My Eye Your Eye - Feedback welcome please

[Drew Stephenson]

I'm a sensitive soul!

[amanise]

Firstly - thank you all so much for taking the time to do this, as always - amazing!

I have worked though the following issues;

Drums too low - brought them up a bit
Rhythmic drive from the snare added in the verses (carefully)
Changes made to the second verse to make if a little different (rhythm guitar weeded out until the chorus and extra snare hits start here to pick things up a bit)
'listening through a tunnel filled with jelly' in the middle section - hopefully addressed by removing the phasis plug in from the guitar bass from the whole track. (What was I thinking?) Tightens things up down below a bit all the way through and now there are some transients! (I think)
Tweaked up the high mids and the top end - but being careful as I am often too brash!
V2 is now up here, for anyone who wants to have another listen now;

https://soundcloud.com/adrian-manise/my ... al_sharing

Thank you all once again, and see you at the Grammys!
Adrian

[sonics]

What is it you're trying to create?

Lots of your sound, arrangement and mix choices are quite obscure. I have to admit that I got through only 30s of the first mix, and just over a minute of the second. I have no source of reference, and thus I'm unable to comment; it may sound perfect as it is. I can imagine (just about, from what I heard) what I would term a "straightened-out" version, but I guess that's not what you're trying to create? If you want the mix to sound strange, then you've most definitely succeeded (that's praise, not sarcasm).

[Drew Stephenson]

If this was my track, there'd be three things I'd be looking at.
Firstly I think the bass is still a bit too dominant. It's carrying a lot of energy up into the low mids and making it harder for the drums to have space.
Which brings me to secondly, to me the drums and bass parts feel like they're working against each other in the verses, but it might be because the kick isn't coming through clearly enough against the bass. I'm going to guess you recorded the bass part first and then added the drums?
Finally, I'd love to hear a version with a confident, unprocessed, leading vocal.
Sung by you.

I say 'if this was my track' though because these are all stylistic things and it's your vision to execute.

[tea for two]

V2
https://soundcloud.com/adrian-manise/my ... al_sharing

I'm late to the show. I think this would make a triffic instrumental. Also as an instrumental doesn't require any drums percussion.
There's sciencey techy shows this would be superb for as an instrumental theme tune without drums percussion.

[amanise]

What is it you're trying to create?

Lots of your sound, arrangement and mix choices are quite obscure. I have to admit that I got through only 30s of the first mix, and just over a minute of the second. I have no source of reference, and thus I'm unable to comment; it may sound perfect as it is. I can imagine (just about, from what I heard) what I would term a "straightened-out" version, but I guess that's not what you're trying to create? If you want the mix to sound strange, then you've most definitely succeeded (that's praise, not sarcasm).

Yes, obscure is a good way of putting it! There's no plan (apart from using the instrumentation that I like) when I put these together. This is a hobbyist here - not a seasoned pro. Strange is good, this one started withe lyrics - and then the drums were picked out around the rhythm they made. Just about everything I do ends up off beat and syncopated. I paint myself into lots of corners. Thanks for taking the time to test the water!

[amanise]

... it might be because the kick isn't coming through clearly enough against the bass. I'm going to guess you recorded the bass part first and then added the drums?
...Finally, I'd love to hear a version with a confident, unprocessed, leading vocal.
Sung by you.

I say 'if this was my track' though because these are all stylistic things and it's your vision to execute.

Thanks Drew! The usual order of things on this. Lyrics written first, drums picked out around those, and then midi keyboards (which included the left side wah'd synth bass), then bass guitar for the right side - which I recorded from the line out of my Ashdown Perfect 10 but compressed quite heavily for me, then the rhythm guitar - Strat, Boss Humaniser, Marshall JTM45, Bugera attenuated mic output to a desk channel. Then vocals - 2 mics, left side compressed a bit, right side through a megaphone emulator. Then given separate stereo tracks in ACID so that the clean side can be mangled with delay and then flanged with the delay disappearing off to the left - the megaphone then sits on top of the right side and has some of the delays of the left underneath it. It totally mangles the whole thing - but that's what I want, as we've discussed separately. I hear what you (and others actually, now) say - but I'm not there yet But I thank you for it, and maybe one day..
So its a mixture of outboard stuff on the way into recording, and plug ins in the box after capture. Hence some things I can't undo once they're in there - but we all know that when we use outboard kit, right?
You're bang on with the kick drum, it's getting lost. I might try just pushing that a bit on its own and see what happens. Nice thing is no one is going to sack me for any of it!

[jaminem]

Drums much better - less anonymous.
It does mean however that some of the off beat snares stick out a bit more, and a couple of them are dragging a little and could do with a nudge - use your ears NOT the grid here.

Agree with Drew, the bass line is a bit loud during the verses. I kinda like its level during the instrumental break in the middle tho.

As a compromise on the vocal perhaps you could try stick the effect on a send and then raising the effect level up and down - maybe less in the chorus? or just bring it up and places where it has impact or you want the effect to serve the song for emphasis or interest rather than all he way through?

Its pretty mental tho! If you going for strange you're definitely getting there!

[amanise]

V2
https://soundcloud.com/adrian-manise/my ... al_sharing

I'm late to the show. I think this would make a triffic instrumental. Also as an instrumental doesn't require any drums percussion.
There's sciencey techy shows this would be superb for as an instrumental theme tune without drums percussion.

That's actually pretty good advice - and thanks for listening! It would certainly be my quickest way out of it
Every time I play anything I've done to my wife she always says "Cop show! - they've just caught up with the bad guys, and are now going down the pub". I'm more likely to do this one, than de-mangle my vocals
Thanks again!

[amanise]

I'm totally gob smacked that nobody has picked me up for my wanton plagiarism of Shakespeare in the chorus lyrics! Wot, no outraged classics scholars out there?

[amanise]

Drums much better - less anonymous.
It does mean however that some of the off beat snares stick out a bit more, and a couple of them are dragging a little and could do with a nudge - use your ears NOT the grid here.

Agree with Drew, the bass line is a bit loud during the verses. I kinda like its level during the instrumental break in the middle tho.

As a compromise on the vocal perhaps you could try stick the effect on a send and then raising the effect level up and down - maybe less in the chorus? or just bring it up and places where it has impact or you want the effect to serve the song for emphasis or interest rather than all he way through?

Its pretty mental tho! If you going for strange you're definitely getting there!

Aha! Now you're talking! Thanks! I can do those with volume envelopes - but not the drummy thing. I'm no drummer - as you can tell - and a real drummer would kill me if they met me in the street. I think it'll have to stay as it is in terms of super snare accuracy. I know what you mean though - and thanks.

[Drew Stephenson]

I'm totally gob smacked that nobody has picked me up for my wanton plagiarism of Shakespeare in the chorus lyrics! Wot, no outraged classics scholars out there?

It's nothing he didn't do himself.

[amanise]

I'm totally gob smacked that nobody has picked me up for my wanton plagiarism of Shakespeare in the chorus lyrics! Wot, no outraged classics scholars out there?

Earl of Oxford from Burghley in Stamford is the latest suspected originator - so I've heard...

[amanise]

Right - thanks all, again. Having now walked the dogs and settled back down for the day.. It's list time again.

[RichardT]

I'm totally gob smacked that nobody has picked me up for my wanton plagiarism of Shakespeare in the chorus lyrics! Wot, no outraged classics scholars out there?

It's nothing he didn't do himself.

Kit Marlowe: Holla, ye pampered jades of Asia! What, can ye draw but twenty miles a day?

Shakespeare: pack-horses and hollow pampered jades of Asia, which cannot go but thirty miles ...

[amanise]

I'm totally gob smacked that nobody has picked me up for my wanton plagiarism of Shakespeare in the chorus lyrics! Wot, no outraged classics scholars out there?

It's nothing he didn't do himself.

Kit Marlowe: Holla, ye pampered jades of Asia! What, can ye draw but twenty miles a day?

Shakespeare: pack-horses and hollow pampered jades of Asia, which cannot go but thirty miles ...

[amanise]

Righto!! Defo Grammy's time this time!
I have now done;

Dropped the guitar bass down during the verses to give the kick and everything else a chance. Left it same level in instrumental section for jaminem.

Completely removed delay and flange effects from main Vox... On your own heads be it! Have that! Is all I can say! Just a little 'Famous Plate' reverb from Dear Reality. Cut the Telephone Voice track to key phrases for emphasis rather than 'on all the time'.

I'm afraid I haven't been able to super refine the snare hits for extra groove. It's all a one shot as opposed to grid samples now. I managed to get extra hits in alongside it for V2 - but I've hit the limits of my abilities with it now.

Many thanks once again! You're all amazing!
Adrian

[Martin Walker]

I'm late to this discussion, but I'd still like to add my praise for this track - it's SO quirky!

As I write this, I've listened to the version uploaded 2 hours ago, so I assume tht all the discussed tweaks are already in place.

The only thing I noticed on first listen through is that the vocals between 3:14 and 3:39 are way too quiet to make out.

Other than that I'm loving everything!

Martin

[amanise]

I'm late to this discussion, but I'd still like to add my praise for this track - it's SO quirky!

As I write this, I've listened to the version uploaded 2 hours ago, so I assume tht all the discussed tweaks are already in place.

The only thing I noticed on first listen through is that the vocals between 3:14 and 3:39 are way too quiet to make out.

Other than that I'm loving everything!

Martin

Hi Martin! Thanks very much! and I'm so pleased you enjoyed it! I shall certainly tweak up those third verse vocals - don't quite know what happened there. Thanks for spotting that one!
Adrian

[amanise]

Transient Shapers! Wot?? Amazing. Huge thanks to jaminem for the pointer. I have learnt soo much this weekend. I can now finally feel that this one has no more that I can do to it for benefit. Got a transient shaper - fiddled about - it came with a free tape saturation emulator - fiddled about. That's it now. We've all had enough of this one including me Onwards!!

Thanks again to everyone for your help.

[marklance]

Sorry late to the party - just want to say I started listening to the intro and I was like WTF is THIS but very intrigued to hear more then it just kicked in with that quirky Dawn of The Replicants and Beta Band vibe in the verses and choruses. I really like the 'get up if you...' panning in the speakers in particular. Very well done and keen to hear more of your other stuff. Is this DIY mastered by any chance? You might find the slight 'muffled' vibe is sorted by mastering -but I would also not want to lose the lo-fi feel too much.

Just started Kaleidoscope - definitely Dawn of The Replicants vibes - they are one of my favorite bands I expect an influence?

[amanise]

Sorry late to the party - just want to say I started listening to the intro and I was like WTF is THIS but very intrigued to hear more then it just kicked in with that quirky Dawn of The Replicants and Beta Band vibe in the verses and choruses. I really like the 'get up if you...' panning in the speakers in particular. Very well done and keen to hear more of your other stuff. Is this DIY mastered by any chance? You might find the slight 'muffled' vibe is sorted by mastering -but I would also not want to lose the lo-fi feel too much.

Just started Kaleidoscope - definitely Dawn of The Replicants vibes - they are one of my favorite bands I expect an influence?

Cool! Glad you liked it! I don't know the bands you mentioned - but I'll certainly check them out. Yes, DIY mastered - it is what it is. The key to it is the kick drum - which is where it all starts in the intro. 3 off beat kicks to the bar introduce the lilt which carries through to the verses - and then slightly different for the chorus - but essentially still on the off beat. The mid section goes more on the beat and doubles up - then back to the development again. I think that's why folks like Drew were so keen to have the kick out loud and proud in the mix. Hope you like Kaleidoscope - that one was fun! They were all fun!

[Arpangel]

Another late party goer.
This is great, I'd say one of the most interesting tracks I’ve heard here (thee most interesting?)
And "interesting" isn’t code for rubbish.
Keep calm and carry on.

[amanise]

Another late party goer.
This is great, I'd say one of the most interesting tracks I’ve heard here (thee most interesting?)
And "interesting" isn’t code for rubbish.
Keep calm and carry on.

Thanks buddy! High praise indeed!
Don't know about the keeping calm bit - freaking out's more my style

[Arpangel]

Another late party goer.
This is great, I'd say one of the most interesting tracks I’ve heard here (thee most interesting?)
And "interesting" isn’t code for rubbish.
Keep calm and carry on.

Thanks buddy! High praise indeed!
Don't know about the keeping calm bit - freaking out's more my style

Know what you mean, but I’m finding it easy to do music now, as our damp basement is the coolest place in the house!

[amanise]

Another late party goer.
This is great, I'd say one of the most interesting tracks I’ve heard here (thee most interesting?)
And "interesting" isn’t code for rubbish.
Keep calm and carry on.

Thanks buddy! High praise indeed!
Don't know about the keeping calm bit - freaking out's more my style

Know what you mean, but I’m finding it easy to do music now, as our damp basement is the coolest place in the house!

You'd better get that Christmas No1 written and recorded then - while you still can!

[Arpangel]

Another late party goer.
This is great, I'd say one of the most interesting tracks I’ve heard here (thee most interesting?)
And "interesting" isn’t code for rubbish.
Keep calm and carry on.

Thanks buddy! High praise indeed!
Don't know about the keeping calm bit - freaking out's more my style

Know what you mean, but I’m finding it easy to do music now, as our damp basement is the coolest place in the house!

You'd better get that Christmas No1 written and recorded then - while you still can!

You’ve managed to include two of my most hated things in one sentence, well done!

[amanise]

Another late party goer.
This is great, I'd say one of the most interesting tracks I’ve heard here (thee most interesting?)
And "interesting" isn’t code for rubbish.
Keep calm and carry on.

Thanks buddy! High praise indeed!
Don't know about the keeping calm bit - freaking out's more my style

Know what you mean, but I’m finding it easy to do music now, as our damp basement is the coolest place in the house!

You'd better get that Christmas No1 written and recorded then - while you still can!

You’ve managed to include two of my most hated things in one sentence, well done!