Buying microphone cable, 100m drums.

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Re: Buying microphone cable, 100m drums.

Post by Hugh Robjohns »

I found them much easier to use, especially when needing to open or switch between faders quickly.

Reversed quadrant faders were the best, ergonomically -- that up and over action follows the natural movement of the wrist very well -- but reversed flat faders are okay.

To open a fader to a set level, you just drop your thumb in front of the required fader level, and then use your 3rd/4th fingers to pull the fader up to the thumb. Fast, accurate and comfortable.

It's not as easy to place your 3rd/4th finger beyond the mark and push the faders up with a thumb. Possible, of course, but it's not as comfortable or easy to do, and I don't think it as accurate or precise, either.

For semi-static music mixes the faders direction makes little difference, but for a fast news or panel programme it really does!

And then there are other practical benefits, like not accidentally knocking a faders open with your jacket sleeve... ;)
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Re: Buying microphone cable, 100m drums.

Post by Rob Kirkwood »

Also gives you space to put your coffee cup.

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Re: Buying microphone cable, 100m drums.

Post by Hugh Robjohns »

:shocked::o:shock:
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Re: Buying microphone cable, 100m drums.

Post by Arpangel »

I’ve got a red LED studio light, it’s only small, but it works, I’ve just never got around to wiring it up.
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Re: Buying microphone cable, 100m drums.

Post by Music Wolf »

Hugh Robjohns wrote: Tue Jul 27, 2021 10:02 pm And then there are other practical benefits, like not accidentally knocking a faders open with your jacket sleeve... ;)

For the benefit of any younger readers who may have wandered in. This is how we used to lay down those sick beats back in the day.

Image
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Re: Buying microphone cable, 100m drums.

Post by Wonks »

Back in the day? Look into the studio and you can see Ed Sheeran! This is cutting edge technology.
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Re: Buying microphone cable, 100m drums.

Post by Arpangel »

Wonks wrote: Wed Jul 28, 2021 8:30 am Back in the day? Look into the studio and you can see Ed Sheeran! This is cutting edge technology.

We’ve got frosted glass on our studio door, the control room is in the basement, and the live room is upstairs, what I need is CCTV.
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Re: Buying microphone cable, 100m drums.

Post by Hugh Robjohns »

I'm nearly out of Brylcreem.... :lol:
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Re: Buying microphone cable, 100m drums.

Post by Wonks »

Hugh Robjohns wrote: Wed Jul 28, 2021 9:40 am I'm nearly out of Brylcreem.... :lol:

A little goes a long way with you these days. ;)
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Re: Buying microphone cable, 100m drums.

Post by blinddrew »

Music Wolf wrote: Wed Jul 28, 2021 8:01 am
Hugh Robjohns wrote: Tue Jul 27, 2021 10:02 pm And then there are other practical benefits, like not accidentally knocking a faders open with your jacket sleeve... ;)

For the benefit of any younger readers who may have wandered in. This is how we used to lay down those sick beats back in the day.

Image

So presumably all these microphones are fully open? (Other than channel 8)
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Re: Buying microphone cable, 100m drums.

Post by Hugh Robjohns »

Nope. That's a commercial music studio (Abbey Road?) using the faders in what has become the 'conventional way', not a BBC studio.

The real reason the BBC used faders opening towards the operator is entirely logical.

The early broadcast consoles, like this Type B desk, used rotary faders -- big knobs that you operated by rotating your wrist. They were fast and accurate, but you could only operate a maximum of two at a time.
typeb.jpg
Then someone came up with the idea of a 'linear fader' with a pivoted arm which dragged contacts across an arc of studs, each connected to a chain of resistors to make an adjustable balanced attenuator. (Note the two microswitches which operate at each end of the fader travel.)

Image

This arrangement allows a lot of faders to be placed next to each other so that several could be operated with separate fingers, allowing multiple channels to be balanced simultaneously, and allowing far more channels to be controlled in a compact desk.

However, the fader knob obviously travels on an arc -- it goes up and over. Here is a Painton quadrant fader looking end on, with a BBC fader scale.
Image

If that is installed into a flat console desktop, then the scale numbers on the side away from the operator (0-10) become invisible and so it's impossible to open the fader accurately to a particular mark because you can't see it.

But if the fader is configured to open towards the operator, it becomes very easy to open to a particular setting because that's marked on the side facing the operator.

Standard BBC practice was to use 23 (the scale goes up to 30) as the unity gain point on the fader. During rehearsals the operator would 'take levels' and note down the required fader setting on the script -- 20, 23, 27 or whatever it might need. During the recording/broadcast they would note the required value from their script for an upcoming source, place their thumb on the scale in the appropriate position, and be confident that they would open the fader to exactly the right mark every time. The up-and-over action also worked very well with the human wrist -- it is a very natural movement.

EMI also used Painton quadrant faders, but with a different scale and in the opposite direction. The scale had 'Out' at the near end (off) and went up to (I think) +20 at the far end, with ) at the unity mark.

Image

Another nice feature of those Painton quadrant faders was that they could be fitted with lightbulbs at each end to illuminate the perspex cover. That could be used to indicate active channels or, when different colour bulbs were used, to indicate channel group routing (or other functions).

Image

This was over forty years before Studer decided to 'invent' the idea of coloured fader slots to indicate channel routing etc, and patent it as 'FaderGlow'... (Now also seen on some Soundcraft digital consoles too)
faderglow.jpg
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Re: Buying microphone cable, 100m drums.

Post by Arpangel »

Music Wolf wrote: Wed Jul 28, 2021 8:01 am
For the benefit of any younger readers who may have wandered in. This is how we used to lay down those sick beats back in the day.

Image


I’m trying to pin down those large monitors, I see a Quad 33/50e under the right hand speaker, but can’t work out what those monitors are.
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Re: Buying microphone cable, 100m drums.

Post by nathanscribe »

Fascinating! Something new every day etc :thumbup:
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Re: Buying microphone cable, 100m drums.

Post by Dan LB »

Thanks for the info Hugh. Fascinating stuff indeed.

I’m definitely going to have to try it out.

As for the ‘fader glow’ you can also find it on some newer Calrecs too…

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Re: Buying microphone cable, 100m drums.

Post by Hugh Robjohns »

Arpangel wrote: Wed Jul 28, 2021 10:31 am I’m trying to pin down those large monitors, I see a Quad 33/50e under the right hand speaker, but can’t work out what those monitors are.

My guess would be Altec Lansing 605A 'Duplex' monitors

Here's the 'hi-fi' version:

Image

Comprised a 15-inch woofer with a mid/treble horn. Used at Abbey Road in the pop music studios (2/3 -- and that picture looks to me like it's Studio 3) from the 1960s.
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