures of boxes of the things a few months ago? I wonder if they're sitting on a container ship that can't be unloaded because of the backlog.

[Eddy Deegan]

When it comes to music tech hardware, you're not alone. I pre-ordered a newly announced synth more than 2 months ago, as soon as it became possible to do so. Originally delivery was expected at some point in the last week but subsequent to an update from the supplier-to-my-vendor it's now been pushed back to mid November.

Disappointing but there are more important things in life to worry about and in a year or two I'll hardly remember the delay occurred at all

[The Elf]

I suspect Eddy and me are on the same waiting list for one device!

I've also been waiting for another two pre-orders, one for at least 18 months (I've forgotten when I made the order TBH!), the other for six months-ish. It's a strange world we now live in.

But I can live with it. When they arrive they'll be nice surprises.

[BigRedX]

Which is why I have stopped buying things that aren't actually in stock and ready send out or for me to take home.

At the moment if I'm in the market for something it's because I need it NOW. If it's not available now, it doesn't matter how potentially brilliant it is likely to be I'll have to look for an alternative that is available now even if it might not be quite so good.

I'll consider "upgrading" when the item I originally want is finally available to buy but by that time I may have become too used to the item I originally bought to be bother to change it (or I might have discovered things on it that suit me perfectly and have no desire to change anyway).

[Eddy Deegan]

I suspect Eddy and me are on the same waiting list for one device!

I have a hunch you're right

Ahh well, at least there are other things to play with weil weiling away the time!

[Red Noise]

Is it just me, or do the bosses of Behringer do a lot of promise-y stuff, about future products ?

I swear I saw a Facebook post about their proposed design of a CR78 clone a few years ago, which never came to pass.

Anyway, Behringer products are low cost and often poor build quality, imho.

[The Elf]

Anyway, Behringer products are low cost and often poor build quality, imho.

Often, but not always - and in recent times, not even so often.

Try the X range of mixers (largely based on Midas technolgy), or the VC-340, which is very well built.

I'm no Behringer-phile, but credit where it is due - they make some decent stuff nowadays.

[t-sun]

I remember the CR-78 clone, I also remember wondering why on earth they'd bother. The sound was only slightly different from the 808 and since they're doing a V2 of that with their new chip I assume they realized there was no point in a CR-78 clone.

Behringer has definitely got a problem with announcing new products way too early with huge lead times to production, much less shipping. I've had my preorder for the RD-9 in since March, and at this point I'm not expecting to get it until next year. Sure, there is a massive global shipping crisis right now, but it wouldn't feel like that big of a delay if I hadn't been waiting on it for literally years now already.

As far as the build quality goes, I have the MS-1, TB-3, Wasp, Pro-1 and RD-8 and have zero complaints about any of them, particularly the metal cases on the last three. Having owned an SH-101, the MS-1 is definitely more solid, as you'd hope a modern build would be. Only problem I've had is that Berhinger removed an RD-8 firmware update from their site that is required to apply the later updates, and I haven't been able to find it so I think mine is stuck on 1.37 or something for the time being.

[The Elf]

I remember the CR-78 clone, I also remember wondering why on earth they'd bother. The sound was only slightly different from the 808...

The CR-78 sounds nothing like the 808! Listen to any of the sounds - they're very different. And the CR-78's quirky guiro, metal and gorgeous tambourine - not on the 808!

I have a TR-8S and the sounds I miss most from it are the CR-78, so I've added my own samples. I really wish that Roland had seen fit to add the CR-78 as modelled sounds to the TR-8/TR-8S. Yet they chose to give us the tiresome TR-707/727... sigh.

[t-sun]

Ah, I forgot about the missing sounds. The basic kit is very similar if a bit softer and smoother on the 78 as I recall. It's been many years since I had a chance to play with a CR series machine and my abiding memory was that it sounded more organ-top-accompaniment-machine-oriented than the more up-front 808, but definitely similar sound generation. Also, extremely oblique programming, particularly in comparison with the X0X style. I'm fine with Behringer cloning old machines, but if it means keeping the negatives like that I'll pass.

And the 707 was just incredibly flat. Not as flat as the 505 but, still. Back fifteen years ago when I was thoroughly broke but wanted a drum machine with that Roland programming method and a trigger output, I had one. I think I sold it and bought a 626 at half the price

[Arpangel]

I'm fine with Behringer cloning old machines, but if it means keeping the negatives like that I'll pass.

After going to great lengths to get the ARP 2500 modules, I know what you mean.