We don’t really have salaries in our dimension.

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We don’t really have salaries in our dimension.

Post by Arpangel »

Thought this may be the best place to post this, after all, it’s about inspiration, to create music.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Z8nppTSY-Rs

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=HKmzFVCgzm0
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That would be an ecumenical matter.

Re: We don’t really have salaries in our dimension.

Post by resistorman »

Well, that’s a deep subject…
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Re: We don’t really have salaries in our dimension.

Post by Forum Admin »

Classic vids!
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Re: We don’t really have salaries in our dimension.

Post by Arpangel »

resistorman wrote: Thu Jul 29, 2021 3:16 pm Well, that’s a deep subject…

It is.

Forum Admin wrote: Thu Jul 29, 2021 11:19 pm Classic vids!

They are.

There are so many eccentric people who think that just because they are eccentric means that they are automatically a genius at something, I hope I don’t fall into that category, maybe I think I’m good at something and that makes me automatically an eccentric.
People like Sun Ra are who they are, they couldn’t be anyone else, or do a regular job, they were destined to do what they did.
My posts here are becoming more and more stream of consciousness, and I’m feeling that whatever made me want to maintain a vague connection with so called normality, our everyday routine is rapidly disappearing, my partner feels the same way too.
We feel we are slowly drifting away, and we have no interest in the things or people that held us, anymore.
I think that’s why we are watching videos like the ones here, and are only attracted to people that are totally uncompromising, and absorbed in what they do. I know our relatives and friends are very wary of us two, whatever they think of us.
I find Sun Ra inspiring, I like watching Robert Fripp, because of his intensity, and genius, same with Genesis P Orridge, Joe Zawinul, Lou Reed, William Burroughs, Brian Eno no, he held my hand for many years, as an inspiration, but it’s all gone now, whatever he had has gone for me, like a friend that we drift away from.
What am I talking about? It doesn’t matter, it all contributes to our music, and our inspiration, everything we say write or do.
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That would be an ecumenical matter.

Re: We don’t really have salaries in our dimension.

Post by tea for two »

Arpangel wrote: Fri Jul 30, 2021 11:30 am
People like Sun Ra are who they are, they couldn’t be anyone else, or do a regular job, they were destined to do what they did.

I find Sun Ra inspiring


I read Sun Ra composed 100 albums, over 1K songs.
He was as prolific as several Classical composers considered genius.
Some of Classical composers, their Sister or Wife composed some of their works lol.

Sun Ra was a genius.

Space is the Place is one of those musical vocal phrases stuck in my mind.

Electronically Sun Ra

*1970 My Bother the Wind Vol1.
Marriage of Moog Funk Jazz. Afro Futurism.
https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=N5SQBoNIWx0
3 years before Herbie Hancock's Sextant 1973 album of Electronica Jazz Funk.

1970 The Night of the Purple Room
https://m.youtube.com/playlist?list=PLF314F8D0D67333A1
Fully Synth Soul Blues on tracks Blue Soul and Narrative.

::::

Arpangel wrote: Fri Jul 30, 2021 11:30 am Brian Eno no, he held my hand for many years, as an inspiration, but it’s all gone now, whatever he had has gone for me, like a friend that we drift away from.


Re Brian Eno in my past month research of Electronic music 1940-2020 I've realised Eno borrowed from other Electronic musicians for his Ambient works including his first solo Ambient 1975 Discreet Music.
His 1982 Land album is pretty much a direct copy of a 1972 Electronic Ambient album.
It was funny Eno naming 1978 Airports Ambient1 when it was no such thing.

But then every musician copies, borrows : from the first chants thousands of years earlier to now and in every style of music.

So it's alright Eno borrowing copying other Electronic musicians .
I've borrowed from copied so many Electronic musicians
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Re: We don’t really have salaries in our dimension.

Post by Arpangel »

tea for two wrote: Fri Jul 30, 2021 11:51 am
His 1982 Land album is pretty much a direct copy of a 1972 Electronic Ambient album.

Are you thinking of Sonic Seasonings, by Wendy Carlos? In which case yes, On Land wasn’t so new in that context I’ve heard that said by many people, both great records though, in their own right.

tea for two wrote: Fri Jul 30, 2021 11:51 am
It was funny Eno naming 1978 Airports Ambient1 when it was no such thing.


I think maybe he wanted it to be known as the first record in that series?
Eno has said in various interviews that he was a pioneer in a lot of areas, sometimes yes, sometimes no, but he always was/is a great self promoter.
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That would be an ecumenical matter.

Re: We don’t really have salaries in our dimension.

Post by tea for two »

Arpangel wrote: Fri Jul 30, 2021 2:06 pm
tea for two wrote: Fri Jul 30, 2021 11:51 am
His 1982 Land album is pretty much a direct copy of a 1972 Electronic Ambient album.

Are you thinking of Sonic Seasonings, by Wendy Carlos? In which case yes, On Land wasn’t so new in that context

Yep Sonic Seasonings.
I only purchased it on vinyl (double) last month. Only then realised what Eno did.

"Progressive Ambient" of 1990-2020 can be traced to Sonic Seasonings :
Another Fine Day, Boards of Canada, Biosphere, Fennesz,  Monolake, Tim Hecker, Thomas Koner, William Basinski.

Arpangel wrote: Fri Jul 30, 2021 2:06 pm
tea for two wrote: Fri Jul 30, 2021 11:51 am
It was funny Eno naming 1978 Airports Ambient1 when it was no such thing.

I think maybe he wanted it to be known as the first record in that series?
Eno has said in various interviews that he was a pioneer in a lot of areas, sometimes yes, sometimes no, but he always was/is a great self promoter.

It is comical when someone musically says they pioneered this and that. I can't take Brian seriously. I would just face palm, giggle if he said those things to me.
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Re: We don’t really have salaries in our dimension.

Post by Arpangel »

tea for two wrote: Tue Aug 03, 2021 9:05 am
It is comical when someone musically says they pioneered this and that. I can't take Brian seriously. I would just face palm, giggle if he said those things to me.

He changed the direction of music at a certain time, and changed attitudes, more importantly.
The whole non-musician thing, being able to influence people and have success, without "paying your dues"
He would be the first to say he didn’t do anything single handedly, and he has talked about what he calls "scenius" as opposed to genius, instead of one person taking all the credit, it’s always about a movement, a scene, but as usual, there will always be one person that has more exposure, ability, than the others, that pokes up above the crowd, and actually makes things happen.
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That would be an ecumenical matter.

Re: We don’t really have salaries in our dimension.

Post by tea for two »

Arpangel wrote: Tue Aug 03, 2021 9:39 am
He changed the direction of music at a certain time, and changed attitudes, more importantly.
The whole non-musician thing, being able to influence people and have success, without "paying your dues"
He would be the first to say he didn’t do anything single handedly, and he has talked about what he calls "scenius" as opposed to genius, instead of one person taking all the credit, it’s always about a movement, a scene, but as usual, there will always be one person that has more exposure, ability, than the others, that pokes up above the crowd, and actually makes things happen.

I would say the "Universe" points at some persons and says : you.
Because they are meant to have a Worldwide impact or Humanitarian impact

John Coltrane, Bob Dylan, Hendrix, The Beatles, Nina Simone, Joni Mitchell, Jarre, just to name a few.

I suppose Eno is more (as you say) judgement, also analysis. These in itself is a skill.
Brian was able to spot something he could piggyback across a few different styles.
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Re: We don’t really have salaries in our dimension.

Post by Arpangel »

tea for two wrote: Tue Aug 03, 2021 10:50 am
I would say the "Universe" points at some persons and says : you.
Because they are meant to have a Worldwide impact or Humanitarian impact

John Coltrane, Bob Dylan, Hendrix, The Beatles, Nina Simone, Joni Mitchell, Jarre, just to name a few.

OK, maybe you can take this further, and help me out.
If, what you say is the way it happens, then whoever is doing the pointing must have lost a finger.
At the risk of appearing an old person, god forbid, or a reactionary, I’m not seeing anyone who’s coming through to replace the people you mentioned.
It’s very genre specific, and those are people from the past, who had their day, but that aside, I’m still not hearing anything that I would call genuinely original, in any genre, old, or new.
Which, leads me to believe, maybe it’s not the finger of god, imaybe at the time those people were around, there were still lots of barriers to break, lots things to discover, and if they hadn’t done it someone else would have, they were in the right place at the right time, and, fully loaded with talent, all the right ingredients.
Now, the ground isn’t so fertile, it’s been done to death, seeds have to work a lot harder to grow, fertile ground is hard to find, every remote corner of every field has a bunch of farmers on it.
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That would be an ecumenical matter.

Re: We don’t really have salaries in our dimension.

Post by resistorman »

Arpangel wrote: Tue Aug 03, 2021 11:25 am Now, the ground isn’t so fertile, it’s been done to death, seeds have to work a lot harder to grow, fertile ground is hard to find, every remote corner of every field has a bunch of farmers on it.

I've been thinking about this for awhile, and it seems to me that what's missing is cultural isolation. New forms of music come about when musicians of different cultures meet, dig what the other is doing and combine it with their own. The 20th century is full of examples, particularly the final fusion of the great tectonic plates of European and African musical traditions, which seems to be complete.

An example comes from my own experience. Living in a small town in Pennsylvania, I was never exposed to the Blues, so when I heard Led Zeppelin and Cream I thought that it was cool new English music, not even knowing it was based on music from my own country, that the roots of Rock and Roll are the Blues. That's some serious cultural isolation. Even though there were a lot of recordings of the Black Blues pioneers, I just didn't hear them because of the deep racism in my country.

Most people on the planet are exposed to the same music now, so there are few isolated pockets for new language to develop, if you will. There are plenty of accents, just like English around the world, but nothing genuinely new.
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Re: We don’t really have salaries in our dimension.

Post by tea for two »

Arpangel wrote: Tue Aug 03, 2021 11:25 am
tea for two wrote: Tue Aug 03, 2021 10:50 am
I would say the "Universe" points at some persons and says : you.
Because they are meant to have a Worldwide impact or Humanitarian impact

John Coltrane, Bob Dylan, Hendrix, The Beatles, Nina Simone, Joni Mitchell, Jarre, just to name a few.

OK, maybe you can take this further, and help me out.
If, what you say is the way it happens, then whoever is doing the pointing must have lost a finger.
At the risk of appearing an old person, god forbid, or a reactionary, I’m not seeing anyone who’s coming through to replace the people you mentioned.
It’s very genre specific, and those are people from the past, who had their day, but that aside, I’m still not hearing anything that I would call genuinely original, in any genre, old, or new.


Those, let's say original persons, were selected  to farm the land so that others as well as those afterwards could reap the benefits of their toil as it were.

The "It" or whatever we want to call, that points the finger, 
does a few things through music :

*Most important is the humane.
For this, the music need not be original.
The music just needs to mean something to someone....
just one person (even if it is our own music), a few, a thousand, millions, Worldwide.

(of course there is deathmetal lol warmetal, also hate music etc but that's some people being whatever).

*The second important is employment, financial.
So that, persons Worldwide could feed themselves, feed their family, having a roof,
having something meaningful to do :
audio equipment designing manufacturing, audio engineering, foh, roadies, magazine writers publishers, audio software makers, app makers, merchandise makers, concert venues, festivals, so forth.

For this also, the "It", that is the source of music, requires no originality in the music.
Just that there is music.
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Re: We don’t really have salaries in our dimension.

Post by RichardT »

resistorman wrote: Tue Aug 03, 2021 3:36 pm
Arpangel wrote: Tue Aug 03, 2021 11:25 am Now, the ground isn’t so fertile, it’s been done to death, seeds have to work a lot harder to grow, fertile ground is hard to find, every remote corner of every field has a bunch of farmers on it.

I've been thinking about this for awhile, and it seems to me that what's missing is cultural isolation. New forms of music come about when musicians of different cultures meet, dig what the other is doing and combine it with their own. The 20th century is full of examples, particularly the final fusion of the great tectonic plates of European and African musical traditions, which seems to be complete.

An example comes from my own experience. Living in a small town in Pennsylvania, I was never exposed to the Blues, so when I heard Led Zeppelin and Cream I thought that it was cool new English music, not even knowing it was based on music from my own country, that the roots of Rock and Roll are the Blues. That's some serious cultural isolation. Even though there were a lot of recordings of the Black Blues pioneers, I just didn't hear them because of the deep racism in my country.

Most people on the planet are exposed to the same music now, so there are few isolated pockets for new language to develop, if you will. There are plenty of accents, just like English around the world, but nothing genuinely new.

I think that’s very true. But there’s a more positive aspect to the situation in that musicians now have instant access to music of every culture and era - millions of tracks. So it’s possible to select ideas from an absolutely vast palette.
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Re: We don’t really have salaries in our dimension.

Post by Arpangel »

RichardT wrote: Tue Aug 03, 2021 7:55 pm
resistorman wrote: Tue Aug 03, 2021 3:36 pm
Arpangel wrote: Tue Aug 03, 2021 11:25 am Now, the ground isn’t so fertile, it’s been done to death, seeds have to work a lot harder to grow, fertile ground is hard to find, every remote corner of every field has a bunch of farmers on it.

I've been thinking about this for awhile, and it seems to me that what's missing is cultural isolation. New forms of music come about when musicians of different cultures meet, dig what the other is doing and combine it with their own. The 20th century is full of examples, particularly the final fusion of the great tectonic plates of European and African musical traditions, which seems to be complete.

An example comes from my own experience. Living in a small town in Pennsylvania, I was never exposed to the Blues, so when I heard Led Zeppelin and Cream I thought that it was cool new English music, not even knowing it was based on music from my own country, that the roots of Rock and Roll are the Blues. That's some serious cultural isolation. Even though there were a lot of recordings of the Black Blues pioneers, I just didn't hear them because of the deep racism in my country.

Most people on the planet are exposed to the same music now, so there are few isolated pockets for new language to develop, if you will. There are plenty of accents, just like English around the world, but nothing genuinely new.

I think that’s very true. But there’s a more positive aspect to the situation in that musicians now have instant access to music of every culture and era - millions of tracks. So it’s possible to select ideas from an absolutely vast palette.

But that’s just it, it’s familiarity that’s killed it, it was this sudden discovery of black music by Classical musicians, and later on, by white Rock musicians that was so revolutionary, no one had heard that before, and yes, the technology of transport allowed that to happen, otherwise we’d all be completely unaware. And the trade wasn’t good, we took a lot from black culture, but did we give anything in return? I don’t think we did, on a musical level.
Yes, now we have this great big pallet, but none of it is mysterious anymore, it’s all there in front of us all, and it’s too easy to access, no effort involved, which tends to devalue it, like most of the technical things we can do these days "you did that on a computer yeah? anyone can do that, can’t they?"
People say that to me all the time, and TBQH, I really don’t know what to say.
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That would be an ecumenical matter.

Re: We don’t really have salaries in our dimension.

Post by SecretSam »

I think it's still possible to be surprised by new music, exactly because of the vast stores of it that we can all access.

There is simply too much out there for any human being to hear in a lifetime. This kind of creates some cultural isolation, because we get dragged down our own rabbit hole. The recommendation algorithms in streaming services reinforce that.

I simplify my own listening syllabus by avoiding any artist who is known by a single name, or whose brand has initials in it :-) There is still too much.

Recent discoveries for me include Simon Turner (thanks, Arpangel), Robin Trower (yes I know he's always been famous - just not anywhere I have been), Stefan Bodzin
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Instant gratification is actually pretty good. It's fast as well.
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