I've got a Korg Krome as my piano at home hooked up to a pair of Mackie MR-5 Studio Monitors. It sounds great. I want a keyboard amp that is going to sound like that. I had a Peavy KB-4. It sounded so tinny and harsh. I HATED it. Got rid of it.
I tried an EV-powered speaker at the store hooked up to a Yamaha CP and it sounded too boomy. To much lower end. Muddy. I tried a Roland KC-600 hooked up to a Roland RD-2000. It sounded the opposite. Lacking in the low end. Sounded unimpressive. Bland.
My piano teacher who knows his stuff has been gigging with a Behringer Ultratone for years now and he loves it. I haven't gotten to try it out.
I just want it to sound like my studio monitors. How hard can it be? Why is it so hard? My studio monitors don't have 15" woofers. They have little 5" woofers but they sound amazing.
Can I just download the frequency response charts for all of them and compare them with my studio monitors and look for something matching? Do I go with something like the EV, and EQ out the bottom end? Do I just trust my piano teacher and try a Behrigner?
What to do, what to do? Help!
Keyboard Amps or Powered Speaker for Digital Piano?
Re: Keyboard Amps or Powered Speaker for Digital Piano?
Welcome to the forum.
Where are you intending to use the setup? Is this for playing live or to replace your monitors at home. If the latter, why?
Where are you intending to use the setup? Is this for playing live or to replace your monitors at home. If the latter, why?
Re: Keyboard Amps or Powered Speaker for Digital Piano?
Hi and welcome.
You haven’t been very specific in what powered PA speakers you tried out e.g. EV make many ranges of speakers, and their styles vary from the standard one box to line arrays. So knowing what models you tried would help put things into context.
Some general observations:
1. Presumably you were using a single monitor or keyboard amp, so a mono output from the keyboard, and I presume the Krome is played in stereo? A lot of keyboard sounds aren’t as impressive in mono as in stereo. If you haven’t already, compare the sound of the Krome in mono through your speakers. There have been a few posts on here recently about the difference.
2. You obviously had to use what was available in store when testing out speakers, but each keyboard has its own particular sound balance and some keyboards do have a lot more bass than others and some are a bit bass light in comparison. So it really is best to use the same keyboard for all the speakers.
If you can’t take the Krome with you when testing, if you had a portable recorder with line inputs, you could record the direct output of the Krome which you can then play back through the different speakers and have a constant reference source.
3. What volumes were you listening to the speakers at compared to at home? If you’ve heard of equal loudness contours for hearing, you’ll know that our EQ balance changes as sounds get louder, so louder sounds will sound more bassy and trebbly than quieter sounds. So even the Krome will sound more bassy if you are hearing it at a louder volume.
4. The store’s acoustic environment will be different to your normal listening environment, and I’ll assume its significantly bigger. So it will have different room modes, where certain frequencies are amplified or reduced. Position within the room will also have an effect on the level of the room modes So there is a possibility that the room itself was more bassy, or at least it highlighted lower bass frequencies than your room at home does.
5. The MR5s are actually pretty good at bass extension and measurement plots show they are ‘flat’ down to 60Hz and are -10dB down at 50Hz, so not bad for 5” speakers. So even your average low cost 15” PA speaker won’t have a much greater bass extension, but it will produce a much greater volume, which will alter the perceived EQ (see 3. above).
But you may not need 15” speakers. These days, even 8” speakers can be very loud and have a lot of bass, and could better match the frequency characteristics of the MR5s.
6. Not all PA speakers are as flat sounding as they would suggest. I like the Alto TS3xx range for good performance at a low cost, but even with the preset EQ section set flat on them, they have a pronounced bass and treble boost, so require some EQ. I find the Yamaha DXR range to have a much flatter response, but are more expensive.
7. How loud do you need the speakers and what sort of budget? And is this for solo performance or a band situation? In a band context, the FOH PA will be doing the heavy lifting, so you’ll just need something for monitoring. And you definitely won’t want too much bass as you’ll be getting that back from the PA.
The Bose L1 has been mentioned here recently as a good speaker for putting piano through if you don’t need stadium levels. As the sub has its own level control, this can be used to balance the bass level against the mids and treble.
The reality is that whatever speaker you get, you’ll want some EQ to tweak the sound to the venue and volume you’re playing at. If the speaker doesn’t have suitable EQ controls built in (ones with digital processing can do quite a lot), then something like the Boss EQ-200 pedal could be a solution. You could use a small mixer, but the EQ might be too basic.
Did you explore the EQ functionality built into the speakers you tried? These are often preset choices, but unless you know how the ones in the store were set, you don’t know if they were set up for a hefty bass and treble boost.
You haven’t been very specific in what powered PA speakers you tried out e.g. EV make many ranges of speakers, and their styles vary from the standard one box to line arrays. So knowing what models you tried would help put things into context.
Some general observations:
1. Presumably you were using a single monitor or keyboard amp, so a mono output from the keyboard, and I presume the Krome is played in stereo? A lot of keyboard sounds aren’t as impressive in mono as in stereo. If you haven’t already, compare the sound of the Krome in mono through your speakers. There have been a few posts on here recently about the difference.
2. You obviously had to use what was available in store when testing out speakers, but each keyboard has its own particular sound balance and some keyboards do have a lot more bass than others and some are a bit bass light in comparison. So it really is best to use the same keyboard for all the speakers.
If you can’t take the Krome with you when testing, if you had a portable recorder with line inputs, you could record the direct output of the Krome which you can then play back through the different speakers and have a constant reference source.
3. What volumes were you listening to the speakers at compared to at home? If you’ve heard of equal loudness contours for hearing, you’ll know that our EQ balance changes as sounds get louder, so louder sounds will sound more bassy and trebbly than quieter sounds. So even the Krome will sound more bassy if you are hearing it at a louder volume.
4. The store’s acoustic environment will be different to your normal listening environment, and I’ll assume its significantly bigger. So it will have different room modes, where certain frequencies are amplified or reduced. Position within the room will also have an effect on the level of the room modes So there is a possibility that the room itself was more bassy, or at least it highlighted lower bass frequencies than your room at home does.
5. The MR5s are actually pretty good at bass extension and measurement plots show they are ‘flat’ down to 60Hz and are -10dB down at 50Hz, so not bad for 5” speakers. So even your average low cost 15” PA speaker won’t have a much greater bass extension, but it will produce a much greater volume, which will alter the perceived EQ (see 3. above).
But you may not need 15” speakers. These days, even 8” speakers can be very loud and have a lot of bass, and could better match the frequency characteristics of the MR5s.
6. Not all PA speakers are as flat sounding as they would suggest. I like the Alto TS3xx range for good performance at a low cost, but even with the preset EQ section set flat on them, they have a pronounced bass and treble boost, so require some EQ. I find the Yamaha DXR range to have a much flatter response, but are more expensive.
7. How loud do you need the speakers and what sort of budget? And is this for solo performance or a band situation? In a band context, the FOH PA will be doing the heavy lifting, so you’ll just need something for monitoring. And you definitely won’t want too much bass as you’ll be getting that back from the PA.
The Bose L1 has been mentioned here recently as a good speaker for putting piano through if you don’t need stadium levels. As the sub has its own level control, this can be used to balance the bass level against the mids and treble.
The reality is that whatever speaker you get, you’ll want some EQ to tweak the sound to the venue and volume you’re playing at. If the speaker doesn’t have suitable EQ controls built in (ones with digital processing can do quite a lot), then something like the Boss EQ-200 pedal could be a solution. You could use a small mixer, but the EQ might be too basic.
Did you explore the EQ functionality built into the speakers you tried? These are often preset choices, but unless you know how the ones in the store were set, you don’t know if they were set up for a hefty bass and treble boost.
Reliably fallible.
Re: Keyboard Amps or Powered Speaker for Digital Piano?
I forgot to mention that speaker position will also have an effect on the level of bass. Most one-box speakers are designed to be used on a stand, away from walls and so pretty much free-standing.
Given that the lowest bass frequencies are radiated in all directions from the speaker enclosure, if the speakers in the store were on shelves against the wall, then there could be a considerable boost in bass from reflections back off the walls and shelving.
It’s the reason that most active monitors have a selector switch for free standing, 1/4 and 1/2 space positioning, so that the bass can be reduced if necessary if the monitors are against the wall or right in a corner.
Active PA speakers generally don’t have such adjustments built-in, though some do have bass and treble controls (some have a mid control as well) which can help and some with powerful DSP may have a more comprehensive EQ function available, often via a phone/tablet app using Bluetooth. But generally they expect any corrective EQ to be applied from the mixing desk (including any associated outboard EQ units).
The ‘stick’ line array + sub arrangement (like the Bose L1 and similar units) will already take into consideration the fact the sub is sitting on the floor in its voicing. But positioning one against a wall will also boost the bass level.
So it’s important to listen to the speaker in the position you’d normally use it in if you are concerned about bass response. If you are going to use it on a stand, then try it out on a stand.
Given that the lowest bass frequencies are radiated in all directions from the speaker enclosure, if the speakers in the store were on shelves against the wall, then there could be a considerable boost in bass from reflections back off the walls and shelving.
It’s the reason that most active monitors have a selector switch for free standing, 1/4 and 1/2 space positioning, so that the bass can be reduced if necessary if the monitors are against the wall or right in a corner.
Active PA speakers generally don’t have such adjustments built-in, though some do have bass and treble controls (some have a mid control as well) which can help and some with powerful DSP may have a more comprehensive EQ function available, often via a phone/tablet app using Bluetooth. But generally they expect any corrective EQ to be applied from the mixing desk (including any associated outboard EQ units).
The ‘stick’ line array + sub arrangement (like the Bose L1 and similar units) will already take into consideration the fact the sub is sitting on the floor in its voicing. But positioning one against a wall will also boost the bass level.
So it’s important to listen to the speaker in the position you’d normally use it in if you are concerned about bass response. If you are going to use it on a stand, then try it out on a stand.
Reliably fallible.